General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2025)

[Laika]

Yimi to the IL noooo

[max silver]

35 minutes ago, PickleJ said:

I’d be down for that. Whatever he needs to do to get the ball past an outfielder, I’m down for.  And thanks for evidence based info. I always love that stuff, though I tend to be a bit too lazy to dig it up myself.  

My quick glance at his underlying metrics seems to indicate he is hitting the ball harder this year and his fly balls also seem to be up compared to his ground balls, though I’m not seeing much of a change in his spray chart (pull:middle:oppo).

Is this accurate or are you seeing something different? And if so, I’m curious if his exit velocities are up across the entire field or more so to the pull side. Because if they are up more so on the pull side, then it might be another indicator that he could  tap into some more production by becoming more pull focused, as you mentioned (though that probably goes against his natural instincts).

One idea I just had was to look up whether Kirk's been victimized by a lot of excellent defensive plays from opposition fielders. Sure enough he features 19th place among qualified hitters in MLB in the Statcast leaderboard with 4 outs above average produced on his batted balls. That can explain some of the discrepancy between his expected statistics and batted ball results. On a related Blue Jays note Andres Gimenez has been absolutely robbed by opposition fielders with 8 OAA against him from opposition fielders. 

Kirk has been hitting the ball very hard to all fields. To the pull side he's averaged 94.3 MPH, to the middle of the field he's averaged 93.6 MPH, and to the opposite field he's averaged 90.2 MPH. I suspect that Kirk is suffering from hitting too many deep fly balls to the deepest parts of the park but that's not something that I've looked up. 

[mphenhef]

23 hours ago, PickleJ said:

First time poster. Longtime Jays fan, not quite a day one Jays fan. But a fan since the beginnings of the Stieb, Fernandez, and Bell era Jays  

Finally signed up here because I’m excited about this year’s squad. I had grown weary of the Guerrero, Bichette, and Shapiro era, so I’ve been caught off guard by my current excitement level.

l love watching Barger try to tear the cover off the ball. I appreciate what Clement brings to the team defensively and enjoy watching him battle at the plate. I even enjoy when he works a walk, as I know that is violently against his nature. Kirk has always been good defensively in the most boring way by being elite at framing pitches, but he is fun to watch when he is driving the ball all over the diamond. Giminez can’t hit, but he is elite defensively and helps soothe my annoyance with Bichette at short. Straw can’t hit, but has been so valuable covering CF during Varsho’s extended absence. Lukes is good enough that I discovered I’ve been mispronouncing his name for years. Rodriguez and Little bring fire and intensity from the pen, and Fisher is like a modern day Mark Eichorn with his endless supply of off speed pitches (though Eichorn could never threw 96 mph).
 

And Springer’s dead cat has definitely bounced. 
 

Things are good when the only thing I’’m worried about is Heineman failing a PED test. That seems inevitable at this point, doesn’t it?

So I’m looking forward to rooting on the team with all of you for the rest of season, as we brainstorm unrealistic ways for the team to improve and whine intensely about the smallest of mistakes. I am hoping we all get to see a couple of electric starts from old man Scherzer in the playoffs. That would be fun.

 

Welcome to the board!

[mphenhef]

2 hours ago, Jonn said:

I don't think anyone would really be opposed to this. Gimenez has difficulties staying on the field to begin with. If nothing else the Yankees are rumored to really want him. It would be nice to both fill the Jays need and keep him from the Yankees.

The irony is the Yankees want him so Jazz doesn’t have to play a poor 3B…but despite being his primary position Suarez is not a better defender there.

[jaysblue]

2 hours ago, Eat My Shatkins said:

Jays are in a weird spot with the rotation because as it stands they have 5 'good' performing starters but at the same time they have 0 'elite' starters. And at the same time it feels like one or two wheels could fall off any minute now between Lauers track record or Scherzers thumb.

 

If you add another back of the rotation starter does it really move the needle? Well, if a wheel falls off then sure it does, but what if the wheels stay right where they are?

Seems like they should add a #1 somehow, and if they cant then just stand pat with the rotation and add a high leverage reliever or two.

Yeah exactly. 

That's why I would rather add one or two high leverage relievers to the pen, which would definitely help in a short Postseason series. 

As well, would target an arm that could start and/or pitch out of the pen (for example Michael Soroka would be a perfect fit). In case Lauer crashes or Scherzer goes down to injury, Soroka could step right into the rotation and be viable. If not, you have a potential elite multiple inning reliever which would be a nice weapon out of the pen! 

[mphenhef]

1 hour ago, Doubleplay21 said:

If the Jays win the division Atkins will win GM of the year for adding Giminez, Santander and Scherzer. They will be big factors in September.

 

The Straw trade has been great too despite the shitkicking he took from the league and fans at the time.  

[jaysblue]

2 hours ago, max silver said:

Suarez's bat would be a tremendous addition but he's a really imperfect fit for this roster. If/when Santander is ready to return that would create a monster logjam at the DH position. Both of Santander and Springer should be everyday players and each is best suited at DH due to declining defense. Barger needs to be in the lineup close to every day but this would serve to erode the available playing time for him. I think the team is well served with 3B positions with players on the roster, and there are a lot of high end DH options on the roster at present with all of Springer, Kirk, Vlad and eventually Santander being able to capably fill the position.

Yeah agreed.

Would welcome Suarez's bat, but with DH already being a logjam if they cycle Springer & Santander, you pretty much are relying on Suarez playing 3B majority of the time. Defensively, Jays infield takes a huge step back and he pretty much clogs up the base paths when on base. 

I'm not putting all my eggs in one basket in regards to Santander. If there is an opportunity to add another power hitting OF, would look into it. Can't rely or expect that Santander is going to come back as his old self for the final two months of the season. 

If the Jays could somehow extract some extra power out of Vladdy, Kirk and Bo down the stretch, that definitely would go a long way! 

[PickleJ]

59 minutes ago, max silver said:

One idea I just had was to look up whether Kirk's been victimized by a lot of excellent defensive plays from opposition fielders. Sure enough he features 19th place among qualified hitters in MLB in the Statcast leaderboard with 4 outs above average produced on his batted balls. That can explain some of the discrepancy between his expected statistics and batted ball results. On a related Blue Jays note Andres Gimenez has been absolutely robbed by opposition fielders with 8 OAA against him from opposition fielders. 

Kirk has been hitting the ball very hard to all fields. To the pull side he's averaged 94.3 MPH, to the middle of the field he's averaged 93.6 MPH, and to the opposite field he's averaged 90.2 MPH. I suspect that Kirk is suffering from hitting too many deep fly balls to the deepest parts of the park but that's not something that I've looked up. 

Thanks. That interesting stuff. It does seem like Kirk still has room to grow. Hitting the ball hard again was a good first step. Perhaps pulling the ball a bit more will be the next  

And. I never thought of digging into OAA from the perspective of the hitter getting robbed.. The Giminez numbers to match my eye, as he always looks like he’s in the verge of figuring things out at the plate. It must mentally challenging to have a few down years offensively, come to a new team, and then get robbed over and over again. 

[Brownie19]

2 hours ago, Laika said:

Yimi to the IL noooo

Sprained left ankle at least - shouldn't be a long term thing 

[John_Havok]

1 hour ago, Brownie19 said:

Sprained left ankle at least - shouldn't be a long term thing 

He was the guy who was complaining about the landing spot on the mound wasn't he and the grounds crew had to come out to fill a hole?

[spats]

In the last 10 games the Jays picked up 6 games on the Yanks and 5 on the Rays. I love this team.

[max silver]

2 hours ago, Brownie19 said:

Sprained left ankle at least - shouldn't be a long term thing 

Apparently it happened when he slipped getting into the hot/cold recovery tubs. That's just peak irony for a guy to injure himself when undergoing injury prevention/recovery maintenance. 

[Brownie19]

1 hour ago, John_Havok said:

He was the guy who was complaining about the landing spot on the mound wasn't he and the grounds crew had to come out to fill a hole?

Yes, he was I believe...no idea if that caused an injury or not.

[Big_Walleye]

34 minutes ago, max silver said:

Apparently it happened when he slipped getting into the hot/cold recovery tubs. That's just peak irony for a guy to injure himself when undergoing injury prevention/recovery maintenance. 

What a history of stupid injuries the Jays have!  Bichette steps on a ball just the other day.  Now Jimi.  Votto stepping on the bat in the dugout last year.  I remember a pitcher falling down the dugout steps a while back too.  Can't remember who offhand.

[max silver]

3 minutes ago, Big_Walleye said:

What a history of stupid injuries the Jays have!  Bichette steps on a ball just the other day.  Now Jimi.  Votto stepping on the bat in the dugout last year.  I remember a pitcher falling down the dugout steps a while back too.  Can't remember who offhand.

My favorite wacky injury was when Daulton Pompey suffered from a concussion by having some bats fall on his head from the top of a locker. 

[Big_Walleye]

3 minutes ago, max silver said:

My favorite wacky injury was when Daulton Pompey suffered from a concussion by having some bats fall on his head from the top of a locker. 

Yeah!  Forgot about that one.

[Eat My Shatkins]

14 minutes ago, Big_Walleye said:

What a history of stupid injuries the Jays have!  Bichette steps on a ball just the other day.  Now Jimi.  Votto stepping on the bat in the dugout last year.  I remember a pitcher falling down the dugout steps a while back too.  Can't remember who offhand.

Wasn't it Robbie Ray who biffed it down some stairs in his house during pre-season in his Cy Young year?

[Big_Walleye]

1 minute ago, Eat My Shatkins said:

Wasn't it Robbie Ray who biffed it down some stairs in his house during pre-season in his Cy Young year?

That sounds right.  I was sure someone fell down the dugout steps too.

[Big_Walleye]

Apparently there's quite a history:

Michael Saunders tore the meniscus in his knee stepping on a sprinkler head.

Brett Cecil cut himself with a knife one year and cut his fingers on a blender the very next year.

Colby Rasmus got hit in the head by a throw from Anthony Gose during warmup.

Paul Quantrill broke his leg snowmobiling.

Maicer Izturis tore up his knee falling down the dugout steps.

Rickey Henderson got frostbite on his leg from an icepack.

Glenallen Hill woke up from a bad dream freaked out and fell down the stairs.

Roberto Alomar got stitches in his forehead from an injury that occurred while he was taking a leak. Lol.

I know there's more...

[Laika]

The Blue Jays announced a flurry of roster moves this morning, headlined by their move to place second baseman Andres Gimenez on the 10-day injured list. Outfielder Joey Loperfido was recalled to the big league roster to replace Gimenez. In a second set of moves, right-hander Ryan Burr was activated from the 60-day injured list. Right-hander Lazaro Estrada was optioned to Triple-A and outfielder Will Robertson was designated for assignment to make room for Burr on the active and 40-man rosters respectively.

[John_Havok]

19 minutes ago, Laika said:

The Blue Jays announced a flurry of roster moves this morning, headlined by their move to place second baseman Andres Gimenez on the 10-day injured list. Outfielder Joey Loperfido was recalled to the big league roster to replace Gimenez. In a second set of moves, right-hander Ryan Burr was activated from the 60-day injured list. Right-hander Lazaro Estrada was optioned to Triple-A and outfielder Will Robertson was designated for assignment to make room for Burr on the active and 40-man rosters respectively.

Damn, Robertson has a legit chance of being claimed by someone, but there really aren't a lot of true DFA worthy players on the roster right now. 

[mphenhef]

I knew it was going to happen and get it but it is a shame to see Estrada rewarded with being optioned for pitching a solid 4 innings.

[PickleJ]

1 hour ago, John_Havok said:

Damn, Robertson has a legit chance of being claimed by someone, but there really aren't a lot of true DFA worthy players on the roster right now. 

Yeah, I’m a bit disappointed to see this. I was slow to warm to Robertson, but I also think some late bloomers are helpful for roster construction, as they typically have option years through their late 20s and won’t reach arbitration until their 30s. That’s inexpensive depth. I’d be surprised if he is snagged. He’d probably mash in Sacramento. 

[PickleJ]

And I don’t mean to sidetrack the discussion into one that is more trade deadline, roster management, and prospect related (feel free to point this rookie in the direction of those threads if this is being discussed elsewhere.). 
 

But what is the current state of the Jays 40 man/minor league pool heading into the trade deadline? Specifically, from the perspective where can we deal from depth, either because we have multiple good prospects of the same type or because we need to clear a logjam of rule 5 eligible players (or deal from the 40 man because we have a player we want to elevate from the minors).

[John_Havok]

47 minutes ago, PickleJ said:

And I don’t mean to sidetrack the discussion into one that is more trade deadline, roster management, and prospect related (feel free to point this rookie in the direction of those threads if this is being discussed elsewhere.). 
 

But what is the current state of the Jays 40 man/minor league pool heading into the trade deadline? Specifically, from the perspective where can we deal from depth, either because we have multiple good prospects of the same type or because we need to clear a logjam of rule 5 eligible players (or deal from the 40 man because we have a player we want to elevate from the minors).

Naw its fine to be discussed here.

Basically, the 40 man roster is in a pretty good place right now. As far as pitching goes, there's nobody there that's a clear "he's useless, who cares" which is good. 

Guys who are still being developed as SPs, Macko (just back from TJ surgery), Manoah (still out but nearing a return from surgery), Bloss (just had TJ surgery, not back till mid next year) Lazardo, Pina, Bastardo (had TJ last June but he was a rule 5 pickup they knew was gonna hurt all year), and Bowden Francis (on the IL with shoulder inpingement). No real rush on clearing 40 man roster spots this season until Manoah is back. 

Position player side... lots of decent depth options already on the roster, some of whom will probably be dealt away at the deadline. Think Wagner, Roden, Loperfido, Schneider, Jimenez, Clase, Lukes. All these guys have skillsets that allow them to play in the bigs in specifically designed roles, but likely aren't full time players long term. 

As for who would rule 5 eligible...just look at the 2021 high school drafted and 2022 college drafted to see if any names jump out as needing protection. 

[PickleJ]

19 minutes ago, John_Havok said:

Naw its fine to be discussed here.

Basically, the 40 man roster is in a pretty good place right now. As far as pitching goes, there's nobody there that's a clear "he's useless, who cares" which is good. 

Guys who are still being developed as SPs, Macko (just back from TJ surgery), Manoah (still out but nearing a return from surgery), Bloss (just had TJ surgery, not back till mid next year) Lazardo, Pina, Bastardo (had TJ last June but he was a rule 5 pickup they knew was gonna hurt all year), and Bowden Francis (on the IL with shoulder inpingement). No real rush on clearing 40 man roster spots this season until Manoah is back. 

Position player side... lots of decent depth options already on the roster, some of whom will probably be dealt away at the deadline. Think Wagner, Roden, Loperfido, Schneider, Jimenez, Clase, Lukes. All these guys have skillsets that allow them to play in the bigs in specifically designed roles, but likely aren't full time players long term. 

As for who would rule 5 eligible...just look at the 2021 high school drafted and 2022 college drafted to see if any names jump out as needing protection. 

Thanks…. I’ve scanned the org depth chart recently and came up with Tiedemann and Kasevich as two bigger names that require protecting.  Then there is Pinango as a lower/midle end prospect. And Rojas as one of those younger prospects that requires protecting.  Don’t know if I’m missing anyone.

I’m also curious of what the Jays do with Martinez, Jiminez, and Clase, as they will all be out of options next year. So I could see moving those guys out.  

Yesevage and Nimmala are also moving faster than I expected, so they may be in consideration in the near future (next season or two). Plus with older guys like Estrada (just added), Clarke, Robertson (if not claimed), McCarty, and Nunez/Tirotta, there appears ample depth to fill out the 40 moving forward. 
 

I’m just not certain how the Jays go big game hunting at the deadline without including Yesevage or Nimmala. Or who they could acquire using their depth pieces such as Jiminez or Clase. Or what value players like Stephn or Stanifer have. 

[John_Havok]

1 minute ago, PickleJ said:

Thanks…. I’ve scanned the org depth chart recently and came up with Tiedemann and Kasevich as two bigger names that require protecting.  Then there is Pinango as a lower/midle end prospect. And Rojas as one of those younger prospects that requires protecting.  Don’t know if I’m missing anyone.

I’m also curious of what the Jays do with Martinez, Jiminez, and Clase, as they will all be out of options next year. So I could see moving those guys out.  

Yesevage and Nimmala are also moving faster than I expected, so they may be in consideration in the near future (next season or two). Plus with older guys like Estrada (just added), Clarke, Robertson (if not claimed), McCarty, and Nunez/Tirotta, there appears ample depth to fill out the 40 moving forward. 
 

I’m just not certain how the Jays go big game hunting at the deadline without including Yesevage or Nimmala. Or who they could acquire using their depth pieces such as Jiminez or Clase. Or what value players like Stephn or Stanifer have. 

To answer that last question, they cant go after an ace without including one of Nimmala or Yesavage for sure.

The depth guys could land a rental, but there would be more than 1 of them involved most likely. Look at the trades last year the Jays pulled off. Even other guys you mentioned like Kasevich, Stanifer etc could get used in those trades.

[PickleJ]

22 minutes ago, John_Havok said:

To answer that last question, they cant go after an ace without including one of Nimmala or Yesavage for sure.

The depth guys could land a rental, but there would be more than 1 of them involved most likely. Look at the trades last year the Jays pulled off. Even other guys you mentioned like Kasevich, Stanifer etc could get used in those trades.

That’s what I was thinking. Do you think Alcantara or Cabrera are considered an aces right now or can they acquired with Kasevich and Stanifer level prospects? Both do have some control left, so there is also that to consider.

[John_Havok]

2 hours ago, PickleJ said:

That’s what I was thinking. Do you think Alcantara or Cabrera are considered an aces right now or can they acquired with Kasevich and Stanifer level prospects? Both do have some control left, so there is also that to consider.

I consider neither of them to be aces currently, though Alcantara has an ace history. Given the control of either pitcher remaining, no, I don't think a package of Kasevich or Stanifer level prospects would get it done, but trade returns are highly dependent on the team doing the evaluating of the Jays prospects. Do they want prospects only or do they want a near major league ready arm like Estrada, plus prospects? That's the kind of thing that can vary from FO to FO. 

One thing most teams have become very much better at in recent history is not trading their top prospects for rentals (unless they're truly on the cusp and the rental is a bonafide stud), and not trading top prospects for non-impact talent, even with control. 

I really don't see any aces available at the deadline TBH, unless there's some out there that we just haven't heard about that might be available. There's been rumblings of teams checking with Pittsburgh about Skenes, but that's probably just click-baiting. 

 

 

[PickleJ]

32 minutes ago, John_Havok said:

I consider neither of them to be aces currently, though Alcantara has an ace history. Given the control of either pitcher remaining, no, I don't think a package of Kasevich or Stanifer level prospects would get it done, but trade returns are highly dependent on the team doing the evaluating of the Jays prospects. Do they want prospects only or do they want a near major league ready arm like Estrada, plus prospects? That's the kind of thing that can vary from FO to FO. 

One thing most teams have become very much better at in recent history is not trading their top prospects for rentals (unless they're truly on the cusp and the rental is a bonafide stud), and not trading top prospects for non-impact talent, even with control. 

I really don't see any aces available at the deadline TBH, unless there's some out there that we just haven't heard about that might be available. There's been rumblings of teams checking with Pittsburgh about Skenes, but that's probably just click-baiting. 

 

 

Peralta might be the closest. Not really an ace. But his cheap contract pushes his value up. 
 

I’ll be honest. I have lost a sense the prospect capital required to bring in different types of players at the deadline, and it might just be related to the fact teams are more reluctant to deal top prospects at this time, which means the bidding war features that second level of prospects and their value can be very much in the eye of the beholder. The extra wildcard may also add to the murkiness. 
 

So I find much more difficult to anticipate deadline deals now than I did in the past, and so when the Jays hint at their desire to add a starter, a reliever, and a right handed bat now, I know I have to let go of my expectations and prepare to be somewhat surprised.