Jays 2021/22 General Off-Season Discussion

[Grant77]

Watching someone’s Facial expressions when talking aren’t assumptions. There’s fairly deep science behind it. A mouth can lie, faces generally don’t unless the person is a sociopath.

 

The question is whether a layman like yourself can contribute anything useful from your reading of facial expressions. Maybe you can, it's hard to say.

[John_Havok]

The question is whether a layman like yourself can contribute anything useful from your reading of facial expressions. Maybe you can, it's hard to say.

 

Psychology classes are paying dividends. But you can study this stuff without that. Poker players do the same thing every day

[jerb]

 

Robert Murray

@ByRobertMurray

 

On the Blue Jays’ search for starting pitching:

https://t.co/XOJmxlh5kx?amp=1

 

 

From the article:

 

"But the Blue Jays need two more starting pitchers, including another top-of-the-rotation arm, and remain in talks with pitchers Robbie Ray and Steven Matz, sources said, with one source saying that the team has “prioritized” the two free-agent left-handers."

[Eat My Shatkins]

I don't think either guy will come back, and I won't be upset if they miss out on them either as long as they find replacements.

 

But if they do re-sign them both, it wouldn't be the worst thing to get the band back together. I don't know if Ray can piece together another CY type season, but it would still be a very good rotation more than likely.

[glory]

I still expect Ray to sign elsewhere. Some team is going to bet on 2021 being close to the new norm for him, and I'd rather it be someone else.

 

My guess is Atkins goes after one bigger SP either in free agency or trade, and then gets a 2nd SP who is more of a project. It was mentioned in another thread, but Kikuchi seems like someone Atkins would give to Pete Walker to see if he can turn it into something (LHP, throws 95, misses bats at a decent clip). He's more in the project category. The bigger fish is harder to predict, but there are still a bunch of options in free agency, and also short term options in trades (A's SP's, Castillo/S.Gray, Marlins SP's, etc).

[Spanky99]

I don't think either guy will come back, and I won't be upset if they miss out on them either as long as they find replacements.

 

But if they do re-sign them both, it wouldn't be the worst thing to get the band back together. I don't know if Ray can piece together another CY type season, but it would still be a very good rotation more than likely.

 

Ray

Berrios

Ryu

Manoah

Matz

 

would certainly be one of the best in MLB.

[G-Snarls]

Ray

Berrios

Ryu

Manoah

Matz

 

would certainly be one of the best in MLB.

 

Yes

 

That was our rotation the last two months and was clearly the best rotation in the AL East

 

Rays and Yankees had much better bullpens of course

[FantasyNewb]

Nearly all posts I see on projected starters don't involve Pearson. Pearson, Kirk+ would be a good start for a young pitcher or Ramirez. If Pearson can bounce back from the sports hernia, Cleveland should be able to turn him into an ace, with their track record.

[Jimcanuck]

Nearly all posts I see on projected starters don't involve Pearson. Pearson, Kirk+ would be a good start for a young pitcher or Ramirez. If Pearson can bounce back from the sports hernia, Cleveland should be able to turn him into an ace, with their track record.

 

Pearson has pitched minimal innings the last few years and never more than 100 IP in a year in his professional career. He's a ways from being a reliable full time SP.

[Spanky99]

Yes

 

That was our rotation the last two months and was clearly the best rotation in the AL East

 

Rays and Yankees had much better bullpens of course

 

Yes, our BP needs to be pumped up a bit. One or two reliable arms in that scenario.

[mellowgold]

We're gonna need at least one or two reliable bullpen arms in ANY scenario.

[Carlos Danger]

The question is whether a layman like yourself can contribute anything useful from your reading of facial expressions. Maybe you can, it's hard to say.

 

I think I have mentioned this story a number of times over the years here on this board. However, the spring or summer prior to Vernon Wells becoming a FA, he told me to my face with other players there, that there is NO way in hell he is coming back to TO. He was going to Texas!! He was at the time 110% serious.

 

Well fast FWD and we backed up the Brinks truck and we were saddled with that s*** contract for many years until AA did one of his best Ninja moves and dumped it on LAA.

 

I was almost certain Springer would not sign here, Connecticut guy, close to New York, etc, etc. We backed up the Brinks truck and here he is.

 

My point being, Ray's desires, facial tells etc, don't mean anything at the end of the day IMO. It will all come down to one thing, $$$$$$$$$.

[Spanky99]

I think I have mentioned this story a number of times over the years here on this board. However, the spring or summer prior to Vernon Wells becoming a FA, he told me to my face with other players there, that there is NO way in hell he is coming back to TO. He was going to Texas!! He was at the time 110% serious.

 

Well fast FWD and we backed up the Brinks truck and we were saddled with that s*** contract for many years until AA did one of his best Ninja moves and dumped it on LAA.

 

I was almost certain Springer would not sign here, Connecticut guy, close to New York, etc, etc. We backed up the Brinks truck and here he is.

 

My point being, Ray's desires, facial tells etc, don't mean anything at the end of the day IMO. It will all come down to one thing, $$$$$$$$$.

 

Yup, 90% of the time. That video said I'm getting paid! lol

[Spanky99]

We're gonna need at least one or two reliable bullpen arms in ANY scenario.

 

Yup.

[Virgil_Hiltz]

 

My point being, Ray's desires, facial tells etc, don't mean anything at the end of the day IMO. It will all come down to one thing, $$$$$$$$$.

Agreed but only when there's a disparity between the offers. When the offers are close than different factors comes into play such as player and family comfort levels with the team/city and competitiveness of team. There's more factors but yes, the dollars need to be there.

[Deadpool]

Nearly all posts I see on projected starters don't involve Pearson. Pearson, Kirk+ would be a good start for a young pitcher or Ramirez. If Pearson can bounce back from the sports hernia, Cleveland should be able to turn him into an ace, with their track record.

 

Nobody wants to rely on Pearson as a lock for the rotation, because most people learn from history, but he's typically mentioned as a "maybe" for the rotation. Selling him now would be selling low, and just a bad idea. Unless we somehow got top prospect value for him in a trade, I wouldn't be moving him this year.

[FantasyNewb]

Nobody wants to rely on Pearson as a lock for the rotation, because most people learn from history, but he's typically mentioned as a "maybe" for the rotation. Selling him now would be selling low, and just a bad idea. Unless we somehow got top prospect value for him in a trade, I wouldn't be moving him this year.

 

Yeah, I actually like his upside especially since they've identified his injury. Just curious if he's lower on a depth chart, if we should trade him for a good asset.

[John_Havok]

Yeah, I actually like his upside especially since they've identified his injury. Just curious if he's lower on a depth chart, if we should trade him for a good asset.

 

Pearson is going to get every opportunity to be a starter on this team. They would be silly not to give him that chance given his obvious gifts. However, there will be a time in the future because of his numerous injuries and command issues that if they don't sort out, it will necessitate a move to the arm barn.

 

That length of time though is hard to narrow down. So many factors are playing against him right now that it really has to go perfect for him to be a starter going forward.

[Hipfan]

Pearson is going to get every opportunity to be a starter on this team. They would be silly not to give him that chance given his obvious gifts. However, there will be a time in the future because of his numerous injuries and command issues that if they don't sort out, it will necessitate a move to the arm barn.

 

That length of time though is hard to narrow down. So many factors are playing against him right now that it really has to go perfect for him to be a starter going forward.

 

Pearson, Kirk and Groshans/Martinez for Bieber. Forget Ramirez, he’s too close to FA and will be expensive when they need salary room for Vladdy and Bo.

 

Rotation of Berrios, Bieber, Ryu, Manoah (maybe resign Matz?) would be pretty sweet. Re-sign Semien and sign a couple of RP. Easy-peasy.

[Eat My Shatkins]

I'm very interested to see how they bolster the bullpen this off season.

 

They went hard after Hendriks last off season, so it stands to reason they would target Iglesias this off season, although Romano did have a pretty good year and is more proven now.

 

I don't know what it would cost, but it'd be great if they could land Taylor Rogers from the Twins. Him and Mayza would be one hell of a 1-2 lefty punch in late innings. I wonder if Borucki plus a prospect would get it done?

 

Romano, Mayza, Cimber, Richards is a solid starting point, Merryweather too but you can't count on him at all. It's just a bonus if he actually stays healthy for once. You take those 5 guys and add in an Igelsias and a Rogers and you might have something.

[Brownie19]

Pearson is going to get every opportunity to be a starter on this team. They would be silly not to give him that chance given his obvious gifts. However, there will be a time in the future because of his numerous injuries and command issues that if they don't sort out, it will necessitate a move to the arm barn.

 

That length of time though is hard to narrow down. So many factors are playing against him right now that it really has to go perfect for him to be a starter going forward.

 

I think they need to keep Pearson around as one of their depth starters...whether he's pitching 2-3 innings per outing out of the pen, or is starting in AAA. They need to have 8-9 starters available and I don't think they have enough options in the upper minors right now. Stripling and Pearson as their 6th and 7th starters is a pretty good start. I guess Hatch may be an option also?

[Eat My Shatkins]

1. Berrios

2. Ryu

3. Manoah

4. Stripling

5. Pearson

6. Hatch

7. Kay

8. Logue

9. Francis

 

That's all the SP's on the 40 man right now.

 

Get a guy that can slot in at #1-2 and a guy that slot in at #4-5 and they're in decent shape.

[Sammy225]

Alex Cobb could be a sneaky grab. With injury issues should not be too much of a price. And could be some nice upside without breaking the bank

[Deadpool]

Anyone heard anything about Giles? Is he still alive? Could be a nice add on an MiLB deal if he's remotely healthy.

[RobinThicc]

Canada will require all athletes to be vaccinated as the national exemption will expire january 15th.

 

Another factor for the jays when acquiring players

[Jimcanuck]

Anyone heard anything about Giles? Is he still alive? Could be a nice add on an MiLB deal if he's remotely healthy.

 

He's with Seattle.... they signed him last year to a 2 year deal, knowing he wouldn't pitch in 2021.

[Stangstag]

Canada will require all athletes to be vaccinated as the national exemption will expire january 15th.

 

Another factor for the jays when acquiring players

 

I can’t see this actually happening

[Jimcanuck]

Moreno is going to play in Venezuelan winter league after the final AFL game today. Expect he will continue taking daily 3B reps.

[Olerud363]

I canÂ’t see this actually happening

 

It sounds like they already committed to it.

 

I suspect it won't affect any signings. I doubt anyone unvaccinated would sign in Canada anyway with the additional restrictions that were being placed on them.

 

I don't get what the end point will be. NBA seems to have just let these things go. Kyle Irving can't even play in his home city right now.

 

However will MLB do the same? If the Red Sox or Yankees can't bring some of their players to Toronto will they just say... cool!

 

I still think there is a chance Buffalo Blue Jays result in this. Call me crazy but twitter posters are already bringing it up.

 

I also think there is a good chance that the other teams in the East just make sure all their important players are vaxed, and it only becomes a small issue to teams that visit Toronto once a year.

 

The NY City vax laws are pretty strict anyway, so I can't really see un-vaxed wanting to play in NY. Boston isn't as strict so maybe they become the problem.

[Jimcanuck]

No way in hell that will happen. There will be agreements made.