General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2023)

[Buster]

It's going to take a pretty big turn for the rest of the season for the Moreno trade to not look like total ass.

[Spanky99]

It's going to take a pretty big turn for the rest of the season for the Moreno trade to not look like total ass.

 

To get to steamers pre-season projection, nah, it's only May 19th. Moreno's ass.

[Olerud363]

Orioles - we have the best hitting prospect of all time and he can play short stop and is only 19

Blue Jays - we have a guy getting on base in Buffalo, he's 24 and has a great swing (no power), and one poster on the board said he has a 3% chance of being Lyle Overbay

 

Orioles - We developed an elite bullpen out of scraps

Jays - We traded our silver slugger outfielder for our best reliever who is as good as your 7th best, and we got this guy Pop coming off the DL hopefully soon.

 

Orioles - Our patient young all star catcher is fit as a fiddle, and is putting up a .430 on base percentage, and will give 650 PAs from the second spot leading the league in times on base.

Jays - Our patient young all star catcher has an obesity issue so we limit him to playing 4 times a week, he will give us 400 PAs from the seventh spot.

 

Orioles - Our random outfielders that developed nicely (Hayes, Mullins, Santander) are hitting .290 .350 .490 as a group.

Jays - We traded our best prospect and another outfielder for a guy who is hitting like .220 .290 .350, and our other guy we signed for 150 million looks like he's aged to be a .220 .290 .350 hitter too.

[Laika]

Things are pretty grim, to be honest

 

Division might be too good

[Eat My Shatkins]

Ugh the Orioles do really look set up or the future don't they? Lots of money to spend still too.

[Olerud363]

Things are pretty grim, to be honest

 

Division might be too good

 

The game last night increased my worries about the short and long term future a lot.

 

The announcers announced that Rutchman is leading the league in times on base. I had no idea. How can a catcher lead the league in times on base? How could they get enough PAs? I guess by hitting 2nd, playing catcher 75% of the time, and DHing the other 25%.

 

So I guess the Orioles don't need to carry a second full time catcher because their full time catcher can catch 120 games, and they don't need to waste 8 million on Brandon Belt because their full time catcher hits like 28 year old Belt, and can DH 40 games, and they can fill in the other DH games with 1/2 rest days, and finding time for their other 20 MLB ready prospects.

[Olerud363]

The game last night increased my worries about the short and long term future a lot.

 

The announcers announced that Rutchman is leading the league in times on base. I had no idea. How can a catcher lead the league in times on base? How could they get enough PAs? I guess by hitting 2nd, playing catcher 75% of the time, and DHing the other 25%.

 

So I guess the Orioles don't need to carry a second full time catcher because their full time catcher can catch 120 games, and they don't need to waste 8 million on Brandon Belt because their full time catcher hits like 28 year old Belt, and can DH 40 games, and they can fill in the other DH games with 1/2 rest days, and finding time for their other 20 MLB ready prospects.

 

 

If the Orioles don't have to waste 9 million on a part time DH, a few million on a second full time catcher, 20-25 million on the Jose Berrios and George Springers of the world I wonder what they will be wasting that 50 million a year on ? There are a couple of left handed hitting sluggers (one can also pitch a bit), perfect for their park, coming on the market in the next 2 years.

 

Even if they don't make an Ohtani, Soto level splash (which they should if they can convince the player come, and the 95+ wins they'll get this year will help) they will still have completely clear payroll heading into the next two or 3 free agent seasons.

[jaysblue]

Orioles need some elite arms in their rotation and they become one of the best teams in the MLB.

 

I've found most games against teams above .500, they're underdogs in Vegas because of their starting pitching. Even today against the Jays, they're considered underdogs, paying 2.15 and that's with Manoah pitching for the Jays. Crazy!

[Solaxys]

I feel like Atkins wanted a sustainable contender but he didn't build a sustainable contender for this division.

 

We are in a win-now mode money AND talent wise, but Orioles and Rays are having legendary starts, Yankees have +70M payroll who beat us with two (three?) ace-caliber pitchers on DL and Sox assembled a battalion of lefty mashers

 

Bo leaves, we put up Lopez (who is struggling)

Chapman leaves, we put up Barger (who is struggling) or Martinez (who has a LOT of work to do)

 

We probably won't sign KK again unless team-friendly, so we probably use Varsho at CF because there's no one internally who can fill that or we buy (who even is in the CF pool next year short of the Korean superstar that we won't sign due to our budget already at peak). Who takes LF? Unless they move Horwitz full time to LF and get him the defensive reps, we (again) have no one internally to fill that.

Schneider refusing to give Lukes ABs up here (with struggling Biggio) also shows how much they think of him when even f***in Zimmer got ABs.

 

Springer/Kirk/2B are all huge question marks if they'll keep it up for the rest of their contracts. Jansen hits FA in 2 yrs or something.

 

Manoah maybe bounces back, maybe doesn't (can be the Halladay arc or can be the Ricky Romero arc, who knows).

Bassitt/Kikuchi won't be re-signed (at least I hope not)

 

We have no true bullpen prospects to speak off (that Os/Rays seem to have oodles of) and outside of Ricky, no starting pitching prospects to feel confident about either. There's a lot of development to be done and there are some interesting dudes in the minors but no one who can step up right now or in the near future. Think Taj Bradley for Rays.

 

---

 

At the end of the day, having a bad offensive lull part of the season isn't a big deal, but it is a big deal when you are getting buried in a divisional race and all of your chips are in.

 

This year and maybe next year with some good moves/signings are it. After that, s*** will hit the fan as things are going to be a giant mess with no internal talent to reliably replace the holes we'll have and unless Rogers trusts Atkins (which I doubt they will if this year and next year don't go well), we won't have the budget to keep our/get good players either.

Edited May 20, 2023 by Solaxys

[connorp]

Ugh the Orioles do really look set up or the future don't they? Lots of money to spend still too.

 

Unless they get spoiled like Tampa and say we’re probably good enough to make it to the post-season and not spend

[Solaxys]

Orioles need some elite arms in their rotation and they become one of the best teams in the MLB.

 

I've found most games against teams above .500, they're underdogs in Vegas because of their starting pitching. Even today against the Jays, they're considered underdogs, paying 2.15 and that's with Manoah pitching for the Jays. Crazy!

 

They can trade for Ohtani and Eduardo Rodriguez right now (while only mildly denting their farm) if they wanted to and become WS favorites (making it, not necessarily winning it), that's not even a joke.

[glory]

Things are pretty grim, to be honest

 

Division might be too good

 

Yeah the negativity about this team shouldn’t be about the quality of the 2023 team but the division they play in. Hell, it wasn’t even 2 seasons ago that the Jays won 91 games and missed the playoffs. It’s not out of the realm of possibility to happen in 2023 as well. The long term outlook for the team is a bit more worrisome to me when I look at a team like Baltimore and how they are set up, not to mention the Rays who are always good, and the Yankees who haven’t finished below .500 in like 30 years. This division forces excellence so the bar has to be set higher.

[Stangstag]

Yeah the negativity about this team shouldn’t be about the quality of the 2023 team but the division they play in. Hell, it wasn’t even 2 seasons ago that the Jays won 91 games and missed the playoffs. It’s not out of the realm of possibility to happen in 2023 as well. The long term outlook for the team is a bit more worrisome to me when I look at a team like Baltimore and how they are set up, not to mention the Rays who are always good, and the Yankees who haven’t finished below .500 in like 30 years. This division forces excellence so the bar has to be set higher.

 

Im pretty certain the Jays will take a wildcard spot, and there’s a high possibility they will be facing one of Baltimore/Tampa/Yankees in that wildcard round.

 

That will be the real test, to see if we can beat those guys in a short series when it actually matters.

[G-Snarls]

What's our record in the division now?

 

Must be atrocious

[max silver]

What's our record in the division now?

 

Must be atrocious

 

Yeah it has to have been awful to say the least. They've largely been embarrassed so far by everybody in the AL East save for the Rays.

[Olerud363]

What's our record in the division now?

 

Must be atrocious

 

Rays 2-1 (2-1)

Yankees 2-1 (4-2) (happiness maybe Jays are good)

Red Sox (0-4) (4-6) (f***!)

Yankees 1-3 (5-9) (f***!)

Orioles 0-1 (5-10)

 

Missing anything?

[Terminator]

Rays 2-1 (2-1)

Yankees 2-1 (4-2) (happiness maybe Jays are good)

Red Sox (0-4) (4-6) (f***!)

Yankees 1-3 (5-9) (f***!)

Orioles 0-1 (5-10)

 

Missing anything?

 

What the hell are these numbers?

[John_Havok]

What the hell are these numbers?

 

Individual and (cumulative) w/l record against the AL East teams by the jays

[Laika]

Emasculating loss.

 

It's over, guys.

 

Who should we trade?

[Funky]

John Schneider

[Solaxys]

If we are retooling, and I don't think we are, but IF we are...

 

Coaching Staff (Except Mattingly, dude has too much insight and the bullpen pitching coach that helped fix Kikuchi), and all the freaking egos (Bo, Manoah).

Throw in Atkins too, 'cause trading Moreno was a stupid idea (not because we got Varsho in return, but in general).

[Olerud363]

Rays 2-1 (2-1)

Yankees 2-1 (4-2) (happiness maybe Jays are good)

Red Sox (0-4) (4-6) (f***!)

Yankees 1-3 (5-9) (f***!)

Orioles 0-1 (5-10)

 

Missing anything?

 

Updated with today's wonderful effort against the Orioles.

 

Rays 2-1 (2-1)

Yankees 2-1 (4-2) (happiness maybe Jays are good)

Red Sox (0-4) (4-6) (f***!)

Yankees 1-3 (5-9) (f***!)

Orioles 0-2 (5-11)

[L54]

Gausman would bring back a haul

[Solaxys]

Gausman would bring back a haul

 

Gausman back to Orioles to get one of their IF prospects or OF prospects. Boom, best story.

[L54]

Gausman back to Orioles to get one of their IF prospects or OF prospects. Boom, best story.

 

You could get a couple of them back at least. 3/66M for Gausman is an incredible contract

 

But it’s not happening

[glory]

James Click rubbing his hands together seeing how things are unfolding right now.

[Olerud363]

Emasculating loss.

 

It's over, guys.

 

Who should we trade?

 

They should trade everyone, fire everyone and bring the ballpark renovations to the next level next year play in exhibition stadium or Buffalo and punt a season or two.

 

I guess it starts with firing everyone too so they can make good Vlad/Bo trades with 2.5 years left. Send Varsho and Kirk and Manoah down as not to waste anymore of their f***ing service time until they figure things out. Keep them down until you get an extra year of all 3.

 

Get the ownership on board to tank for 3 years but come back like the Orioles in 2026. 2024 and 2025 are Dark but played in Buffalo.

 

Get talent any single way you can of, draft, Japan, Korea, Netherlands, China, add an extra minor team (if that is allowed anymore). Get people who know what the f*** they are doing to run the pitching lab and the hitting lab.

[Terminator]

So we've got one more game against the Orioles tomorrow and then it's a 4 game set at the Trop lol

 

[bronson44]

So we've got one more game against the Orioles tomorrow and then it's a 4 game set at the Trop lol

 

 

Our schedule sucks for the next while. After Tampa it's Twins, Brewers, Mets, Astros, Twins, Orioles, Rangers. It doesn't really get soft until after that for a bit of a stretch. Just have to hold our head above water until then and not fall too far behind. Not blowing winnable games like today would help.

[Jays333]

Wow this team is getting embarrassed against our division rivals. Just not on the same level it seems.

 

Manoah is one of the worst starting pitchers in the AL right now and he is still talking s*** to the other team. Good start today though nice to see.

 

Our manager Schneider doesn't even know the rules about mound visits.

 

Cant hit worth s*** with RISP.

 

Bullpen cant hold together 3 or 4 innings for the life of them.

 

Top 5 prospect for Varsho trade currently looks like we got absolutely fleeced, I dont care how much better of a corner outfielder he is than Teo and LGJ

 

Orioles, Rays and Yanks all will be good for awhile and this seems like our window before it all crashes down and we are outclassed.

 

I know its a long season and this is a big down in a series of ups and downs, but it seems like we are the 4th best team in AL East.

Edited May 21, 2023 by Jays333