Blue Jays-Dodgers World Series Game 4 Thread: Shane Bieber vs Shohei Ohtani

[Terminator]

2 minutes ago, jmomcc said:

This never makes sense to me because as the underdog, i kind of want someone who can run into some home runs and walk. 

He doesn’t hit for power or draw many walks against righties throwing 96+ mph. His xwOBA against those pitches was just .195.

[ComeTogether]

14 hours ago, Jonn said:

Why Ty France?

 

14 hours ago, Jonn said:

Why not Davis Schneider? 

 

14 hours ago, Slade said:

Sorry wtf why are we replacing Nathan Lukes for Ty France? 

 

14 hours ago, BlueJays said:

PH Lukes. f***ing Schneider. Trying to be too cute again

 

14 hours ago, 416BlueJs said:

Ty France?

 

14 hours ago, philly30 said:

Here comes  the overmanaging

 

14 hours ago, Alejandro Murphy said:

John come on Man

Prove me wrong please

 

14 hours ago, Waylanderz said:

Prove us wrong, France!

When it works out, you have to give them credit. 

[jmomcc]

19 minutes ago, AMS528 said:

Sure but that has mostly not been the teams hitting philosophy. This is the team that (and every person in American media has been saying for the last three weeks) does not strike out, puts the ball in play regularly and creates big innings from that. They also do walk, but in the way Vladdy and Kirk do, walking while also not striking out. 

Schneider has had a good year being used in the way Terminator said, but the team overall has gotten to the playoffs and the WS now by not striking out. The team was by whatever measure you want to use at worst a top 3 team at hitting this year. 

I also think our strength is diversity. Like, we have upper cut swings, and flat swings. High contact swingers like clement and more patient guys. I'd be ok with one three true outcomes guy in their as well. 

[jmomcc]

20 minutes ago, Terminator said:

He doesn’t hit for power or draw many walks against righties throwing 96+ mph. His xwOBA against those pitches was just .195.

Are france and IKF significantly better in that cohort?

I also think that that has to be a tiny amount of ABs. 

[Terminator]

20 minutes ago, jmomcc said:

Are france and IKF significantly better in that cohort?

I also think that that has to be a tiny amount of ABs. 

Yeah definitely some small sample size stuff happening there but the team is working with more info to back up the SSS and make these decisions.

France is pretty good. Both this year and in his career he's in the .330ish range.

IKF isn't great. He's around .270.

[ComeTogether]

 

 

[Brownie19]

12 hours ago, Jonn said:

I feel like to many people here get defensive over people making valid criticisms. If we can't talk about the game from different perspectives why are we even here. Nothing wrong with these conversations. And I personally like hearing other peoples opinions and reasoning. I don't jump down people's throats about it though. I disagree and make mine.

There's way to much your a f***ing idiot for thinking that way. Or your so negative because you have this opinion. Like were here to talk about Baseball right lol. I just don't understand it.

 

1 hour ago, John_Havok said:

The finer point of this post is that the managers decisions are being judged by idiot fans that probably have less than 1 % of the information at the managers disposal and are mostly made up of incessant whining and hindsight. 

Jonn - I believe the issue is that everyone has a different definition for what "valid criticism" is.  As John tries to articulate below is that a lot of us believe those who regularly criticize the FO and managers sit firmly atop Mount Stupid.  Even when others try to introduce another point of view, or try to justify the thought process, it's often met with loud opposition.  Although you suggest you like to hear other peoples opinions and reasoning, that isn't the case with everyone.  As is VERY common in society today - most people become anchored to their opinion, unwilling to admit they might be wrong (or even less right) and thus even in the face of new information, they put up their shields and choose to fight instead of listen.  I really have no issue with people developing opinions - I just think in most cases, they shouldn't be so firm on them - as they should acknowledge there's probably a lot more information they aren't privy to.

This team is 2 wins away from their first World Series win in 32 years and people still believe that's in spite of the FO and Manager.  I suspect if the Dodgers end up winning, there will be LOTS of people who blame that on Shatkins and Schneider and suggest they should lose their jobs.

I've been alive long enough to realize nothing is going to change - people are always going to be like this, but I often find that disheartening.

Obviously I enjoy supporting the FO/Manager and try to see that most of the decisions aren't anywhere near as clear cut as some suggest.  I also don't expect them to be perfect - they are human and make mistakes.  I choose to be more supportive than not, but understand most take the opposite approach.  I also know that at times, people are just venting out of frustration and I should just let them do that - instead of poking them. 

I hope that helps.

My last thought on this is that while most people rip on the tactical decisions, I do think Schneider deserves a lot of credit for the softer side of the job.  I certainly appears he's created an awesome environment for this players.  I don't think you become such a resilient group without strong leadership in the clubhouse.  I don't really know how much that stuff matters in comparison to lineup, bullpen and substitution decisions during a game, but there's certainly a possibility that John's biggest strengths are things we don't see on a daily basis.  

[philly30]

11 hours ago, Terminator said:

Traitors

I really can't the fake dodger fan celebrities, most of them are not even from Los Angeles, and this is just a joke, these two clowns really are pretending to be dodger fans? I am glad I can watch the blue jays broadcast and not put up with their play by play guy and this crap, showing the die hard dodger fan celebs  who I am sure will be cheering the team in Toronto...yeah sure

[philly30]

1 hour ago, ComeTogether said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

When it works out, you have to give them credit. 

Do I have to? lol

[Jimcanuck]

2 minutes ago, philly30 said:

I really can't the fake dodger fan celebrities, most of them are not even from Los Angeles, and this is just a joke, these two clowns really are pretending to be dodger fans? I am glad I can watch the blue jays broadcast and not put up with their play by play guy and this crap, showing the die hard dodger fan celebs  who I am sure will be cheering the team in Toronto...yeah sure

Meghan Markle was born and raised in LA.  Most likely they are there because she is a longtime fan.

[philly30]

What a shithole

https://www.consumeraffairs.com/news/los-angeles-is-now-the-rattiest-city-in-america-102925.html

[mphenhef]

7 minutes ago, Brownie19 said:

 

 

This team is 2 wins away from their first World Series win in 32 years and people still believe that's in spite of the FO and Manager.  I suspect if the Dodgers end up winning, there will be LOTS of people who blame that on Shatkins and Schneider and suggest they should lose their jobs.

 

The Red Sox won the world series Despite John Farrell.  When the Jays win this year Shatkins and Schneider will have played a big part in that.  Sure, they have made mistakes along the way, but who doesn't?

[mphenhef]

3 minutes ago, philly30 said:

What a shithole

https://www.consumeraffairs.com/news/los-angeles-is-now-the-rattiest-city-in-america-102925.html

Ottawa is overrun with rats right now too...and I'm not just talking about the politicians.

[philly30]

8 minutes ago, Jimcanuck said:

Meghan Markle was born and raised in LA.  Most likely they are there because she is a longtime fan.

Ok she is fake, just in the other way

"Critics, however, pointed out that the 44-year-old lived in Toronto for nine months each year while filming “Suits” between 2011 and 2018. During that time, Markle frequently supported the Blue Jays and was photographed wearing the team’s merchandise on numerous occasions"

[bronson44]

4 minutes ago, philly30 said:

Ok she is fake, just in the other way

"Critics, however, pointed out that the 44-year-old lived in Toronto for nine months each year while filming “Suits” between 2011 and 2018. During that time, Markle frequently supported the Blue Jays and was photographed wearing the team’s merchandise on numerous occasions"

And the dudes dad is king of Canada

[R.O.]

 

[R.O.]

 

 

[Laika]

People are so lame lmao 

She probably doesn't even like baseball, guys. Just wearing hats. 

[R.O.]

That's enough fun. Now on to something completely different.....

The best Managers ever give you what? 1WAR per year?  If even that.

There is a good argument to make that teams shouldn't even use humans to make in-game decisions, and probably there is a game script prepared before the game that all teams use to follow through on.

JS, also has a legit brain trust behind him, helping him make those decisions. He is probably more like a CEO than a "free" thinker.

Managers' jobs are to motivate their players, protect their players from the media and effectively communicate their team's philosophy to the media.  That is basically it.  That is why Aaron Boone has managed multiple years for the Yankees.

[philly30]

1 minute ago, Laika said:

People are so lame lmao 

She probably doesn't even like baseball, guys. Just wearing hats. 

That is the point, it is all fake 

[Laika]

it's not "fake" she's just attending a major local sporting event with her husband

[glory]

1 hour ago, Terminator said:

I've been a huge fan of Schneider but part of the reason why his numbers are as good as they are is because the team is selective in how they deploy him.

He's a strikeout hitter who struggles against righthanded velocity. In the playoffs you will see a ton of that.

IKF and France don't strike out much so while they kind of suck they will put the ball in play and with a little BABIP luck they can get some hits.

 

Yeah I think that is what it comes down to. The Jays love contact, moving the runner over, etc. DS is the opposite of that. I'm not a DS fan by any means. He didn't end the season all that well and his overall numbers are propped up by 2 HR's against position player. I just think the bar on playing over IKF should be pretty low, but the Jays clearly have a specific idea in mind with DS's usage, and they probably aren't even wrong. It's just that IKF is so bad it makes it more questionable to go with that alignment. If the Jays keep winning with IKF out there, then it is what it is.

[R.O.]

Meh, I think she just likes being part of the local culture.  So in Toronto, it is the Jays hat.  In LA, Dodgers.

[Terminator]

I don’t blame Meghan Markle one bit. A lot of girls enjoy sports in the sense that they like dressing up, going to the game, and cheering for whoever the home team happens to be. Now before you tar and feather me, I know not all sports girls are like that but my first and third ex-wives were so I know the type.

But Prince Harry is the real traitor here. Imagine being fifth in line to the throne and rooting against the Commonwealth. He’s basically a reverse Benedict Arnold and should be banned from the country. Toss in the Jonas Brothers while we’re at it.

 

[philly30]

1 minute ago, Terminator said:

I don’t blame Meghan Markle. A lot of girls enjoy sports in the sense that they like dressing up, going to the game, and cheering for whoever the home team happens to be. Now before you tar and feather me, I know not all sports girls are like that but my first and third ex-wives were so I know the type.

But Prince Harry is the real traitor here. Imagine being fifth in line to the throne and rooting against the Commonwealth. He’s basically a reverse Benedict Arnold and should be banned from the country. Toss in the Jonas Brothers while we’re at it.

 

You obviously have alot of experience with this 

[Nexii]

4 minutes ago, Terminator said:

I don’t blame Meghan Markle one bit. A lot of girls enjoy sports in the sense that they like dressing up, going to the game, and cheering for whoever the home team happens to be. Now before you tar and feather me, I know not all sports girls are like that but my first and third ex-wives were so I know the type.

But Prince Harry is the real traitor here. Imagine being fifth in line to the throne and rooting against the Commonwealth. He’s basically a reverse Benedict Arnold and should be banned from the country. Toss in the Jonas Brothers while we’re at it.

 

Yea nothing stopping him from wearing a Toronto hat even if she wears LA

[glory]

I remember I was watching Game 4 of the 2019 series between the Raptors/Sixers at a bar, and we saw a random guy wearing a Jays hat. My friend goes to him, points to me, and says "he's a Blue Jays fan too". That dude had no idea who the Blue Jays were. Just said the hat matched his clothes. Don't read too much into fashion from casuals or non fans. While I'm sure there's a small chance that this site is saved on Meghan's bookmarks, I think her being an actual fan is not very likely. 

[ComeTogether]

 

 

[ComeTogether]

1 hour ago, glory said:

I remember I was watching Game 4 of the 2019 series between the Raptors/Sixers at a bar, and we saw a random guy wearing a Jays hat. My friend goes to him, points to me, and says "he's a Blue Jays fan too". That dude had no idea who the Blue Jays were. Just said the hat matched his clothes. Don't read too much into fashion from casuals or non fans. While I'm sure there's a small chance that this site is saved on Meghan's bookmarks, I think her being an actual fan is not very likely. 

Walking in Manhattan today with my Blue Jays gear on. Random people on streets talking to me. Go Blue Jays! they say. From old white woman to big black dudes. I think more Americans are cheering for the Jays than the Dodgers. 

[Stangstag]

1 hour ago, Laika said:

People are so lame lmao 

She probably doesn't even like baseball, guys. Just wearing hats. 

Yeah but she’s Canadian how dare she