mikepelfrey

Spanky 99 obviously you don’t like being exposed for who and what you are, do you? Well don’t worry there are more of us who believe in free speech than there are of you. And they aren’t going anywhere. If you want ban me….all it wil do is prove even further who and what you are. My life doesn’t revolve around your tiny little fiefdom. Never has. As I’ve said before wolves fight in packs, a lion fights alone, the whole board knows you’re a wolf, you and BTS, can pretend you run your tiny fiefdom all you like, the rest of us know better and Don’t Care.

Seems to me, that with comments like this, we should be looking for a new moderator. As in one who doesn’t blatantly threaten other members. BJMB Moderation Team, is that what the “ Negativity Police” is calling itself nowadays? Seems to me they used to be called “The Gestapo” once too.

Why should he or anyone else be banned unless it’s for a serious infraction of common sense rules of personal conduct. A healthy forum invites vigorous discussion. I honestly think that because of the state of the franchise we sometimes let our passion for baseball and the Blue Jays get away from us. I know I have on occasion. If we start with the fact that we all want the same thing, a winning team, there should be no reason for discord. And as I said before, I welcome all ideas because being stuck in mediocrity is no fun. It seems that even the players we like are looking to jump ship.

No they are members of this forum, one of whom Sent me this message: “Wilko is trying to bait you to out the poster who sent you the PM, which is obviously me.” The fact is I would never out them to you or anyone. Because I believe everyone has a right to their own opinions. The sad part is that the “negativity police” as this poster refers to you as, exist at all. What right does anyone have to try and control another’s thoughts, especially when we are all blue jays fans. Not everyone believes the road to reconstruction of this team into a contender and future championship quality team should follow the same blueprint, some want to send Bichette away while others want to keep him. To me that’s unimportant. What should be important is that each of us share the same desire that the team becomes relevant again. I believe that Shapiro and Atkins, and I make no secret of this, have been here long enough to show that they are unqualified to fulfill that task… you can disagree with my opinion, in fact I welcome those of you who want to share your opinion as to why you think I am wrong. What I don’t agree with are those of you who try to intimidate others, by use of so called negativity police. Each of us has a voice, none of us are perfect, and none of us knows everything. Given that, all of us should be able to express ourselves freely without fear or favor…. And I for one will continue doing that. I think reasonable people should all have no use for anyone who uses intimidation as a means of limiting others. And as a point of interest. I believe it was Wilko who invited me to this forum years ago, and for that I thank him. So I doubt he was deliberately trying to bait me, if he’s the same Wilko. He already knows I’m not one to betray a friend

Yeah it’s reminiscent of the old branch Rickey quote: “it’s better to trade a player one year too soon, than to trade him one year too late” It’s just smart baseball.

Yeah it’s reminiscent of the old branch Rickey quote: “it’s better to trade a player one year too soon, than to trade him one year too late” It’s just smart baseball.

Thanks for the info, it make sense. No GM worth their salt doesnt do their due diligence this time of year, it is after all their livelihood and it is in their best interest to be informed. But it’s nice to know when someone is in a position to give a bit more detail. Keep us informed when you hear anything else. I’m sure the board agrees

Too bad Bts, why would I melt down when several other members tell me you’re clueless and to ignore you for the fool you are. I just figure I’ll do the Christian thing and educate you. The fact is Shapiro and Atkins Will eventually be let go, and nothing you say will change that. It’s the nature of the game.

No youre wrong, they had no idea how long whether it was a year and a half of Lee or ten years, WHEN THE TRADE WAS MADE, they traded a reigning Cy Young winner in his prime for Carrasco and 3 prospects who never amounted to anything. Anyway you twist it that’s a horrible return. Once you trade a player how long he lasts with his new team, is no longer in your control. If Shapiro had not traded Lee, he very well may have resigned in Cleveland and finished his career there. We have no way of knowing The fact is Shapiro traded a reigning Cy Young winner in his prime for Carrasco and 3 guys who never amounted to much, no matter how you spin it they lost that trade. To say anything else is disingenuous.

Actually I just got a private message saying the opposite. That I should ignore the “negativity police” and keep speaking my truth. I told them not to worry. I love the Mets and my BlueJays too much not to defend them. I’ve been here since the Prosprortsdaily days and many of the Old Guard are personal friends. I respect them too much to let some “negativity police” stop me from speaking my truth. Those of us who were here in those days, would NEVER let some pissant do that. You’re gonna find there are more of us than there are of you. Real Jays fans Unite. Always speak your truth.

Joke all you want, but Lee also out pitched Halladay in the post season too, by a pretty good margin. Carrasco was not a good return for Lee. Just like he wouldn’t have been for Halladay either. When you trade a hall of fame caliber pitcher, you definitely want something more than a journeyman .500 pitcher. Or at least you should. And like I said I wasn’t knocking Lee or Sizemore. I was just saying there were extenuating circumstances in that trade. It’s not often that a team is in danger of being contracted and going out of business Minaya felt he had to do something to try and get them a championship so that baseball couldn’t get rid of them. If baseball decided that the Jays were irrelevant and were going to move the team out of Toronto, to say New Orleans, wouldn’t you want your GM to do everything they could to force baseball to change its mind? Damn straight you would. The jays are like going to trade all their impending free agents because they don’t want to lose them for nothing. That’s also an extenuating circumstance. It’s just how the game is these days. But when Minaya did it, it was not common as it is now. Some fans want to tear it all down, like the astros and braves did, Tank and use the draft to build a powerhouse of young stars. And they might be right but ownership doesn’t seem to want to do that. They seem more interested in selling tickets. My personal opinion is Anthopoulos saw that way before anybody else did and that’s why he left

No you keep up, you got a 500 pitcher who wasn’t an ace for a guy who went 22-3 and had just won the Cy Young in his prime (0nly 29 at the time of the trade), the rest of the package pretty much bombed out. How in hell was that a good return? Are you stoned or something. That’s like trading Vlad Guerrero for Steve Pearce

No brownie I wasn’t knocking carrasco, I just was saying correctly I might add, he wasn’t a staff ace like Halladay, Sabathia and Verlander were. Carrasco, was a clear step down,

No brownie I wasn’t knocking carrasco, I just was saying correctly I might add, he wasn’t a staff ace like Halladay, Sabathia and Verlander were. Carrasco, was a clear step down as his lifetime 110-100 record easily proves. By way of comparison: Halladay 203 - 105 Sabathia 251 -161 Verlander 260 - 143 Those three could carry a staff. Carrasco could not. Only an idiot would think Carrasco was their equal.

That’s not really how it went down as Ken Rosenthal reported at the time: “ But there were also some strong rumors that 2002 could be the Expos final year in Montreal, there were rumors of contraction of the franchise. Owner Jeff Lurie was not the most upfront of business guys when it came to the franchise either. Omar Minaya, then the Expos’ GM, was trying to orchestrate what he thought might be the team’s last hurrah — the Expos, surprise contenders in ’02, were facing the possibility that their owner, Major League Baseball, would eliminate them through contraction. Minaya had been named GM just a few days before spring training started. The Expos didn’t even have scouting reports on their own minor leaguers; their previous owner, Jeffrey Loria, had taken them to his new team, the Florida Marlins. “There wasn’t much focus on minor-league players,” says Minaya, who is now the Padres’ senior vice president of baseball operations. “The No. 1 priority was not long-term. Long-term, we were going to be contracted. And if you were going to be contracted, the No. 1 priority was to be as competitive as you can. “I had no choice, I was trying to save my franchise.” “Every team in baseball was pretty much looking at drafting those players (in a dispersal draft). Before I left the Mets (in early 2002), every team had an exercise, (trying to figure out) what players they were going to get.” As reported by the associated press the next day: “ The Expos, who are owned and operated by MLB and are still the most likely team to be contracted, yesterday traded 1B Lee Stevens and three prospects to the Indians for P Bartolo Colon. The Expos are 41-36 and in second place in the NL East. In Toronto, Jeff Blair calls the trade "a gutsy move sure to send shockwaves throughout [MLB]." Realizing "this could be the final season for baseball in Montreal," Expos GM Omar Minaya — who was appointed by MLB Commissioner Bud Selig — "has made a bold pre-emptive strike in acquiring a pitcher who figured to be one of the most highly sought players at the trade deadline" (GLOBE & MAIL, 6/28). Minaya said that the commissioner's office "played no role at all" in making the trade (ESPN, 6/27). Minaya, on the trade: "I hope it sends a message to our fans and players that we are trying to be competitive and trying to make the playoffs" (AP, 6/27). ESPN’s Rob Neyer: "If this is the Expos' last season they don't have anything to lose, and they should trade all of their prospects in pursuit of one last bit of desperate glory. But until somebody figures out how you can kill a franchise other than the Expos, I'm not at all sure this is their last season" (ESPN.com, 6/27). ABC Radio's Keith Olbermann: "Who's supposed to be contracted again? The Expos. The bolded was for Spanky since his comment indicated he had a hard time getting it… hopefully that helps. That trade was an outlier. It didn’t make Shapiro a genius, far from it, it demonstrated that Minaya was clearly desperate, and would have traded his own grandmother if it meant saving his franchise. Which is why I included the comments from Neyer and Olberman. Anybody with half a brain understood why it went down. If anything, I give credit to Shapiro in that he recognized he had a desperate man by his privates, and took him for all he was worth. Let’s all hope he finds an equally desperate man and sends him Bo Bichette for 5 top 100 prospects and his grandmother.

Thank you for this, but it’s not about being right or wrong. It’s about having the right people in the right jobs. With the skills to maximize the opportunities that present themselves….. if you have proven talent evaluators and scouts who over years have identified great prospects, you listen to them. You don’t just hire your buddies because they agree with you. And having a bunch of yes men is never a good thing. I’d rather have a scout who pounds the table and tells me why I’m wrong and convinces me with solid reasoning why he’s right and I’m wrong. I think that’s healthy for an organization. Shapiro may very well be a great financial mind and if that’s so, let him do it to his heart’s content, but that doesn’t mean he’s qualified as a talent evaluator, and if he’s not, he shouldn’t be doing it. That’s all I’m saying.

No I’m not insane, but then again my Mets, were in the World Series in the last decade, have won playoff games in the last 2 years, and actually fired multiple GM’s for poor performance in the same time that the blue jays have allowed a once great franchise to become the laughingstock of baseball. I’m not the only one here who thinks that either, after all I didn’t start this thread. I’m just agreeing with them that this team is going nowhere until they get rid of the clowns running this team into the ground. Isn’t the definition of insanity doing the same things that didn’t work the last time you tried them, and expecting the results to be different? But hey suit yourself, you may enjoy losing. Remember 2 facts this team is geographically the largest market in the sport. And currently has the highest payroll in team history. And what do they have to show for it? Check the standings, and you call us crazy. Remember the title of the thread you’re posting in: “ does anyone actually trust Ross Atkins and Shapiro to be at the helm for this rebuild? I didn’t select the title. A Blue Jays fan did. They have a right to their opinions don’t they? I actually respect 5toolphenom for their courage to ask the hard question, At least unlike you, they’re dealing with reality. Heck even your best player, Vlad Guerrero who once said he’d never consider playing for the mother f’ing yankees now says he would…..if that doesn’t indicate that something isn’t right in the people making the decisions and the players want change, what more do you need?

No Bts, it’s not a troll account, I was on the pro sports daily site as well. And I’m just reporting what Indians fans told me. They absolutely hated Shapiro if you weren’t so lazy you can see the posts of Indian fans, they are still there if you bothered to look. For example: “One online pundit best exemplified Tribe Nation's fury: "Mark Shapiro is right now my most hated person," he wrote. "I hate him more than Osama bin Laden and whoever invented country music, and that is saying something. I only have one thing to say about this attack on America . . . CRUCIFY! CRUCIFY! DIE SHAPIRO DIE! CRUCIFY!!!!!" Imagine at that time in history comparing him to Osama bin Laden, I’d say they really wanted him gone, don’t you? They blame Shapiro for the dismantling of John Harts team. And you can like Carrasco all you want, but he was never an Ace like Sabathia, Lee, and Halladay were. He was a decent starter not a horse that can carry a staff. There is a difference. 8 years without a single win in the postseason is pretty damning for a team that has by far the largest market in all of baseball. You can make all the excuses for Shapiro you wish, that’s your choice, and you’re entitled to it. But Shapiro has an 18 year track record as an executive and it speaks for itself. Indian fans celebrated when Dolan foisted him on the Blue Jays, and now Most intelligent blue jays fans want to see him gone. you may want him to stay and once again, that’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it. I would never say any different.. I’m just saying that Shapiros track record isn’t good and that’s a matter of record, you can believe how you wish that’s your choice. I’m just saying that eight years without a single win in the postseason and a poor drafting record. Is there enough to get anybody fired. Hell, Brian Cashman GM of the Yankees made the playoffs 30 straight years he missed once last year and their fans wanted him fired and run out on a rail. What makes Shapiro so good that he can not win a single playoff game in eight years that he’s immune to be held accountable for his performance? That my friend is not trolling it’s just a simple statement of performance and the representation of a lack of accountability. I wonder how many teams over the last eight years have not won a single playoff game. I bet there’s no more than five teams that have done that. Now ask yourself of those five or fewer teams, how many have the same GM? The simple fact is you and metafour will defend Shapiro to your dying breath, because you were too lazy to do simple research… there are several articles, still online that speak clearly of how hated Shapiro was in Cleveland. How hard is it to open google? That, Bts makes you and metafour the trolls, not me.

Actually probably not, based on the fact that he wasn’t falling due to signing concerns. Some teams simply took him off their first round big boards due to his pitching characteristics. Yesavage was well aware of those concerns weeks ago as he’s been questioned about it and been examined extensively by teams I bet he’s just happy to have gone in the first. It’s happened before, the Mets drafted Kumar Rocker at number 9, and after getting a closer look at his medicals, they voided his contract and MLB gave them a 2nd round pick the next year. It’s the reason that some guys slide. Teams can’t afford to give guys these huge contracts to unproven draftees and have them flame out before the even make any return on investment. That gets a GM fired and owners very unhappy.

Actually probably not, based on the fact that he wasn’t falling due to signing concerns. Some teams simply took him off their first round big boards due to his pitching characteristics. Yesavage was well aware of those concerns weeks ago as he’s been questioned about it and been examined extensively by teams I bet he’s just happy to have gone in the first. It’s happened before, the Mets drafted Kumar Rocker at number 9, and after getting a closer look at his medicals, they voided his contract and MLB gave them a 2nd round pick the next year. It’s the reason that some guys slide. Teams can’t afford to give guys these huge contracts to unproven draftees and have them flame out before the even make any return on investment. That gets a GM fired and owners very unhappy. Last April he was ranked as high as number 5 on most boards, so he’s got the talent, no question, it’s just that teams have the concerns about his Release point and even Justin Verlander has had Two Tommy John surgeries, and just to be clear no one has said that Yesavage has any sign of that. It’s just that the high release point could put him at risk. It’s funny how the game has changed, former Cy Young winner and former Blue Jay RA Dickey was born without a ligament in his pitching elbow. And played his entire career without one. If he came along now he would never be drafted. He would be told he couldn’t withstand the rigors of pitching in the big leagues. But that’s the beauty of baseball. Nobody can be counted out.

ESPN had this in their write up Who is Yesavage? Yesavage first showed off his promising arm with a 15.9 K/9 rate as a freshman at East Carolina before moving into the rotation once he improved his command as a sophomore and went 18-2 with a 2.28 ERA over his final two seasons with the Pirates. Yesavage was hospitalized with a partially collapsed lung during the 2024 season but returned to the mound less than two weeks later and defeated fellow first-round prospect Chase Burns of Wake Forest in an NCAA regional elimination game. Why the Blue Jays took him here: He's the top college pitcher remaining on the board and feels like good value at this spot. He may be more floor than ceiling, but with Yusei Kikuchi a free agent and Chris Bassitt possible trade bait, Yesavage's polished repertoire could mean he moves quickly through the minors to fill an immediate need. If he adds even a little more velocity, he could end up being one of the steals of the first round.” There were some negatives however, according to some reports 10 - 12 teams took him off their first round draft boards. The reasoning for doing this is that Trey has an extremely high release point. Generally, it is in the 7 foot range. The only pitcher in recent history who does this is Justin verlander . This characteristic creates a downward plane, which creates exceptional torque and stress on the shoulder capsule, which has led to many pitchers eventually needing Tommy John surgery, fortunately however Trey has not had any history of that yet. But as reported some teams expressed serious concerns which probably led to him falling down from top 5 to where the jays drafted him.

absolutely, both Lee and Sabathia we certified Aces, top of the rotation horses. Brantley and Carrasco were fine major leaguers but nothing to write home about. Compare that to what the Jays received for Roy Halladay. If you look at Shapiro and his entire body of work it’s like a string of Daulton Varsho like returns

Larry Dolan was desperate to get rid of Shapiro. He suckered Bluejay ownership into taking him and he brought in his right hand man Atkins.. Atkins really isn’t the problem. The problem is Shapiro who knows nothing about talent acquisitions. He is the reason that Anthopoulos left. I know this for a fact, Cleveland fans were telling me this before Shapiro left. They did not want to lose Chris Antonetti, but he was leaving if Shapiro stayed so Larry Dolan talked to the Blue Jays and convinced them to take Shapiro so the problem is not Atkins the problem is Shapiro And he ain’t going anywhere because he’s got the Blue Jays ownership kissing his ass. The Blue Jays won’t get any better till they get rid of Shapiro. He’s the problem it’s known he wants to be the next commissioner but I can’t see major-league baseball being that stupid. Do some research on the Indians. This is all common knowledge to their fan base. Shapiro had nothing to do with building the late 80’s and early 90’s Indians they were built by John Hart. Indians fans wanted Shapiro run out on a rail. They absolutely hated him for the same reasons that the Blue Jays fans are learning now he does nothing to really build the team and the Blue Jays will never get better as long as Shapiro is in charge. That’s just the facts. Talk to Indians fans. Get the scoop from them once you talk to long-term Indians fans you’ll see who the real problem is Larry Dolan suckered Blue Jays ownership. He talked them into taking his problem, Gillick realized this and so did Anthopoulos So Gillick retired, and Alex left as soon as he could. I get it some of you don’t want to believe this. But Indians fans had no reason to lie. They were just happy to be rid of Shapiro

mayza signed by the Yankees

Another opportunity wasted how does Varsho always find himself batting in the most in opportune moments?