Gómez: Toronto Blue Jays Have Offers Out to Pete Alonso, Alex Bregman

[Brownie19]

26 minutes ago, Jays24 said:

For me, the ceiling of the team being a World Series contender is dependent upon adding another massive bat.  We can still be a contender for a low wild card spot but the excitement level would be different for that.  Especially since we're heavily rumored on Alonso and I've already gotten my heart set on seeing him or Bregman here lol

I'm just saying you can add another big bat during the season via trade.  We may also be surprised by an unexpected breakout season.  There is always a chance someone like Orelvis, Wagner, Barger or Rodon breakout and provide that offensive punch we need to be a true contender.

[Jays24]

2 hours ago, Brownie19 said:

I'm just saying you can add another big bat during the season via trade.  We may also be surprised by an unexpected breakout season.  There is always a chance someone like Orelvis, Wagner, Barger or Rodon breakout and provide that offensive punch we need to be a true contender.

Ya I'd rather not rely on anyone becoming a major offensive contributor and take that more of a random surprise approach instead.  Let's see, no point in going back on forth on hypotheticals when we should get a real response very soon.  It'll all start and end with the Vlad extension tbh.  

[Brownie19]

50 minutes ago, Jays24 said:

Ya I'd rather not rely on anyone becoming a major offensive contributor and take that more of a random surprise instead.  Let's see, no point in going back on forth on hypotheticals when we should get a real response very soon.  It'll all start and end with the Vlad extension tbh.  

I hear you - adding another bat now would be preferred. I'm just saying that if it doesn't happen, it's not catastrophic or a massive failure.  We still have a good team and lots will change as the season unfolds.

[jaysblue]

4 hours ago, max silver said:

This season featured a much better overall crop of hitters compared to the 2023/2024 offseason. Bassitt himself mentioned how there really wasn't a very effective pivot once you moved past Ohtani. The next best options were guys like Teoscar, Chapman, Bellinger and not much else. This crop was much deeper and after Soto and presented a lot more options for team building in free agency.

So in essence you're saying the Jays only option to add was through free agency and spending money? Hmmm. How about trades? 

[jaysblue]

4 hours ago, Laika said:

Very harsh. Bassit is a solid league average kitchen sink arm. 

However, I do agree that people tend to overvalue his statements/opinions. Not sure why. The perception that he is smart because he is a crafty pitcher? 

Is he actually smart? I dunno. Maybe. 

Wasn't Miguel Batista a poet? 

[Jays24]

1 hour ago, Brownie19 said:

I hear you - adding another bat now would be preferred. I'm just saying that if it doesn't happen, it's not catastrophic or a massive failure.  We still have a good team and lots will change as the season unfolds.

For sure... I understand every team can't plug every hole other than the Dodgers.  We've plugged about 90% of them and now just getting greedy wanting it all lol.

[max silver]

1 hour ago, jaysblue said:

So in essence you're saying the Jays only option to add was through free agency and spending money? Hmmm. How about trades? 

I'm not so sure I said anything of the sort. Having said that the team didn't really have the necessary trade capital at the time of the Soto trade to outbid the Yankees, which essentially left free agency as the primary remaining means to improve the club. Fast forward a season later and I think the team is in a much better spot in terms of available trade pieces, but I don't have a feel for who is actually available at a price that the team is able/willing to meet.

[Pendleton]

 

[Jimcanuck]

1 hour ago, Pendleton said:

 

Hmm and it's been reported the Cards and Bosox are talking Arenado

Bregman to Yankees, Blue Jays, or ...

[G-Snarls]

5 minutes ago, Jimcanuck said:

Hmm and it's been reported the Cards and Bosox are talking Arenado

Bregman to Yankees, Blue Jays, or ...

Tigers 

[Spanky99]

15 minutes ago, Jimcanuck said:

Hmm and it's been reported the Cards and Bosox are talking Arenado

Bregman to Yankees, Blue Jays, or ...

Tigers.

[Nexii]

PECOTA projections out

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/standings/

742 RS, 700 RA

Other top teams all have better pitching. Arizona being the exception. I feel like they could perhaps get more value upgrading the bullpen at this point

[Jays24]

4 minutes ago, Nexii said:

PECOTA projections out

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/standings/

742 RS, 700 RA

Other top teams all have better pitching. Arizona being the exception. I feel like they could perhaps get more value upgrading the bullpen at this point

Just wait until we get Alonso/Bregman, we'll become the best team in the AL lol

[Spanky99]

12 minutes ago, Nexii said:

PECOTA projections out

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/standings/

742 RS, 700 RA

Other top teams all have better pitching. Arizona being the exception. I feel like they could perhaps get more value upgrading the bullpen at this point

Projections are conservative for a reason, if they don't find a bat, RP could be a pivot, yet, I doubt it.

[saskjayfan]

8 hours ago, Nexii said:

PECOTA projections out

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/standings/

742 RS, 700 RA

Other top teams all have better pitching. Arizona being the exception. I feel like they could perhaps get more value upgrading the bullpen at this point

Rodriguez has good stuff.  It was usually the 2nd or third time through the order that got him. I think dropping a pitch and elevated his other pitches will make him a really good reliever.  Green, Hoffman, Garcia, Rodriguez. I'd roll with that and look to add a leverage reliever at the deadline if we're in a playoff position. 

[Laika]

9 hours ago, Nexii said:

PECOTA projections out

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/standings/

742 RS, 700 RA

Other top teams all have better pitching. Arizona being the exception. I feel like they could perhaps get more value upgrading the bullpen at this point

Yeah I had this thought the other day when looking at the projected WAR on the Fangraphs DC.

Alonso $25M AAV is like a 1.5 WAR upgrade. Maybe not even that. Bregman for the same AAV but more guaranteed years is maybe a 2 WAR upgrade. 

For $25M they could maybe sign David Robertson + Kenley Jansen + Andrew Chafin. It's a ridiculous example but it might be financially possible. Or just the first two and have a bit of money left over. And it would just be a 1 year outlay, so no long term contract risk at all. 

[max silver]

3 hours ago, saskjayfan said:

Rodriguez has good stuff.  It was usually the 2nd or third time through the order that got him. I think dropping a pitch and elevated his other pitches will make him a really good reliever.  Green, Hoffman, Garcia, Rodriguez. I'd roll with that and look to add a leverage reliever at the deadline if we're in a playoff position. 

I believe Rodriguez's primary issues stemmed from poor command. I think he would tend to get himself into trouble when he wasn't able to locate his pitches in the strike zone. I had a peak at his splits and his numbers second time through the order were better than the first time through the order, with a lower walk rate second time through the order standing out. I surmise this was due to him only pitching through the order a second time on days where he could reliably command his pitches. His numbers third time through the order are pretty ugly, but this is a situation that rarely occurred.

[Governator]

13 hours ago, Jays24 said:

Just wait until we get Alonso/Bregman, we'll become the best team in the AL lol

Man you seem to have such high expectations and setting yourself up for disappointment. Don't get me wrong, we've had a good off season but a lot has to go right for this team to be a great team, let alone the best team in the AL over another signing.

 

 

[Jays24]

4 hours ago, Governator said:

Man you seem to have such high expectations and setting yourself up for disappointment. Don't get me wrong, we've had a good off season but a lot has to go right for this team to be a great team, let alone the best team in the AL over another signing.

2B Bo

1B Vlad

DH Alonso

LF Santandar

RF Springer

CF Varsho

C Kirk

3B Clement

SS Gimenez 

This lineup with our pitching staff, defense and an improved bullpen is one of the best teams in the AL no doubt imo.  The floor of this team is a WC5/6 contender while the ceiling is the World Series contender getting swept by the Dodgers lol.

[Blue balls]

9 hours ago, Laika said:

Yeah I had this thought the other day when looking at the projected WAR on the Fangraphs DC.

Alonso $25M AAV is like a 1.5 WAR upgrade. Maybe not even that. Bregman for the same AAV but more guaranteed years is maybe a 2 WAR upgrade. 

For $25M they could maybe sign David Robertson + Kenley Jansen + Andrew Chafin. It's a ridiculous example but it might be financially possible. Or just the first two and have a bit of money left over. And it would just be a 1 year outlay, so no long term contract risk at all. 

I also think there is better options than Alonso to improve the roster. Could be Bregman or a trade. Could be RP + better back up catcher and keep money for the trade deadline for missing pieces.
 

If one of Guerrero, Bichette or Santander were to be injured early in the season you would be really happy to have Alonso in the lineup despite his $25M though.

[saskjayfan]

On 2/4/2025 at 8:12 PM, Jimcanuck said:

Hmm and it's been reported the Cards and Bosox are talking Arenado

Bregman to Yankees, Blue Jays, or ...

I don't see us getting bregman.  Either swing a big trade, not sure who that would be for, or sign JD Martinez. You don't have to commit to 162 games of JD at DH.  120ish.  1 for 7.  He's a great bat to have on the bench for the games he's not in the lineup.  

[Eat My Shatkins]

Trading for Robert would be nice as long as the cost isn't ridiculous. He had a really bad year. His projections are pretty decent though.

 

It'd be nice to get him and then DH Santander most of the time when Varsho returns. 

[mphenhef]

On 2/4/2025 at 1:09 PM, Laika said:

Very harsh. Bassit is a solid league average kitchen sink arm. 

However, I do agree that people tend to overvalue his statements/opinions. Not sure why. The perception that he is smart because he is a crafty pitcher? 

Is he actually smart? I dunno. Maybe. 

The fact he hangs around with the gate 12 guys makes me question his intelligence.

[Brownie19]

16 minutes ago, Eat My Shatkins said:

Trading for Robert would be nice as long as the cost isn't ridiculous. He had a really bad year. His projections are pretty decent though.

 

It'd be nice to get him and then DH Santander most of the time when Varsho returns. 

Yeah - I still like this option (even if I don't like weakening the farm system).  I expect Bregman to sign in Detroit or back in Houston still.  I don't think he comes to Toronto.  I could see us add a DH type like JDM, or just go into the season with what we have and see what guys like Orelvis/Barger/Roden/etc. can give us as a starter.

Not ideal, but not catastrophic either.  

[Orgfiller]

31 minutes ago, Eat My Shatkins said:

Trading for Robert would be nice as long as the cost isn't ridiculous. He had a really bad year. His projections are pretty decent though.

 

It'd be nice to get him and then DH Santander most of the time when Varsho returns. 

The only issue here is I could see the White Sox not wanting to move him until he rebuilds his value. Should go without saying that moving a guy not following his 5 WAR season but after the disastrous one that came after would make them look like even more of a laughingstock than they already are.

They're probably waiting until at least the first 2 months of the season to see if he shows a pulse before selling on a high again. Of course there's risk to that, Robert's skills could have declined as a result of numerous injuries, or he could yet again get injured early in the year to deplete his trade value even more.

With all of that said, the conversation you would think starts at one of our top 3 prospects. Otherwise they have no reason to deal him.

[BTS]

I don't understand why people think Robert would be cheap. He's the kind of high-variance talent that contending teams drool over, and he's controllable for 3 more seasons on very reasonable team options. There would be no shortage of interested teams and Toronto's farm system is ass. 

[Laika]

12 minutes ago, Orgfiller said:

The only issue here is I could see the White Sox not wanting to move him until he rebuilds his value. Should go without saying that moving a guy not following his 5 WAR season but after the disastrous one that came after would make them look like even more of a laughingstock than they already are.

They're probably waiting until at least the first 2 months of the season to see if he shows a pulse before selling on a high again. Of course there's risk to that, Robert's skills could have declined as a result of numerous injuries, or he could yet again get injured early in the year to deplete his trade value even more.

With all of that said, the conversation you would think starts at one of our top 3 prospects. Otherwise they have no reason to deal him.

I would pay for him. The chance that Toronto gets basically nothing from Ricky Teidemann if they hold him is annoyingly high. Like, RT probably has a 40% chance of providing zilch and then a 20% chance of being a star. One of those prospects. 

Robert... 

$15M 2025 - age 27
$20M 2026 team option - age 28
$20M 2027 team option - age 29 

2025 projections range from 2.4 (The Bat X) to 4.1 (OOPSY) WAR

His playing time might be overprojected by everything other than ZiPS though, which says 489 PA and 2.7 WAR. 

You are getting a guy with clear All Star upside, who contributes on both sides of the ball, controllable at a reasonable cost for 3 years. Takes the pressure off in terms of trying to extend Bichette since Robert is basically the same asset/player just with more control. 

I am sure it would take RT+ though... 

[L54]

1 hour ago, mphenhef said:

The fact he hangs around with the gate 12 guys makes me question his intelligence.

Are you finished crying about Pete Alonso? 

 

[L54]

1 hour ago, BTS said:

I don't understand why people think Robert would be cheap. He's the kind of high-variance talent that contending teams drool over, and he's controllable for 3 more seasons on very reasonable team options. There would be no shortage of interested teams and Toronto's farm system is ass. 

Don’t get it either. There is no chance you’re going to pull the wool over the eyes of the White Sox and get him for “cheap”

that said I would absolutely move Tiedemann for him. Probably anybody not named Arjun truthfully 

[glory]

Robert is 27 with 3 more years of reasonable control. Only issue is the floor is low with the high ceiling, so you don’t really know what you’re going to get. I’d have no issues moving Tiedemann for him. Of course it’s unclear what the White Sox would actually ask for. As mentioned, only prospect I’d miss if traded is Nimmala. Everyone else is fair game.