The Ship is Sinking

[connorp]

Fans at the dome don't really boo when they should. What they do is just not go to games if the product stinks. We could be back to 20k per game in a hurry. It's just the way it is in this town (the leafs are an exception because the suffering is part of fandom). If that happens, Shapiro might be gone.

 

Well, at least it’ll only be a couple years until the next Bo/Vlad tandem come up and reenergize the fan base..oh wait…

[tazsub3]

Well, at least it’ll only be a couple years until the next Bo/Vlad tandem come up and reenergize the fan base..oh wait…

 

not their fault hahahaha was AA that emptied the cupboard......like he did in atlanta i guess.

[tazsub3]

Another week, another week with shatkins still here. See you again next week dear friends.

[Masterbather]

One way ticket to the Titanic. Cue Celine.

[mikepelfrey]

The jays killed pro sports daily, and they re well on their way to killing this place too. Shapiro, if he gets his wish and becomes Commissioner, it’s even money that he’ll kill baseball too. The man is a walking plague. but as long as MLS&E sells tickets what do they care.

 

Don’t cue Celine, she’s a national treasure, and she has enough health issues already. For all we know Shapiro might have something to do with that too.

[Olerud363]

Well, at least itÂ’ll only be a couple years until the next Bo/Vlad tandem come up and reenergize the fan base..oh waitÂ…

 

People have been comparing this year to 2017. In 2017 Bo and Vlad were hitting a combined .340 in Lansing and Dunnedin. That put them 2 years away. Jansen was 1 year away. Hernandez appeared that year.

 

Nimmala and Bonilla are now both in FCL hitting a combined .200 though Bonilla is now up to 5-27 bb-k or so... but the two, even if destined to make it, are much farther away then Bo/Vlad were in 2017.

 

Essentially there was only 1 year without hope (2018). 2017 was like this year. 2019 the new generation had arrived, 2020 winning record.

 

Spencer Horwitz will be here soon though

[Jays24]

Funny thing is that Vlad was a gift from AA before he left and aside from Bo, which is very arguable these days, they haven't been able to develop a single position player better than him during their near decade long tenure. Shoot these clowns to the moon already.

[Eat My Shatkins]

Vlad was a gift?

 

Some gift.

 

Here is an overweight 1-3 WAR first baseman that pounds the ball into the ground and has a peanut brain.

 

Thanks for the gift AA

 

Next time how about a pair of socks instead

[Jays333]

It dont really matter what was left over from AA at this point. Its been 8 and half years since Atkins has taken over. Not including 2016 which was largely the team AA built we have 0 division titles, 0 playoff wins, the highest payroll the Bluejays have ever had, a bottom 5 farm system, a bottom 5 offense and a below .500 record at the start of June with basically every metric saying we are actually a worse club then our record indicates. Its s***, the situation is s***. The management has been s***. If not for the playoffs expanding significantly in the last few years we wouldn't have even made it to the wildcard round one time. Lets just face the facts, Atkins has been f***ing terrible.

[mphenhef]

not their fault hahahaha was AA that emptied the cupboard......like he did in atlanta i guess.

 

It's truly amazing that after 9 years AA still has more relief pitchers he drafted on the roster than Atkins does. So far in the 2024 season for the Jays, guys AA drafted or signed in international period have 2.0 bWAR/2.2 fWAR. Atkins players have 0.7 bWAR/2.3 fWAR .

[mphenhef]

Funny thing is that Vlad was a gift from AA before he left and aside from Bo, which is very arguable these days, they haven't been able to develop a single position player better than him during their near decade long tenure. Shoot these clowns to the moon already.

 

If the reports are to be believed, AA's team had to fight the new regime quite hard to draft Bo too. I do wonder what Vlad would have turned into on a team that had better development ability.

[Stangstag]

Vlad was a gift?

 

Some gift.

 

Here is an overweight 1-3 WAR first baseman that pounds the ball into the ground and has a peanut brain.

 

Thanks for the gift AA

 

Next time how about a pair of socks instead

 

He was the consensus #1 prospect

[Orgfiller]

It's truly amazing that after 9 years AA still has more relief pitchers he drafted on the roster than Atkins does. So far in the 2024 season for the Jays, guys AA drafted or signed in international period have 2.0 bWAR/2.2 fWAR. Atkins players have 0.7 bWAR/2.3 fWAR .

 

This doesn't disprove the point or anything, but I think it's in bad faith to not include Varsho in this exercise, who was traded for using international guys that were signed by the team (Gurriel and Moreno) in order to get his years of cheap team control. Yes, there is otherwise a serious lack of homegrown talent, but trading said homegrown talent for young controllable players shouldn't go against them.

[Eat My Shatkins]

He was the consensus #1 prospect

 

Haha, who cares?

 

A lot of good that does for us now.

 

We used to have 7 top 100 prospects too.

 

Whoopty-doo

 

They all suck now

[mphenhef]

This doesn't disprove the point or anything, but I think it's in bad faith to not include Varsho in this exercise, who was traded for using international guys that were signed by the team (Gurriel and Moreno) in order to get his years of cheap team control. Yes, there is otherwise a serious lack of homegrown talent, but trading said homegrown talent for young controllable players shouldn't go against them.

 

Very true here and they haven't been terrible on the position player side of things (arguably better than many regimes before them, but I do wonder what Vlad would have become under a better development team). Their record on pitchers is truly horrendous though.

[mphenhef]

Haha, who cares?

 

A lot of good that does for us now.

 

We used to have 7 top 100 prospects too.

 

Whoopty-doo

 

They all suck now

 

It makes you question their ability to develop talent to get it to the next level.

[Jays24]

Vlad was a gift?

 

Some gift.

 

Here is an overweight 1-3 WAR first baseman that pounds the ball into the ground and has a peanut brain.

 

Thanks for the gift AA

 

Next time how about a pair of socks instead

 

How many gifts has this front office developed in almost a decade of being here? Beggers shouldn't be choosers lol

[BigCecil]

Edwin walks off the O’s in ‘16 playoffs with an older team AA built. Shapiro then complains about the cupboard being bare.

 

Fast forward to 2024. The cupboard is bare, and we have an old, luxury tax team getting abused by a cheap team of young studs in a stadium with a fleeting new car smell. The '17 promised waves of impact talent petered out in the Bermuda Triangle and didn’t make shore.

 

Ross was overheard saying to some reporters “Some really impressive deep counts tonight against Burnsy. If we played CWS & PIT all the time, my analysts tell me we would have only 6 less wins than the Yankees. We are encouraged with the trend for the rest of 2024. Have you guys tried the new Chungchun rice dogs at the RC?”

[glory]

One thing I remember about 2015, that rings more true today, is Cleveland fans on social media celebrating Shapiro leaving. I didn't understand it at the time, but boy does it make sense now.

[DigitalRock]

Its not really agony anymore, I pretty much expect them to lose every game unless they’re leading like 5-0 or something.

 

I’ve made peace with the fact that this is likely a lost season.

 

Yep this is where I am. I love baseball so I still watch but I know it’s a lost season already. No point wasting energy . That’s for the Oilers lol

[tazsub3]

Yep this is where I am. I love baseball so I still watch but I know it’s a lost season already. No point wasting energy . That’s for the Oilers lol

 

some nba and nhl team fans accept the tank for generational talent. We will accept this tank in return of getting rid of shatkins.

[G-Snarls]

The rebuild will be easy to justify

[Cynical]

At this stage the only hope is Atkins leaving on his own, realizing how embarrassingly bad he has been. Shapiro isn't going to fire him and the ownership isn't going to let go of Shapiro in the middle of some major renovations.

[Spanky99]

At this stage the only hope is Atkins leaving on his own, realizing how embarrassingly bad he has been. Shapiro isn't going to fire him and the ownership isn't going to let go of Shapiro in the middle of some major renovations.

 

You think Shapiro won't fire Atkins if they don't make the PS? His ass is grass, dude.

[G-Snarls]

Yeah most seem to have felt that Shapiro and Atkins are inseparable. To the point we call them Shatkins. But I no longer think they are at all.

 

They arrived together. But I'm pretty sure one leaves long before the other.

[Ray]

Blue Jays receive: Connor Norby + some Rk ball 40 FV SP Prospect

 

Orioles receive: Yusei Kikuchi + Yimi Garcia + Cash

[Joltin Joe]

At some point major moves need to be made

[BigCecil]

Waves of impact talent from making solid good picks that hit (and "tanking"):

 

Since Spring 2022 O's position players called up producing 10 WAR in 2024:

 

Rutschman

Henderson

Westburg

Cowser

Kjerstand

Stowers

Holliday (much more to come)

Norby

[glory]

Waves of impact talent from making solid good picks that hit (and "tanking"):

 

Since Spring 2022 O's position players called up producing 10 WAR in 2024:

 

Rutschman

Henderson

Westburg

Cowser

Kjerstand

Stowers

Holliday (much more to come)

Norby

 

I think what’s more frustrating is that they are playing Vlad at 3B now, which opens up 1B and DH, but that configuration is being done so that 150 year old Turner and Vogelbach can be in the lineup at the same time. The Orioles manipulate lineups and positions to play actual prospects, while the Jays do it for guys who will be retired or sign a MiLB deal after this season. Horowitz, Barger, and Martinez are not on the level of the O’s prospects, but playing them over 0-1 WAR talent seems like kind of a no brainer for a club that wants “waves of prospects”.

[Brownie19]

I think what’s more frustrating is that they are playing Vlad at 3B now, which opens up 1B and DH, but that configuration is being done so that 150 year old Turner and Vogelbach can be in the lineup at the same time. The Orioles manipulate lineups and positions to play actual prospects, while the Jays do it for guys who will be retired or sign a MiLB deal after this season. Horowitz, Barger, and Martinez are not on the level of the O’s prospects, but playing them over 0-1 WAR talent seems like kind of a no brainer for a club that wants “waves of prospects”.

 

The Jays have done this for like 3 games man. Perhaps they want to see how Vlad looks at 3rd before they call up Horwitz?

 

Don't forget the O's created playing time for Ryan O'Hearn, who's like 30 and was a career minor leaguer.