General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2023)

[M.E.]

 

It's bound to happen. Hopefully Tiedemann fulfills his promise by that point.

 

I also believe that Manoah will put his s*** together over the off season and get back on track. He could be a huge (pun intended) bounce back option next year.

[BatFlip]

Didn't Atkins target Ryu to a big contract a couple of years ago? How about other guys like Tanner Roark, Chase Anderson, Clay Buchholz? They couldn't stay healthy and weren't effective.

 

Kudos to Atkins for putting together a strong rotation. I don't think anyone is disagreeing that the rotation has been one of the teams main strengths season and Atkins deserves credit. But if it's bad luck for when players under perform or get injured, then we can say the same thing how there is some luck involved when an entire rotation stays healthy.

 

As well, $93M is tied up to all those arms moving forward, which is a big chunk of the payroll. What happens if someone like Berrios or Bassitt or Gausman regress or miss time due to injury?

 

 

It should be $74M tied up moving forward, with Ryu coming off the books: Gausman - $24M; Bassitt - $22M; Berrios - $18M; Kickuchi - $10M. That's actually not bad for the performance that was delivered this year, but 100% agree that this was a very fortunate year on the health front.

 

It makes the Manoah situation extra depressing, as we could have really used a low-cost starter in the rotation that could plug in for a few years moving forward. We really need either him and/or Tiedmann to be legit moving forward. Maybe one of the other young arms might surprise next year and make a run for the 2025 rotation when Kikuchi is a FA.

[max silver]

It should be $74M tied up moving forward, with Ryu coming off the books: Gausman - $24M; Bassitt - $22M; Berrios - $18M; Kickuchi - $10M. That's actually not bad for the performance that was delivered this year, but 100% agree that this was a very fortunate year on the health front.

 

It makes the Manoah situation extra depressing, as we could have really used a low-cost starter in the rotation that could plug in for a few years moving forward. We really need either him and/or Tiedmann to be legit moving forward. Maybe one of the other young arms might surprise next year and make a run for the 2025 rotation when Kikuchi is a FA.

 

I generally don't wish injuries on players but in the case of Manoah it could be a blessing in disguise if his issues this season stemmed from arm related injuries as he and his camp seem to believe. I recall he received some sort of injections in his pitching arm recently, although there has been no information shared as to the nature of these injections, whether PRP, prolotherapy, corticosteroid (hopefully not this type) etc.

[Carlos Danger]

 

I had to chuckle to myself a moment ago thinking about during Bassitt's first start of the year when he was getting bombed, and so many were saying we are f***ed and what a s***** signing it was etc...

 

Speaking of which, Varsho has kinda been saving our bacon lately... And did you guys see Teo and Suzuki cost their teams playoff aspirations biggly the other night with s*** OF D??

Edited September 29, 2023 by Carlos Danger

[Carlos Danger]

I also believe that Manoah will put his s*** together over the off season and get back on track. He could be a huge (pun intended) bounce back option next year.

 

I have heard murmurs that the relationship between Manoah and the FO might not be salvageable and the Jays would build him back up only to get maximum trade value....

[wilko]

I have heard murmurs that the relationship between Manoah and the FO might not be salvageable and the Jays would build him back up only to get maximum trade value....

 

Well if that's the case, pull those f***ing Mary Brown's ads.

[max silver]

I had to chuckle to myself a moment ago thinking about during after Bassitt's first start of the year when he was getting bombed, and so many were saying we are f***ed and what a s***** signing it was etc...

 

Speaking of which, Varsho has kinda been saving our bacon lately... And did you guys see Teo and Suzuki cost their teams playoff aspirations biggly the other night with s*** OF D??

 

I was perusing the team's stats and aside from Schneider's flashes of brilliance Varsho has arguably been the team's most valuable position player over the last few months. He's historically been a stronger offensive contributor over the second half in his brief career and this season is no exception. He's been hitting especially well since early August as he's produced a 120 WRC+ over his last 47 games. If Varsho can keep his bat above water while playing in center field full time next season he will have a very good shot to be the team's highest WAR contributor.

[BatFlip]

I was perusing the team's stats and aside from Schneider's flashes of brilliance Varsho has arguably been the team's most valuable position player over the last few months. He's historically been a stronger offensive contributor over the second half in his brief career and this season is no exception. He's been hitting especially well since early August as he's produced a 120 WRC+ over his last 47 games. If Varsho can keep his bat above water while playing in center field full time next season he will have a very good shot to be the team's highest WAR contributor.

 

He'll be a big contributor if can just hover near a 100 OPS in center next year. He's an absolute stud in the outfield.

[max silver]

He'll be a big contributor if can just hover near a 100 OPS in center next year. He's an absolute stud in the outfield.

 

He's exactly as good as advertised in the outfield. His technique is pretty astounding as he doesn't have elite physical tools (good but far from elite speed, low end velocity on throws etc.).

[Jonn]

Rotation was remarkably consistent and good this year. And that was with Manoah taking a complete s***. Now Ryu has come back and been quite solid. Couldn't ask for much more.

[bones10]

Arozerna and Diaz back in the lineup, f***

[connorp]

I was perusing the team's stats and aside from Schneider's flashes of brilliance Varsho has arguably been the team's most valuable position player over the last few months. He's historically been a stronger offensive contributor over the second half in his brief career and this season is no exception. He's been hitting especially well since early August as he's produced a 120 WRC+ over his last 47 games. If Varsho can keep his bat above water while playing in center field full time next season he will have a very good shot to be the team's highest WAR contributor.

 

Your sample sizes are so f***ing stupid. Varsho didn’t figure anything out all the sudden at 27. He’s just played better recently. You could take any player and isolate out some point in the season when they were better than their season numbers and make some kind of opinion. Like Chapman’s OPS in April and how he has huge potential. Or point out someone that had great numbers in June/July and bad the others.

 

Varsho sucked this year. Maybe he’ll bounce back to career numbers in 2024. That’s a better opinion than your stupid ass sample sizes

[max silver]

Your sample sizes are so f***ing stupid. Varsho didn’t figure anything out all the sudden at 27. He’s just played better recently. You could take any player and isolate out some point in the season when they were better than their season numbers and make some kind of opinion. Like Chapman’s OPS in April and how he has huge potential. Or point out someone that had great numbers in June/July and bad the others.

 

Varsho sucked this year. Maybe he’ll bounce back to career numbers in 2024. That’s a better opinion than your stupid ass sample sizes

 

Who peed in your cornflakes this morning? You're fuller of piss and vinegar than usual, good on you as it looks like your balls finally dropped after years of serving as the resident board punching bag.

 

I didn't claim anywhere that Varsho is having a great offensive season, but merely pointing out that he's turned the corner and given the team a few consecutive solid months of production at the plate at a time when the club really needs it given the struggles of much of the roster. He's been hitting much more like the player the front office thought they traded for over the course of nearly a third of a full season so it's not just a small sample size anymore.

 

It's obviously hard for you to grasp that a player is going to see ebbs and flows at the plate over the course of a 6 month season, and it's a good thing that Varsho has largely been hitting well at the most important time of the year heading into the playoffs. Varsho still only has 1600 MLB plate appearances in his career and very well not be a finished product at the plate. Varsho has been one of the Blue Jays players who has struggled hitting at home this season as he's produced a 107 WRC+ on the road vs only 60 at home. Breaking down the numbers further it's specifically only right handed pitchers he's primarily struggled against this season, but once again only at home with 50 WRC+ vs 106 WRC+ on the road.

 

At this time of the year I place a hell of a lot more importance over who is hot at the plate and who isn't rather than looking at overall season numbers and making proclamations about how so and so sucks and how so and so is awesome. Like Whit Merrifield has provided the team with a decent enough season with a 97 WRC+ and nearly 2 FWAR, but the guy has been ice cold for several months and has provided very little offensive help to a struggling team.

[G-Snarls]

Arozerna and Diaz back in the lineup, f***

 

Yeah

 

Rays won't lie down this series except maybe Sunday

[L54]

30 is kind of one of those arbitrary round numbers, but they were pretty damn close in 2014 and 2015.

 

In 2016, the rotation had even better health/durability:

 

Stroman - 32

JA Happ - 32

Sanchez - 30 (hard to believe now)

Estrada - 29

Dickey - 29

 

Not as rare as you would think to have a healthy 4 out of 5 starting pitchers, but definitely some good luck this year for the rotation with injuries AND performance (Manoah a big, pardon the pun, exception).

 

Wow I wouldn’t have guessed this tbh

[connorp]

When have I ever been nice to you, Max. My cornflakes were just fine this morning

 

I’m only ever a board punching bag because I choose to share unflattering information of my misadventures. Im not a guy that takes myself too seriously, Max.

 

Go get your 8th booster shot

[max silver]

When have I ever been nice to you, Max. My cornflakes were just fine this morning

 

I’m only ever a board punching bag because I choose to share unflattering information of my misadventures. Im not a guy that takes myself too seriously, Max.

 

Go get your 8th booster shot

 

That's a good thing you don't take yourself seriously because nobody else does. For what it's worth I've yet to receive a single booster shot as of yet but thank you for your concern.

[spats]

Vladdy with his ice baths reminds me of Muttley from Dastardly and Muttley. Can someone please provide the gif of that wheezing, annoying cartoon character.

[THANOS]

Vladdy with his ice baths reminds me of Muttley from Dastardly and Muttley. Can someone please provide the gif of that wheezing, annoying cartoon character.

 

[Dick_Pole]

A couple days ago someone was complaining about the Jays having the lowest run differential of all the AL playoff teams. Now that this complaint was good for a +13 since, I'd like to f*** up the Jays chances of winning the last two games by pointing out that they have the second lowest (tied with TB) runs against out of those teams. Just behind the Twins and the Twins are only there because they've faced four grade F offenses ~25 more times than anyone else.

 

People put weight on run differential when they should be taking a percentage approach. Jays score 12.4% more runs than they give up. Run differential comparisons are a lot closer on a percentage basis. Now more food for thought is that even at an equal percentage basis, does the lower scoring team have a higher chance of winning? A team with 880 runs scored and 800 given up and one with 660 runs scored and 600 given up both scored 10% more than they gave up. Does the one that gave up 600 runs correlate to winning more games efficiently (more close games won, fewer blowouts that pad the run differential) that you can expect a better record than the one that gave up 800?

[Terminator]

A couple days ago someone was complaining about the Jays having the lowest run differential of all the AL playoff teams. Now that this complaint was good for a +13 since, I'd like to f*** up the Jays chances of winning the last two games by pointing out that they have the second lowest (tied with TB) runs against out of those teams. Just behind the Twins and the Twins are only there because they've faced four grade F offenses ~25 more times than anyone else.

 

People put weight on run differential when they should be taking a percentage approach. Jays score 12.4% more runs than they give up. Run differential comparisons are a lot closer on a percentage basis. Now more food for thought is that even at an equal percentage basis, does the lower scoring team have a higher chance of winning? A team with 880 runs scored and 800 given up and one with 660 runs scored and 600 given up both scored 10% more than they gave up. Does the one that gave up 600 runs correlate to winning more games efficiently (more close games won, fewer blowouts that pad the run differential) that you can expect a better record than the one that gave up 800?

 

Yes you can. It will help your pytho win percentage a little bit. I can’t remember the exact details but I remember talking about this in the offseason.

[wilko]

A couple days ago someone was complaining about the Jays having the lowest run differential of all the AL playoff teams. Now that this complaint was good for a +13 since, I'd like to f*** up the Jays chances of winning the last two games by pointing out that they have the second lowest (tied with TB) runs against out of those teams. Just behind the Twins and the Twins are only there because they've faced four grade F offenses ~25 more times than anyone else.

 

People put weight on run differential when they should be taking a percentage approach. Jays score 12.4% more runs than they give up. Run differential comparisons are a lot closer on a percentage basis. Now more food for thought is that even at an equal percentage basis, does the lower scoring team have a higher chance of winning? A team with 880 runs scored and 800 given up and one with 660 runs scored and 600 given up both scored 10% more than they gave up. Does the one that gave up 600 runs correlate to winning more games efficiently (more close games won, fewer blowouts that pad the run differential) that you can expect a better record than the one that gave up 800?

 

What are you getting at? The Jays don't have a chance? They are trying to be the Royals? Hello? Where's Spanky? Dead? RIP?!

[Olerud363]

That's a good thing you don't take yourself seriously because nobody else does. For what it's worth I've yet to receive a single booster shot as of yet but thank you for your concern.

 

lol rare case where the righties are passively aggressively bringing up some politics.

 

I'm actually scheduled for my yearly booster right in the middle of tomorrow's ill fated Gausman start. Where is Jim Canuck? Where are the mods?

 

Don't get me wrong, I hate Trudeau with the best of you, and I think that Vaccine is bad as hell for you, mRNA is not a good thing. Problem is the Covid19 also works the same way, so if you get full blown days on end Covid it messes with you. Probably messed up a few on the board.

 

Mods and JimCanuck please make sure we have accurate info here because if I skip my booster appointment tomorrow, have to watch the terrible Gausman start, than get the Covid and get serious long Covid damage I will be suing the board because it let posters spread vaccine disinfo like they were RFK.

[connorp]

I stole that line from Aaron Rodgers and others actually. I’m not sure it’s meant to bring up politics, as much as it’s just meant to question the person’s manhood. You can’t really use a lot of the words that accomplished the same thing years ago.

[Olerud363]

I stole that line from Aaron Rodgers and others actually. IÂ’m not sure itÂ’s meant to bring up politics, as much as itÂ’s just meant to question the personÂ’s manhood. You canÂ’t really use a lot of the words that accomplished the same thing years ago.

 

Well. I am getting my yearly booster tomorrow and was insulted. It made me feel bad because I am helping my community by getting boosted and now everyone on Blue Jays Message board is implying that you are not a real man if you get boosted.

 

I am a real man. The other day I went to parliament to cheer on Justin as he honored 100 year old Ukrainian war heroes. I will be the first to sign up when Justin start WWIII against India. You will see as we fight together against Modi that even the boosted have courage.

 

And just a reminder that there is no politics allowed on this message baord, and I am only bringing up getting boosted and then fighting under my flag, against Modi, for Justin, to show everyone that even the boosted have courage and are real men. If the wrong message get's spread on this illustrious message board, many on the board will not get boosted and we risk a severe late fall Covid outbreak that will be very frightening.

[connorp]

I’m going to have to get Twitter to see how Keith Olbermann responded to Rodgers’ quip.

[John_Havok]

I stole that line from Aaron Rodgers and others actually. I’m not sure it’s meant to bring up politics, as much as it’s just meant to question the person’s manhood. You can’t really use a lot of the words that accomplished the same thing years ago.

 

It says a lot about the intelligence of Aaron Rogers that he would equate getting a booster shot designed to prevent potentially deadly illness and protect people with weakened immune systems as not being manly, when one of the base stereotypes of the "manly man" is being a protector of those who are weak.

[John_Havok]

Well. I am getting my yearly booster tomorrow and was insulted. It made me feel bad because I am helping my community by getting boosted and now everyone on Blue Jays Message board is implying that you are not a real man if you get boosted.

 

I am a real man. The other day I went to parliament to cheer on Justin as he honored 100 year old Ukrainian war heroes. I will be the first to sign up when Justin start WWIII against India. You will see as we fight together against Modi that even the boosted have courage.

 

And just a reminder that there is no politics allowed on this message baord, and I am only bringing up getting boosted and then fighting under my flag, against Modi, for Justin, to show everyone that even the boosted have courage and are real men. If the wrong message get's spread on this illustrious message board, many on the board will not get boosted and we risk a severe late fall Covid outbreak that will be very frightening.

 

See now this is a great troll post. you're getting better at this.

[connorp]

It says a lot about the intelligence of Aaron Rogers that he would equate getting a booster shot designed to prevent potentially deadly illness and protect people with weakened immune systems as not being manly, when one of the base stereotypes of the "manly man" is being a protector of those who are weak.

 

You guys are all starving to turn things political any chance you get. Wasn’t my intention

[connorp]

Today is a great day to bet against the Jays, if it’s play money. If you lose, it’s not bad. I see Ryu putting up a dud