Around Baseball 2021

[Carlos Danger]

Dude, Kameron Misner is a good get for Wendle, chalk this up as a W for the Rays, Imo. Marlins prospect capital is stacked. Fangraphs has him 11th in their rankings. Not sure where BA and BP have him, but the kid has loud tools.

 

I think the FO of the Marlins and the industry somewhat has placed Peyton Burdick above Misner.. It used to be vice versa. However, probably a reason the Marlins were willing to part with him. Still like both of those guys..

[John_Havok]

Expect to hear the "both sides" ******** when it's all on the owners.

 

Maybe 90%.

[Spanky__99]

OMFG

 

Post of the month

 

TY

 

Yeah... cracked me up.

[G-Snarls]

No More Negotiations Scheduled Between Owners, Players Prior To CBA ExpirationDecember 1st, 2021 at 2:04pm CST • By Mark Polishuk

 

2:04PM: This afternoon’s session between the two sides concluded after seven minutes, according to ESPN.com’s Jeff Passan (Twitter links). There won’t be any more negotiations today, and the lockout is expected to begin this evening once the current CBA officially expires.

[G-Snarls]

f***...

[Stangstag]

Expect to hear the "both sides" ******** when it's all on the owners.

 

It IS both sides being stubborn though? Obviously the owners have more money but the players ask for a lot of unrealistic s*** sometimes.

 

Idk, I feel its pretty disingenuous to blame just one side here.

[Dick_Pole]

If he ever plays 150 games they might have to pay it out... In fact I think they'd be happy to pay it out.

 

I'd sign Vlad to a 10 year 200 million dollar contract with double that bonus structure. I think.

 

It would kind of work wouldn't it? If he is MVP caliber he gets 40 million, if he is an all star 30 million, if he gets fat again and hits ground balls he still gets 20 million but at least you save half the money...

 

I'm so used to seeing "would of" from Olerud I actually got a seizure realizing "of" was the right word here this time.

[Spanky__99]

I'm so used to seeing "would of" from Olerud I actually got a seizure realizing "of" was the right word here this time.

 

*of*

 

Oh, was the right word, lol.

[Stangstag]

What's unrealistic?

 

Just off the top of my head, I seem to remember the players were asking for 100% salary in 2020 even though stadiums couldn’t have any fans. (This was in April/May)

 

Anyways my point still stands, its both sides’ fault that a strike is happening.

[John_Havok]

Just off the top of my head, I seem to remember the players were asking for 100% salary in 2020 even though stadiums couldn’t have any fans. (This was in April/May)

 

Anyways my point still stands, its both sides’ fault that a strike is happening.

 

I had the same conversation with someone at work today about that, and used that exact same example. Like.. how could the players demand full salary in a reduced schedule with the owners not only not getting fans in the stands, but for less games, and less TV revenue?

 

But that's the reality of negotiating at that level, both sides intentionally ask for insanely unreasonable things that they know will get rejected so they arrive in the middle at what they really want. It's especially sad when both knows know that's what both sides do, and still do it while pretending that they don't.

[Spanky__99]

Just off the top of my head, I seem to remember the players were asking for 100% salary in 2020 even though stadiums couldn’t have any fans. (This was in April/May)

 

Anyways my point still stands, its both sides’ fault that a strike is happening.

 

I agree on the former, but that's one thing, a 90% greed from ownership, a floor and Luxury tax isn't a bad idea. Again, Billionaires vs Millionaires. Ownership is shrewd and kniving. The MLPA are babies in this scenario.

[jerb]

 

Andy Martino

@martinonyc

 

Billy Eppler said he was talking to a club within the past hour, and teams are behaving like there is still time to make trades tonight before CBA expires.

[King]

Stroman to the Cubs

[Abomination]

7 minutes - jesus f***. This negotiation ******** is f***ing stupid. Lock the door and try to resolve something like humans instead of using tactics to get what you want.

 

Treat it like electing a Pope. Lock the door and no one comes out until they come to agreement.

[Stangstag]

Treat it like electing a Pope. Lock the door and no one comes out until they come to agreement.

 

They still have 2 months until spring training starts, they won’t resort to this until late Feb.... maybe

[Dick_Pole]

Whatever stupidity comes from the CBA farce over the next two months before things get serious, I really, really hope they keep it to themselves and don't try to one-up each other in the media to gain sympathy like they did with the pandemic negotiations.

[glory]

They still have 2 months until spring training starts, they won’t resort to this until late Feb.... maybe

 

Yeah they are not going to "lock themselves in a room and not leave without an agreement" until there is a real threat of losing games, and that's not going to be there until the first week of February. So the next two months are going to suck for baseball fans.

[John_Havok]

Partial list of negotiating topics:

 

FREE AGENCY

 

MLB: Would keep existing system or change eligibility to age 29.5 rather than six years of major league service, which it has been since 1976.

 

MLBPA: Would keep existing system for 2022-23 offseason, then would for 2023-24 and 2024-25 offseasons make eligibility six years of service or five years of service and age 30.5, whichever comes earlier, and then for 2025-26 offseason and later, six years of service or five years of service and age 29.5, whichever comes earlier.

 

FREE AGENT DRAFT PICK COMPENSATION

MLB: Would agree to eliminate penalties for teams signing free agents who turned down a qualifying offer. Draft pick compensation has existed since 1976.

 

SALARY ARBITRATION

MLB: Would keep current system or replace it with salaries based primarily on award recognition and career Fangraphs WAR, saying the change would address MLBPA’s concerns about paying younger players based on value. Players currently eligible for arbitration under the expired CBA would be grandfathered and have the choice of salary arbitration or the new system.

 

MLBPA: Would lower eligibility to two years of major league service, its level from 1974 through 1986, when it increased to three years. In the expired agreement, it was three years plus the top 22% by service time of players with at least two years but less than three years.

 

 

LUXURY TAX

Threshold was $210 million in 2021, with tax rates of 20% for first offender, 30% for exceeding in consecutive years and 50% for exceeding in three or more consecutive years. Surcharge for exceeding $230 million and $250 million.

 

MLB: Proposed raising threshold to $214 million in 2022 and offered an option of a $100 million payroll minimum funded by a 25% tax on payrolls above $180 million. Tax threshold would rise to $220 million in final season.

 

MLBPA: Proposed raising threshold starting at $245 million for the 2022 season and eliminating non-tax penalties.

 

SERVICE TIME

 

MLBPA: Made proposals aimed to prevent what it says is service-time manipulation, including allow accruing of service time for rookies for awards and special accomplishments.

 

MLB: Rejected MLBPA proposals

 

AMATEUR DRAFT

 

MLB: Proposed an NBA/NHL-style draft lottery for top three selections.

 

MLBPA: Accepted the concept of a weighted lottery but would expand the number of teams to eight and make adjustments designed to incentivize competition.

 

PRE-ARBITRATION PLAYERS

 

MLBPA: Proposed pool from central revenues for pre-arbitration players, to be allocated based on award recognition and WAR.

 

MLB: Smaller pool funded from revenue, partly from expanded playoffs and luxury tax proceeds currently assigned to other purposes.

 

MINIMUM SALARY

 

Usually one of the last items addressed. Was $570,500 in the major leagues in 2021, $46,600 in the minor leagues for a player signing his initial major league contract and $93,000 in the minor leagues for a player signing a second or later major league contract.

Both sides would raise minimum but disagree on amounts.

 

POSTSEASON

 

MLB: Would expand postseason from 10 to 14 teams, with wild cards increasing from two per league to four. Division winner with best record in each league would advance directly to Division Series, and the other two division winners and wild-card teams would start in a best-of-three round.

The division winner with the second-best record would choose its opponent from among the three lowest-seeded wild-card teams. The division winner with the third-best record would then get to pick from among the remaining two wild cards. The top wild card would face whichever team is left over after the division winners make their choices.

 

MLBPA: 12-team expanded playoffs and possible realignment to two divisions per league, subject to agreement on MLBPA economic proposals.

 

DESIGNATED HITTER

 

MLB has offered to accept MLBPA’s proposal to extend the designated hitter to the National League, subject to agreement on postseason expansion. The DH has been used in the American League since 1973 and was used in both leagues during the pandemic-shortened 2020 season.

 

UNIFORMS ADVERTISEMENTS

 

MLB: Proposed adding uniform advertising patches.

 

MLBPA: Would agree, subject to agreement on MLBPA economic proposals.

 

REVENUE SHARING

 

MLBPA says MLB has rejected all its proposed changes and indicated that it would not agree to any changes. MLB says the changes would eliminate $100 million of revenue sharing money currently going to small-market teams in a system that has been largely in place since the 1997 agreement.

 

INTERNATIONAL DRAFT

MLB has proposed an international draft, which the MLBPA has long opposed.

[Ehjays]

[Jays24]

There are a lot of good changes that can be made as long as both sides are reasonable. MLBPA's recommendation for the luxury tax increase seems like a joke. I could see that being the biggest issue.

[John_Havok]

There are a lot of good changes that can be made as long as both sides are reasonable. MLBPA's recommendation for the luxury tax increase seems like a joke. I could see that being the biggest issue.

 

That’s one way to look at it. An optimistic look would be that both sides seem to agree that it needs to be raised, so it’s a likely thing that can agreed on.

 

As is expanded playoffs, universal DH, draft lottery, minimum salary increases, uniform advertising (f***)

 

Looks like the major sticking points are international draft, revenue sharing, and service time issues.

[Eat My Shatkins]

f***ing ****s

 

Better not miss a season right when the Jays have built a legit contender and all their young core players are still relatively cheap.

[Stangstag]

So DH in the NL is looking like 100% for 2022.

 

And the advertisements on jerseys (YUCK)

[Brownie19]

Yeah they are not going to "lock themselves in a room and not leave without an agreement" until there is a real threat of losing games, and that's not going to be there until the first week of February. So the next two months are going to suck for baseball fans.

 

For f*** sakes - can't they think about the guys trying to book trips to Spring Training 2022?

[jerb]

 

Jeff Passan

@JeffPassan

 

Outfielder Hunter Renfroe has been traded from the Boston Red Sox to the Milwaukee Brewers, sources tell ESPN.

[TwistedLogic]

[jaysguy44]

I don't quite understand why the Sox would do that deal..

[Grant77]

 

Jeff Passan

@JeffPassan

 

Outfielder Hunter Renfroe has been traded from the Boston Red Sox to the Milwaukee Brewers, sources tell ESPN.

 

Clearly not much value was assigned to Renfroe. Milwaukee is essentially selling 2 mediocre prospects for 9.5 million.

[thatoneguy]

So it begins...

[Spanky__99]

Why?