General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2022)

[Jays24]

Exactly. He serves no purpose. I'd be shocked if he was on the roster next week.

 

Other than being our best outfielder defensively and fastest runner in pinch running situations. I'd prefer him to having 3 catchers on the roster.

[Dagagad]

Depends how he looks with the stick, but I feel this could backfire spectacularly. Unless the front office plans on moving Kirk/Jansen over Moreno.

 

Right now Moreno is an excellent trade piece. He either plays well and his stock goes up, or he looks completely overmatched and his value plummets.

 

I think the idea that they were going to trade Moreno was always suspect. Teams really don’t seem to trade guys that highly regarded any more. LA traded a 55FV pitcher and a 50FV catcher for an ace rental and 1.5 yrs control of a stud short stop and that was honestly a shocking trade. It was always unlikely that we would be making that level of trade. Martin and SWR weren’t on the same tier as Moreno either.

 

What this means to me is that the front office believes in Moreno. Other than that, it doesn’t tell us that much. It might be intended as a 1 month acclimatization stint, or it could be up for good.

 

It does increase the chances that someone is getting traded pre deadline though. This is perfect timing to see if he can stick this year. If the answer is yes, then it does make Jansen or Kirk expendable. I’d lean towards the former but who knows.

[Ryu In My House]

I wonder if Aaron Nola is available. He is having a really great season, and may not cost too much as a < 1 year rental. The Phillies are 3.5 GB on a WC spot, but are trending down.

[Jimcanuck]

I think the idea that they were going to trade Moreno was always suspect. Teams really don’t seem to trade guys that highly regarded any more. LA traded a 55FV pitcher and a 50FV catcher for an ace rental and 1.5 yrs control of a stud short stop and that was honestly a shocking trade. It was always unlikely that we would be making that level of trade. Martin and SWR weren’t on the same tier as Moreno either.

 

What this means to me is that the front office believes in Moreno. Other than that, it doesn’t tell us that much. It might be intended as a 1 month acclimatization stint, or it could be up for good.

 

It does increase the chances that someone is getting traded pre deadline though. This is perfect timing to see if he can stick this year. If the answer is yes, then it does make Jansen or Kirk expendable. I’d lean towards the former but who knows.

 

I don't think anyone said they are going to trade Moreno. Only that it is not optimal to keep all three. Which one goes, only Shatkins knows, or more likely, doesn't know at this time because it takes two to tango. Reality is who goes depends on the offers that come in - if the best offer involves Moreno leaving, that's that. No one should be untouchable.

[Dagagad]

I don't think anyone said they are going to trade Moreno. Only that it is not optimal to keep all three. Which one goes, only Shatkins knows, or more likely, doesn't know at this time because it takes two to tango. Reality is who goes depends on the offers that come in - if the best offer involves Moreno leaving, that's that. No one should be untouchable.

 

I think if they really considered trading him, they wouldn’t call him up. He’s probably going to struggle. Most guys do. Especially catchers.

 

I also don’t totally believe in the best deal philosophy. Yes, everyone has their price but there are also guys you are more willing to trade and will more likely have a real market.

 

Like, I can think of two teams off the top of my head (giants/astros) that have a need and the types of players that we need for Jansen.

 

With Kirk, we won’t get full price for his skills because of his body… so why trade him.

 

So, yea, no one is untouchable but you can usually project to SOME degree who is more likely to be ….touched I guess lol.

 

I do think if someone is ready to pay a true price for Kirk/Moreno we would listen of course. Like the true price for Kirk should be pretty f***ing big. Is a team really going to pay that?

[Jimcanuck]

I think if they really considered trading him, they wouldn’t call him up. He’s probably going to struggle. Most guys do. Especially catchers.

 

I also don’t totally believe in the best deal philosophy. Yes, everyone has their price but there are also guys you are more willing to trade and will more likely have a real market.

 

Like, I can think of two teams off the top of my head (giants/astros) that have a need and the types of players that we need for Jansen.

 

With Kirk, we won’t get full price for his skills because of his body… so why trade him.

 

So, yea, no one is untouchable but you can usually project to SOME degree who is more likely to be ….touched I guess lol.

 

I do think if someone is ready to pay a true price for Kirk/Moreno we would listen of course. Like the true price for Kirk should be pretty f***ing big. Is a team really going to pay that?

 

Soto for Kirk?

 

Not going to happen, but it's not productive to speculate on who will and will not get dealt.

[Dagagad]

Soto for Kirk?

 

Yes, I accept lol.

[Laika]

I wonder if Aaron Nola is available. He is having a really great season, and may not cost too much as a < 1 year rental. The Phillies are 3.5 GB on a WC spot, but are trending down.

 

Nah they won't sell unless they have an Angels like losing streak and have no shot

[L54]

I think if they really considered trading him, they wouldn’t call him up. He’s probably going to struggle. Most guys do. Especially catchers.

 

I also don’t totally believe in the best deal philosophy. Yes, everyone has their price but there are also guys you are more willing to trade and will more likely have a real market.

 

Like, I can think of two teams off the top of my head (giants/astros) that have a need and the types of players that we need for Jansen.

 

With Kirk, we won’t get full price for his skills because of his body… so why trade him.

 

So, yea, no one is untouchable but you can usually project to SOME degree who is more likely to be ….touched I guess lol.

 

I do think if someone is ready to pay a true price for Kirk/Moreno we would listen of course. Like the true price for Kirk should be pretty f***ing big. Is a team really going to pay that?

 

You’re right I don’t think anyone pays full price for Kirk

 

He’s on pace for 6 WAR

 

A LH slugging outfielder for Jano would be nice

[DigitalRock]

I think if they really considered trading him, they wouldn’t call him up. He’s probably going to struggle. Most guys do. Especially catchers.

 

I also don’t totally believe in the best deal philosophy. Yes, everyone has their price but there are also guys you are more willing to trade and will more likely have a real market.

 

Like, I can think of two teams off the top of my head (giants/astros) that have a need and the types of players that we need for Jansen.

 

With Kirk, we won’t get full price for his skills because of his body… so why trade him.

 

So, yea, no one is untouchable but you can usually project to SOME degree who is more likely to be ….touched I guess lol.

 

I do think if someone is ready to pay a true price for Kirk/Moreno we would listen of course. Like the true price for Kirk should be pretty f***ing big. Is a team really going to pay that?

 

Teams are not going to be scared off it Moreno is he struggles in a small sample starting his career. I think you are over reaching

[Dagagad]

Teams are not going to be scared off it Moreno is he struggles in a small sample starting his career. I think you are over reaching

 

Sure but it does decrease the perceived value to some degree.

[Carlos Danger]

Teams are not going to be scared off it Moreno is he struggles in a small sample starting his career. I think you are over reaching

 

If they like him they like him. However, as the previous poster said.. value... Look at the value of Joe Adell now vs when he was ranked the #1 prospect, and I can name many others...

[Stangstag]

If they like him they like him. However, as the previous poster said.. value... Look at the value of Joe Adell now vs when he was ranked the #1 prospect, and I can name many others...

 

Kelenic is another

[Jimcanuck]

It's a good risk to take, if the intent is in fact to showcase for trade discussion purposes.

[Laika]

It depends HOW he struggles.

 

Bad results but okay process? No real value change, unless that happens for literal seasons.

 

Bad results and terrible process (Kelenic, Adell)? Value changes more quickly.

[Dagagad]

It's a good risk to take, if the intent is in fact to showcase for trade discussion purposes.

 

Is showcasing prospects in the majors a real thing?

 

I’ve always thought that you maintain more value through letting teams have minor league stats to dream on.

 

I can see it with vets. A few months of health and performance is required but for prospects, I wouldn’t call guys up that I want to shop. Especially top prospects.

[Brownie19]

You’re right I don’t think anyone pays full price for Kirk

 

He’s on pace for 6 WAR

 

A LH slugging outfielder for Jano would be nice

 

Bryan Reynolds? We really could use another CF.

[Laika]

Bryan Reynolds? We really could use another CF.

 

Kinda sucks right now. Power might have fallen off.

[L54]

Bryan Reynolds? We really could use another CF.

 

They have Henry Davis but ya a LH CF would be even better. Not sure there are even any realistically available

[Terminator]

Anyone suggesting we trade Kirk is risking being put on The Sheriff's shitlist. He's criminally underrated on this board simply because he's fat.

 

Just look at the facts. He's a year older than Moreno and is mashing MLB pitching and is elite defensively. He barely doesn't qualify but if he did he'd be tied with Pete Alonso for 16th in wRC+ at 152. The only knock on him is his base running but it's made up for by the fact that we get the enjoyment of Vlad constantly ribbing him for not making it to 2nd on his wall balls. And who cares about him being fat, we've got him through his age 28 season so he'll be fine.

[Laika]

Lock Kirk up immediately

 

7 year deal

[Terminator]

It might sound crazy but Alejandro Kirk might be our best player lol. Better than Vlad or Bo even.

[Stangstag]

It might sound crazy but Alejandro Kirk might be our best player lol. Better than Vlad or Bo even.

 

Crazy pills

[The Cats Ass]

I see Charlie benched Kirk today so he could DH Vlady even though it's an off day tomorrow.

 

They might like the idea of DHing guys like Vladdy and Springer before/after an off day. This would essentially give them a 2 day break, which would kind of compound the benefits. The goal is to have these guys fresh for October, you don't want them running on fumes. Sounds like some posters would have Vladdy play all 162 games at 1B.

[Terminator]

Crazy pills

 

It's not though. Steamer end of year WAR projections:

 

Kirk- 4.6

Vlad- 4.5

Bo- 3.8

[Eat My Shatkins]

Kirk has a 153 wRC+ and has been healthy all season

 

He has the 7th most PA's on the team, and only 5 more PA's than Raimel f***ing Tapia

 

lol what the f*** Charlie??

[Jimcanuck]

The question is - would trading Kirk be a sell high, or is this hot streak what we can expect until his knees go? Anyone got a crystal ball?

[Terminator]

The question is - would trading Kirk be a sell high, or is this hot streak what we can expect until his knees go? Anyone got a crystal ball?

 

What's wrong with his knees?

[Laika]

Bullish on Kirk's health through his 20s. He's a little cannon ball. Lots of natural padding.

[Terminator]

*Danny Jansen gets hurt every 2 weeks for the past 4 seasons*

 

BJMB: We've got to trade Kirk he's too big of an injury risk.