General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2024)

[Eat My Shatkins]

That's a new lower low level of complaining about IKF that I never thought we'd sink to lol

[Jays24]

[glory]

Anyone else feel Otto Lopez would probably be more valuable to an MLB Roster right now over IKF?

 

I can see Lopez making the Giants and playing a lot for them.

 

Lopez had a 65 wRC+ in AAA (346 PA) last season and is out of options. I mean, being more valuable than IKF isn't a high bar, so I guess it's possible if he figures something out, but I don't think it would have been wise for the Jays to bank on that in 2024.

 

The Jays should have stuck with their internal options over signing IKF, though. That I would agree with. Biggio, Espinal, and Clement on the big league side, and then a bunch of prospect depth in the minors. Oh well, just have to hope he has a couple of good seasons in him. Atkins has had a pretty good run with FA signings over the past few years (Ray, Springer, Semien, Phelps, Garcia, Gausman, Kikuchi, KK, Bassitt, Belt, Green). IKF does feel a lot closer to Roark/Morales than those ones, though.

[Omar]

 

Shulman's son is going to be the radio PBP guy.

 

Pure nepotism. They canned Ben Wagner who was 100x better.

[Jonn]

You can't say he PROBABLY would be more valuable when his wRC+ in AAA was like 66 and he has no options

 

Isn't IKF projected for not much higher at the MLB level. Plus Otto Lopez had a couple injuries last year and he got off to an absolute horrendous start. I am willing to bet steamer has them close.

[jaysblue]

Its funny because of all the players the Jays have the one that I would want to get rid of the most to free up salary is IKF lol especially considering the 2nd year.

 

Rather have Biggo/Espinal at their price tags/1 year commitments than him.

 

I said this at the time of the IKF signing: I have no problem with the Jays bringing him aboard as a utility option who could play all over, but if his salary prevents the Jays from upgrading the roster in other areas, would be disappointed. Looks like that could be the case. As well, they shouldn't have had to go two-years on him, which is still a head scratcher IMO.

[Brownie19]

Pure nepotism. They canned Ben Wagner who was 100x better.

 

Oh wow - I didn't know Ben Wagner was gone. I thought he was great. I would have thought there was room for both either on the radio and/or the television broadcast.

[Laika]

Pure nepotism. They canned Ben Wagner who was 100x better.

 

Yeah but Ben Wagner was entering arb3 and he was getting pretty expensive

[Laika]

Isn't IKF projected for not much higher at the MLB level. Plus Otto Lopez had a couple injuries last year and he got off to an absolute horrendous start. I am willing to bet steamer has them close.

 

Their wRC+ projections are pretty close

 

But defense is the problem. We know IKF is a good 3B and acceptable defender all over. Lopez might be a bad defender, that makes his floor negative WAR and that realistic possibility makes him unsuitable. Can't take risks like that on the 26 man roster in the Jays current situation. If the team was rebuilding, sure you give him a year.

[BTS]

People are actually upset about losing a 25-year old out-of-options infielder with a wRC+ of 65 at AAA last year? This is what you want - a team with the 40-man roster depth that makes it impossible to carry Otto Lopezes.

[Laika]

People are actually upset about losing a 25-year old out-of-options infielder with a wRC+ of 65 at AAA last year? This is what you want - a team with the 40-man roster depth that makes it impossible to carry Otto Lopezes.

 

nah it's just a criticism of IKF

 

"hey, this guy we are paying 7.5M for is barely better than the kid we just DFAd lol"

 

fair point tbh even if it ignores what we know about defense

 

Toronto has to be right about something that escapes public perception on IKF to look good.

 

Or not because it's $7.5M and nobody should even care about that much money...

[BTS]

nah it's just a criticism of IKF

 

"hey, this guy we are paying 7.5M for is barely better than the kid we just DFAd lol"

 

fair point tbh even if it ignores what we know about defense

 

Toronto has to be right about something that escapes public perception on IKF to look good.

 

Or not because it's $7.5M and nobody should even care about that much money...

 

I guess there are two different complaints:

 

IKF likely being the primary 3B

IKF getting 7.5M a year

 

The first is a legitimate concern for a contending team, but there are a lot of 3B options to throw at the wall if he doesn't look good.

The second is silly. 7.5M on, say, a luxury bench piece the team thinks is highly likely to give them 1-2 WAR while playing multiple positions is not a problem. That's middle reliever money.

 

Attaching Otto Lopez to any of these complaints is just weird. You don't want Otto Lopez on your 40-man roster.

[Brownie19]

nah it's just a criticism of IKF

 

"hey, this guy we are paying 7.5M for is barely better than the kid we just DFAd lol"

 

fair point tbh even if it ignores what we know about defense

 

Toronto has to be right about something that escapes public perception on IKF to look good.

 

Or not because it's $7.5M and nobody should even care about that much money...

 

People care because there's a perception that we're out of budget and some of the very good players are still unsigned, presumably with their pricing dropping and he may restrict our ability to go sign one of those guys on a bargain.

[BTS]

People care because there's a perception that we're out of budget and some of the very good players are still unsigned, presumably with their pricing dropping and he may restrict our ability to go sign one of those guys on a bargain.

 

There is a 0% chance the team is saying "well f***, it turns out we can get Chapman or Bellinger but unfortunately we're spending 3% of our budget on Isaiah Kiner-Falefa so we'll have to pass". It's absurd to even entertain the possibility that this is happening.

[Laika]

There is a 0% chance the team is saying "well f***, it turns out we can get Chapman or Bellinger but unfortunately we're spending 3% of our budget on Isaiah Kiner-Falefa so we'll have to pass". It's absurd to even entertain the possibility that this is happening.

 

nevertheless, luxury tax doomers are doing it

[Brownie19]

There is a 0% chance the team is saying "well f***, it turns out we can get Chapman or Bellinger but unfortunately we're spending 3% of our budget on Isaiah Kiner-Falefa so we'll have to pass". It's absurd to even entertain the possibility that this is happening.

 

I'm just telling you - I think that's what several people on this board are thinking right now and they're developing opinions that Atkins is a s***** GM because of it.

[Governator]

So my rogers bill just increased today, we're definitely signing someone this week.

[Terminator]

Steamer adjusted IKF's projections recently, likely due to him playing mostly 3B this year instead of mostly corner OF last year. His WAR went up to 1.1 in 112 games played and his Steamer600 is 1.4 now. I believe it was 0.8 and 1.1 last time I checked.

 

Jays are going to squeeze 2+ WAR out of this *******. Watch.

[BTS]

Still can’t believe the Yankees took an elite 3B defender with a noodle bat and started him almost 100 times in the most, more than half those on a corner.

[Jays24]

Still can’t believe the Yankees took an elite 3B defender with a noodle bat and started him almost 100 times in the most, more than half those on a corner.

 

Varsho says hi.

 

I joke, I joke... kind of lol

[Jays24]

[bowden] The Cubs, Blue Jays and Angels seem to be the most likely destinations for Bellinger... The Blue Jays and Giants are the two teams that have shown the most interest in Chapman

[L54]

Every day that passes the closer Chapman is to taking a one year deal

[Laika]

The Jays are definitely just trying to get one of them on a pure stink bid

 

So, you'd definitely still bet on the field

[Laika]

Every day that passes the closer Chapman is to taking a one year deal

 

Would kind of be hell if you were a player who liked baseball, to have your peers and friends reporting to spring while you are unemployed for purely financial reasons

[Jays24]

The Jays are definitely just trying to get one of them on a pure stink bid

 

So, you'd definitely still bet on the field

 

Wonder if we put up a poll on which player Jays fans would prefer based on their somewhat revised projected contracts.

 

- Bellinger means full time ABs for IFK but a lefty to put at the top of the order for lineup balance. Can also backup Vlad.

- Chappy means full time ABs for Varsho/KK and makes three IFK signing kinda pointless.

 

Personally I think it's Bellinger even if we gotta pay slightly more.

Edited February 14, 2024 by Jays24

[Laika]

I would prefer Chapman. 3B is more of a hole than anywhere in the OF, and he will be a smaller long term commitment.

 

IKF just slides into the Merrifield role, so he's not pointless at all

[M.E.]

Wonder if we put up a poll on which player Jays fans would prefer based on their somewhat revised projected contracts.

 

- Bellinger means full time ABs for IFK but a lefty to put at the top of the order for lineup balance. Can also backup Vlad.

- Chappy means full time ABs for Varsho/KK and makes three IFK signing kinds pointless.

 

Personally I think it's Bellinger even if we gotta pay slightly more.

 

 

Bell for me. He fits better and I am done watching Chapman do nothing with the bat (sans one month last year). I am willing to give IKF a shot and then let the prospects come try and fill that spot mid season if he is terrible.

[Terminator]

Both the Giants and Cubs have 3B trade options. So if they sign Chapman something could shake loose there.

 

The Giants have JD Davis and Wilmer Flores.

 

The Cubs have Miles Mastrobuoni who bats left and projects for 96 wRC+. He seems like a decent defender at 3B. He and Kinder-Falafel could form the most uninspiring and mediocre 3 WAR platoon in baseball history.

[G-Snarls]

I would prefer Chapman. 3B is more of a hole than anywhere in the OF, and he will be a smaller long term commitment.

 

IKF just slides into the Merrifield role, so he's not pointless at all

 

I think Chapman makes the most sense LOGICALLY in exactly the scenario you mention

 

The problem is in the gut feeling it then just feels so much like last year's team that it's hard to be optimistic about the offense. We've just replaced Belt with Turner otherwise it's identical. There's still upside for the 2023 underperformers but I suppose that's the case no matter what you do at this point.

 

I was hoping for a strong corner OF bat and a good DH but we only got 1/2. I love Kiermaier for what he is but wanted a stronger bat. Never wanted IKF at all - he's an offense downgrade at any position you play him.

 

All that said, of the remaining players available singing Chapman probably does make the most sense.

[Stangstag]

I think Chapman makes the most sense LOGICALLY in exactly the scenario you mention

 

The problem is in the gut feeling it then just feels so much like last year's team that it's hard to be optimistic about the offense. We've just replaced Belt with Turner otherwise it's identical. There's still upside for the 2023 underperformers but I suppose that's the case no matter what you do at this point.

 

I was hoping for a strong corner OF bat and a good DH but we only got 1/2.

 

All that said, of the remaining players available singing Chapman probably does make the most sense.

 

Heart says Bellinger, brain says Chapman.