Toronto Blue Jays Roster Discussion (2022)

[Terminator]

It’s too bad Berrios is looking like a land mine right now. Having three guys heading into this offseason would be a lot more comfortable than 2.5.

 

He's going to get it fixed.

[G-Snarls]

He's going to get it fixed.

 

Pete Walker do us all proud

[Stangstag]

So Springer had his elbow surgery. Bone spur removed. Should be fine for spring training

[Terminator]

Pete Walker do us all proud

 

The guy used to be considered a god around here after he turned Robbie Ray from a bum to the Cy Young winner. 1 year later along with Berrios, Kikuchi and another DUI and his stock has fallen pretty quickly.

[Laika]

Danny Jansen

 

for

 

Tyler O'Neill and Jordan Hicks or Alex Reyes

 

 

thoughts?

 

Toronto would probably trade Gurriel in a follow up move. Or Teo I guess.

[Ehjays]

So Springer had his elbow surgery. Bone spur removed. Should be fine for spring training

 

George Springer Undergoes Surgery To Remove Bone Spur; Expected To Be Ready For Spring Training

By Simon Hampton | October 27, 2022 at 2:25pm CDT

 

Blue Jays outfielder George Springer has undergone surgery to remove a bone spur from his right elbow, Kaitlyn McGrath of The Athletic reports. Springer is expected to be ready in time for spring training next year.

 

Into the second year of a six-year, $150MM deal signed in 2021, Springer had another successful season, slashing .267/.342/.472 with 25 home runs and grading out as slightly above average in center, earning one Outs Above Average. It earned Springer his fourth trip to the All Star game this summer, and his first as a Blue Jay.

 

There had been plenty of uncertainty around Springer heading into the off-season, given the way his season ended. The 32-year-old was carted off the field during the Jays wildcard loss to the Mariners after colliding with teammate Bo Bichette while pursuing a fly ball. Earlier in the off-season, Blue Jays general manager Ross Atkins said Springer sustained a concussion and a strained left shoulder in that collision, so given this surgery was on his right elbow it appears this is unrelated.

 

The injury concerns do raise question marks over Springer’s future in center though. While he remained slightly above average in 2022, his numbers are declining as his Outs Above Average dropped from three to one this year, and Defensive Runs Saved dropped to -4 from -1 in 2021. Given Springer’s injury and the fact 2023 will be his age-33 season, it’s fair to wonder if the Jays may opt to shift him to a corner spot or DH him more frequently and seek an external upgrade in center. Springer remains an elite player though, and with $96.7MM and four years remaining on his contract, Toronto will be motivated to give his body the best chance to hold up over the life of that deal.

[Ehjays]

Danny Jansen

 

for

 

Tyler O'Neill and Jordan Hicks or Alex Reyes

 

 

thoughts?

 

Toronto would probably trade Gurriel in a follow up move. Or Teo I guess.

 

O Neil is ok, he's a Canadian kid with a couple years of control left and a couple GG. St Louis fans have been wishing for a Healthy Reyes longer than we have been hoping for a healthy Pearson. I would pass on him. Hicks lights up the radar and is interesting.

[Terminator]

Danny Jansen

 

for

 

Tyler O'Neill and Jordan Hicks or Alex Reyes

 

 

thoughts?

 

Toronto would probably trade Gurriel in a follow up move. Or Teo I guess.

 

I'd do it. The trade tracker thinks it's fair as well. Not sure if the Cards would do it or not.

[Captain_Obvious]

Danny Jansen

 

for

 

Tyler O'Neill and Jordan Hicks or Alex Reyes

 

 

thoughts?

 

Toronto would probably trade Gurriel in a follow up move. Or Teo I guess.

 

How does this help the Blue Jays exactly?

[Laika]

How does this help the Blue Jays exactly?

 

O'Neill has higher demonstrated upside than Jansen; 5.6 WAR as recently as 2021.

 

He also had a tantalizing 2022 because he improved his plate discipline stats. He looks like a great buy low IMO.

 

He is a jacked thoroughbred toolshed who can realistically go 30/15 and he is a big defensive upgrade on a corner spot. He can even spot start in CF I think. Five tool talent.

 

Hicks or Reyes = one year of control for a bullpen lottery ticket with fireballing setup man upside. Of course, you can't expect much from either one and I don't think either is even worth that much. But as far as a throw in to close a value gap... hard to get more interesting arms than this.

 

You have to also assume they can get even value for Teoscar or Gurriel and turn them into a SP or something.

[glory]

Danny Jansen

 

for

 

Tyler O'Neill and Jordan Hicks or Alex Reyes

 

 

thoughts?

 

Toronto would probably trade Gurriel in a follow up move. Or Teo I guess.

 

O’Neill isn’t the best fit since he’s RH and isn’t a CF (or at least he hasn’t played there much), but yeah, this is the type of trade that I could see happening. Jansen isn’t desirable to non contending teams, and contenders are more likely to trade prospects (which wouldn’t interest the Jays), so getting an equivalent MLB player who plays a different position is probably the best case for Jansen. Whether you think O’Neill can come close to his 2021 numbers again is the question. Adding a hard throwing reliever in the deal like Hicks would make sense as well.

[wilko]

Danny Jansen

 

for

 

Tyler O'Neill and Jordan Hicks or Alex Reyes

 

 

thoughts?

 

Toronto would probably trade Gurriel in a follow up move. Or Teo I guess.

 

Yes plz.

[Captain_Obvious]

O'Neill has higher demonstrated upside than Jansen; 5.6 WAR as recently as 2021.

 

He also had a tantalizing 2022 because he improved his plate discipline stats. He looks like a great buy low IMO.

 

He is a jacked thoroughbred toolshed who can realistically go 30/15 and he is a big defensive upgrade on a corner spot. He can even spot start in CF I think. Five tool talent.

 

Hicks or Reyes = one year of control for a bullpen lottery ticket with fireballing setup man upside. Of course, you can't expect much from either one and I don't think either is even worth that much. But as far as a throw in to close a value gap... hard to get more interesting arms than this.

 

You have to also assume they can get even value for Teoscar or Gurriel and turn them into a SP or something.

 

O'Neil's 2021 season is an outlier. More importantly, his most recent performance is not great. You're valuing O'Neil closer to his 2021 year than his 2022 year when it should be the other way around.

 

That being said, my main issue is more about how it improves the Blue Jays because I wouldn't pick Hicks over any of the existing BP arms, so no improvement there. O'Neil's upgrade value over Gurriel is not significant enough (1-2 WAR). I would rather keep Jansen whose performance trajectory is actually up.

[Jimcanuck]

Given Springer’s injury and the fact 2023 will be his age-33 season, it’s fair to wonder if the Jays may opt to shift him to a corner spot or DH him more frequently and seek an external upgrade in center. Springer remains an elite player though, and with $96.7MM and four years remaining on his contract, Toronto will be motivated to give his body the best chance to hold up over the life of that deal.

 

I'd for sure move him to a corner, and tell him no diving for balls and watch out for Bo.

[L54]

He's going to get it fixed.

 

I like your optimism. It’s unlikely he’s as bad as he was this year, but for 19M over the next six years probably has most people a little uneasy.

[Carlos Danger]

You have to also assume they can get even value for Teoscar or Gurriel and turn them into a SP or something.

 

Marlins please!!! Great fit, both of them!!

[TheHurl]

It seems like such a good time for some of these teams to rebuild. Texas should move on from everyone they signed last year and start over. The Giants should stop trying to battle the giants of the NL West and start over. The Twins should be moving on from Correa, Max Kepler and Sonny Gray (both great targets for the Jays). I know it's easier to say as a non owner who doesn't have actual revenue on the line...but purely from a baseball side of things, now is the time.

[L54]

Not a fan of O’Neil. He has a similar profile to Chapman and in my opinion one of those guys is enough.

 

I don’t think Teo or Gurriel bring back much on terms of SP which makes this feel like a lateral move.

 

A good illustration of why you trade whatever catcher brings back the best return. If this was the best package for Jansen but Kirk lands Triston McKenzie I’d lean moving Kirk

[Ehjays]

 

a Few Jays are finalist for silver slugger

[John_Havok]

Springer had his elbow surgery today, expected to be ready for spring training.

[Stangstag]

 

a Few Jays are finalist for silver slugger

 

Silver Slugger candidate at every position save for 2B

 

Pretty sweet

[TheHurl]

 

a Few Jays are finalist for silver slugger

 

I hate the term "finalist". Just say top four in votes. Let's also let it sink in that some manager voted for Martin Maldonado and his 70 wRC+

[Stangstag]

I hate the term "finalist". Just say top four in votes. Let's also let it sink in that some manager voted for Martin Maldonado and his 70 wRC+

 

Lol yeah didn’t see his name there. I thought he was generally known as a terrible bat/great defender

[glory]

A good illustration of why you trade whatever catcher brings back the best return. If this was the best package for Jansen but Kirk lands Triston McKenzie I’d lean moving Kirk

 

If that is the rationale, and it's a logical one, then Kirk is the one to move because he's far more likely to get the type of return that would help the team short/long term over whatever Jansen will bring back. The reason to trade Jansen is almost entirely due to years of control. He has the least. Age is another factor, but honestly, given how unpredictable Kirk's aging curve will be due to his body type, I'm not even sure that's as big of a deal. If you can get Jansen on a team friendly extension, and then trade Kirk for a SP/CF/whatever that will significantly improve the club short and long term, then that's not a bad option at all. Really depends on what Kirk's market is right now.

[Jonn]

If that is the rationale, and it's a logical one, then Kirk is the one to move because he's far more likely to get the type of return that would help the team short/long term over whatever Jansen will bring back. The reason to trade Jansen is almost entirely due to years of control. He has the least. Age is another factor, but honestly, given how unpredictable Kirk's aging curve will be due to his body type, I'm not even sure that's as big of a deal. If you can get Jansen on a team friendly extension, and then trade Kirk for a SP/CF/whatever that will significantly improve the club short and long term, then that's not a bad option at all. Really depends on what Kirk's market is right now.

 

This is my mindset right now as well. It’s not that I don’t like Kirk. He’s just the most logical Catcher to trade to impact the roster in a meaningful way.

[Spanky99]

This is my mindset right now as well. It’s not that I don’t like Kirk. He’s just the most logical Catcher to trade to impact the roster in a meaningful way.

 

Or Moreno?

[Terminator]

A good illustration of why you trade whatever catcher brings back the best return. If this was the best package for Jansen but Kirk lands Triston McKenzie I’d lean moving Kirk

 

The Pillsbury Doughboy for Slender Man

[Terminator]

Cant wait to trade 4 years of Kirk or 6 years of Moreno so we can get 120 games out of Jansen the next two years before he bolts

[Jimcanuck]

Cant wait to trade 4 years of Kirk or 6 years of Moreno so we can get 120 games out of Jansen the next two years before he bolts

 

C'mon man. Kirk or Moreno don't get moved unless Jansen extends. If he doesn't, bye bye Jano

[Terminator]

C'mon man. Kirk or Moreno don't get moved unless Jansen extends. If he doesn't, bye bye Jano

 

Lol JimCanuck, famous Jays insider who has sources close to Atkins