Positivity Thread

[Eat My Shatkins]

So last year's team with worse hitting with RISP and a less effective bullpen?

 

Yummy

[Terminator]

tied 14th in wRC+

 

25th in runs

 

it's almost like that book It where the clown knows your deepest fears and exploits them

that is what is happening to all of us this season

 

oh, you thought they were inexplicably bad with RISP last year?

 

I don't know what's going on with our hitting and RISP. It's probably just noise.

 

Matt Chapman was brutal with RISP last year but was great otherwise. Belt had a 176 wRC+ with the bases empty but 93 with RISP.

 

Those guys are gone but we suck again with RISP. This year Bo seemingly can't hit anything, yet with RISP he's hitting 147 wRC+.

 

2023:

Overall- wRC+ 107 (7th in MLB)

RISP- wRC+ 102 (14th)

 

2024:

Overall- 100 (16th)

RISP- 90 (24th)

[Barrelsandbombs]

Doesn't seem possible but the Jays now have a 100 wRC+ as a team on the season.

 

102 team wRC+ against right handed pitching which is 13th in the league.

 

Which I think righties make up about 75% of all MLB pitchers. Someone correct me if I'm wrong on that part going off rough memory.

[Spanky99]

102 team wRC+ against right handed pitching which is 13th in the league.

 

Which I think righties make up about 75% of all MLB pitchers. Someone correct me if I'm wrong on that part going off rough memory.

 

Nah, you're correct.

[Laika]

I don't know what's going on with our hitting and RISP. It's probably just noise.

 

Matt Chapman was brutal with RISP last year but was great otherwise. Belt had a 176 wRC+ with the bases empty but 93 with RISP.

 

Those guys are gone but we suck again with RISP. This year Bo seemingly can't hit anything, yet with RISP he's hitting 147 wRC+.

 

2023:

Overall- wRC+ 107 (7th in MLB)

RISP- wRC+ 102 (14th)

 

2024:

Overall- 100 (16th)

RISP- 90 (24th)

 

You're probably just noise

 

The team, org, coaches = full of weak men psychologically stunted human beings tiny stegosauras brains bad game plans and bad emotional regulation forget about ice in the veins these jerks have veins full of green tea or some weak sauce like that

[Terminator]

You're probably just noise

 

The team, org, coaches = full of weak men psychologically stunted human beings tiny stegosauras brains bad game plans and bad emotional regulation forget about ice in the veins these jerks have veins full of green tea or some weak sauce like that

 

I am definitely a lot of noise so no argument there. And there is some truth to the team being filled with mental midgets but this is the positivity thread. If it were in the Ship is Sinking thread I would give this a like.

[Dick_Pole]

The issue I guess is lack of clutch and power making a deadly combination. This team is historically kind of lousy with the "clutch" factor, or maybe that's just home team fan bias. But historically made up for it by clubbing a billion solo home runs throughout the year. Now they don't hit singles with guys on second nor do they hit homers with no one on either. Therefore tankage in runs per game.

[Terminator]

Skenes and Jared Jones both pitched today for the Pirates in their doubleheader so we won't be seeing them this weekend

[L54]

Skenes and Jared Jones both pitched today for the Pirates in their doubleheader so we won't be seeing them this weekend

 

Would’ve been a good day to be at the ballpark

[Terminator]

Would’ve been a good day to be at the ballpark

 

Yeah watching Skenes pitch live would be fun

[jaysblue]

Would’ve been a good day to be at the ballpark

 

I would have went to one of those games if they were pitching for sure.

[Brownie19]

Good news - we didn't make the top of this list

 

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[Terminator]

Spencer Horwitz’s Steamer600 is 2.8 right now

[Stangstag]

Good news - we didn't make the top of this list

 

Talkin’ Baseball (@talkinbaseball_) • Instagram reel

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---

6,365 likes, 127 comments - talkinbaseball_ on June 11, 2024: "The MLB teams players don’t want to play for #baseball #mlb #mets #athletics #whitesox #angels".

 

Didn’t make the “best front offices” list either.

 

So basically we’re middling. That’s fine I guess?? Problem is really our tough division

[Brownie19]

Didn’t make the “best front offices” list either.

 

So basically we’re middling. That’s fine I guess?? Problem is really our tough division

 

I think that's a fair assessment. We're seeing eye to eye a lot lately.

[Laika]

Spencer Horwitz’s Steamer600 is 2.8 right now

 

total stud with no tools lmao

 

no speed or power but a great plate approach, he's maybe going to end up like a LaMonte Wade or Lars Nootbaar kind of hitter, maybe Nate Lowe

 

watch Atkins' s***** farm graduate an average or better position player every year from Schneider (2023), Horwitz (2024), and the remaining Buffalo bums

[BatFlip]

total stud with no tools lmao

 

no speed or power but a great plate approach, he's maybe going to end up like a LaMonte Wade or Lars Nootbaar kind of hitter, maybe Nate Lowe

 

watch Atkins' s***** farm graduate an average or better position player every year from Schneider (2023), Horwitz (2024), and the remaining Buffalo bums

 

 

That would actually free up a ton of cash. These guys are like the undershirts and boxers you get in bulk from costco. You're never going to wear them out, but you need them underneath your nice stuff and you feel pretty good about yourself for scoring a deal.

[Terminator]

total stud with no tools lmao

 

no speed or power but a great plate approach, he's maybe going to end up like a LaMonte Wade or Lars Nootbaar kind of hitter, maybe Nate Lowe

 

watch Atkins' s***** farm graduate an average or better position player every year from Schneider (2023), Horwitz (2024), and the remaining Buffalo bums

 

In addition to Schneider and Horwitz, Otto Lopez has a Steamer600 of 3.0 now. I blame the Biggio family for losing him.

 

But yeah, maybe these Buffalo bums are actually good?

[max silver]

In addition to Schneider and Horwitz, Otto Lopez has a Steamer600 of 3.0 now. I blame the Biggio family for losing him.

 

But yeah, maybe these Buffalo bums are actually good?

 

Lopez has seen his numbers in a giant tailspin so the splashy debut may have just been an unsustainable hot streak.

[Omar]

In addition to Schneider and Horwitz, Otto Lopez has a Steamer600 of 3.0 now. I blame the Biggio family for losing him.

 

But yeah, maybe these Buffalo bums are actually good?

 

This org doesn't seem to trust their AAA numbers or puts little stock in them. Who knows why?

[Terminator]

Lopez has seen his numbers in a giant tailspin so the splashy debut may have just been an unsustainable hot streak.

 

Yeah none of these guys are sure things to be 3 WAR players by any means.

 

Among the other upper minors guys we have, Phil Clarke projects for 2 WAR (but he's a C so who knows), Roden projects for 1.7, Kasevich projects for 1.7 and Jimenez for 1.7.

[tazsub3]

it is very nice weather today....... must be baseball season.....

Sorry this is as positive as i could get !

[glory]

This org doesn't seem to trust their AAA numbers or puts little stock in them. Who knows why?

 

Atkins seems obsessed with depth no matter how marginal it is. So in his mind, having a fat DH like Vogelbach in the big leagues while a better player is in AAA to serve as depth makes the team better than having the better player in the Majors and having to find a Vogelbach equivalent to play in AAA. I guess that's not an exclusive trait to Atkins, a lot of GM's do that due to how options work, but he's a big believer in it based on how he's operated this season. There are ways to incorporate the prospects and use the vetrins more to their strengths (ex. platoon Turner with Horowitz, use KK as a 4th OF, etc), but for some reason Atkins wants to live or die with his old 0-1 WAR guys. I couldn't believe Roden started the year in AA given his age, and now it's mid June and he's still there. There's no plan or logic in place at all.

 

As far as the Buffalo (and NH) guys, I think a lot of them possess a high floor, so that likely helps their chances of contributing to the big league roster. The only one whose floor is a little questionable is Orelvis, but he has big time power, so the ceiling might be worth the risk if he can play defense anywhere in the IF. Not sure a lineup with all of DS, Horowitz, Barger, Jimenez, Orelvis, and Roden would be any good, but I don't think that's a pure tanking lineup either. There's probably enough 2ish WAR potential with all of them to be respectable.

[Terminator]

Yeah that makes sense.

 

I think Horwitz and Schneider could be pretty good players. I would pencil them in as starters moving forward though it's possible they could still flop (especially Horwitz).

 

Barger, Jimenez and Roden seems like platoon or bench guys. If Jimenez is a wizard with the glove he could possibly be a starter. Roden could possibly be a starter. Barger has physical tools but he seems more like a bench player to me. He looks like a very stiff athlete out there. Kind of like a poor man's Tyler O'neill.

[wilko]

Yeah that makes sense.

 

I think Horwitz and Schneider could be pretty good players. I would pencil them in as starters moving forward though it's possible they could still flop (especially Horwitz).

 

Barger, Jimenez and Roden seems like platoon or bench guys. If Jimenez is a wizard with the glove he could possibly be a starter. Roden could possibly be a starter. Barger has physical tools but he seems more like a bench player to me. He looks like a very stiff athlete out there. Kind of like a poor man's Tyler O'neill.

 

Hopefully not as injury prone.

[John_Havok]

Atkins seems obsessed with depth no matter how marginal it is. So in his mind, having a fat DH like Vogelbach in the big leagues while a better player is in AAA to serve as depth makes the team better than having the better player in the Majors and having to find a Vogelbach equivalent to play in AAA. I guess that's not an exclusive trait to Atkins, a lot of GM's do that due to how options work, but he's a big believer in it based on how he's operated this season. There are ways to incorporate the prospects and use the vetrins more to their strengths (ex. platoon Turner with Horowitz, use KK as a 4th OF, etc), but for some reason Atkins wants to live or die with his old 0-1 WAR guys. I couldn't believe Roden started the year in AA given his age, and now it's mid June and he's still there. There's no plan or logic in place at all.

 

As far as the Buffalo (and NH) guys, I think a lot of them possess a high floor, so that likely helps their chances of contributing to the big league roster. The only one whose floor is a little questionable is Orelvis, but he has big time power, so the ceiling might be worth the risk if he can play defense anywhere in the IF. Not sure a lineup with all of DS, Horowitz, Barger, Jimenez, Orelvis, and Roden would be any good, but I don't think that's a pure tanking lineup either. There's probably enough 2ish WAR potential with all of them to be respectable.

 

define respectable.

[glory]

define respectable.

 

Not the 2018-19 Orioles.

[AMS528]

Yeah none of these guys are sure things to be 3 WAR players by any means.

 

Among the other upper minors guys we have, Phil Clarke projects for 2 WAR (but he's a C so who knows), Roden projects for 1.7, Kasevich projects for 1.7 and Jimenez for 1.7.

 

I think I've got a hard time believing that Kasevich who has shown less than 0.100 ISO every single year in the minors succeeding. He doesn't seem to have shown enough speed that he's going to extend singles into doubles either, his walk rate was decent but is lower this year. I don't know if a Nick Madrigal profile is going to make it.

 

Jimenez I can actually see potentially succeeding.

 

Roden has some really strong splits, so he's a platoon guy I think.

Edited June 14, 2024 by AMS528

[Terminator]

I think I've got a hard time believing that Kasevich who has shown less than 0.100 ISO every single year in the minors succeeding. He doesn't seem to have shown enough speed that he's going to extend singles into doubles either, his walk rate was decent but is lower this year. I don't know if a Nick Madrigal profile is going to make it.

 

Jimenez I can see potentially succeeding.

 

Roden has some really strong splits, so he's a platoon guy at best I think.

 

Yeah I'm skeptical of Kasevich as well but he is having a good year.

 

It seems like the reports on his defense are very positive this year. Prior the season he was seen more as a 3B who can play some SS. But he may in fact be a legit SS. So if he could be a 70 hit tool, 55 fielding, 35 game power Shortstop, then that might shoot him up the lists some.

 

And he is at least solidly built at 6'2'', 200 and does hit some home runs so I suppose there's always a hope he hits for more power whereas Madrigal never had a chance.

[Omar]

Atkins seems obsessed with depth no matter how marginal it is. So in his mind, having a fat DH like Vogelbach in the big leagues while a better player is in AAA to serve as depth makes the team better than having the better player in the Majors and having to find a Vogelbach equivalent to play in AAA. I guess that's not an exclusive trait to Atkins, a lot of GM's do that due to how options work, but he's a big believer in it based on how he's operated this season. There are ways to incorporate the prospects and use the vetrins more to their strengths (ex. platoon Turner with Horowitz, use KK as a 4th OF, etc), but for some reason Atkins wants to live or die with his old 0-1 WAR guys. I couldn't believe Roden started the year in AA given his age, and now it's mid June and he's still there. There's no plan or logic in place at all.

 

As far as the Buffalo (and NH) guys, I think a lot of them possess a high floor, so that likely helps their chances of contributing to the big league roster. The only one whose floor is a little questionable is Orelvis, but he has big time power, so the ceiling might be worth the risk if he can play defense anywhere in the IF. Not sure a lineup with all of DS, Horowitz, Barger, Jimenez, Orelvis, and Roden would be any good, but I don't think that's a pure tanking lineup either. There's probably enough 2ish WAR potential with all of them to be respectable.

 

This is fine but it doesn't answer my question. As you yourself wrote, "but for some reason". You know what that reason is? I think it has something to do with Atkins selling snake oil. While Springer was looking washed these past months Lukes was on the farm putting up .949 ops. and not getting a sniff. It really doesn't matter what kind of numbers he puts up, he isn't going to get the call. Why, because Atkins knows that other than perhaps DS, Orelvis, and perhaps Tiedemann the farm system is a mirage. That's why he won't have a fire sale at the deadline. He knows the resulting lineup will produce horrendous results. It's a bitter truth.

 

Barger, Horwitz, Clement are not saviours, they're place holders.