Would you fire Atkins

[Brownie19]

Don't bring up the fact that the Jays under Atkins haven't won a Postseason game or you will be attacked!

 

I wonder if that's because that statement isn't true? Just a thought.

[John_Havok]

I meant big move in terms of a multi year free agent, not necessarily big move as in star player (other than Ohtani there really isn’t much there). Maybe the position player version of Bassitt. Soler checks a lot of boxes for what the Jays need as long as he’s not in the outfield so I could see something like that. Previously I was expecting some faith with younger players (Schneider, Horowitz, etc) but I’m not sure they go that route anymore. My guess is Orelvis and Tiedemann are the only prospects they will look to hold on to, and we see a trade or two with some others.

 

Possible, it’s hard to say. On one hand, the amount of older players signed to long term deals isn’t getting much shorter over the next few seasons so they’ll need some younger guys to step up.

 

Early impressions on Schneider are adequate, but there’s some obvious warning signs present. Clement and Horwitz look like part-timers to me, though I think Horwitz has a better shot at becoming a regular. Neither are likely to be impact guys. Otto Lopez is a backup, Leo Jiminez is a backup… you’re right in that the more likely impact guys are Orelvis and Tiedemann, though I think Barger has a decent chance to be. I give Schneider an outside chance at being an impact guy though if he can make the needed adjustments.

 

Who knows, they might go in house for every spot. Put Barger in left, Orelvis at 3rd, Schneider at 2nd and then throw money at Ohtani as the primary DH/and backup 1b. It wouldn’t be the worst way to go in such a crappy free agent hitting class. Clement as the primary IF backup, Eden may even survive as the primary OF backup/pinch runner. Then sign a guy like Pham or Renfroe as the weak side of a platoon with Barger.

[JaysAllMighty]

you're out of your mind if you think Ohtani is signing with Toronto

[Terminator]

you're out of your mind if you think Ohtani is signing with Toronto

 

There's a non-zero chance it happens.

 

You've got the big players like the Dodgers, the Yankees (I don't think they can afford a 450 million dollar DH on top of the 300 million dollar one they already have) and a couple of others but I would put us in the next group of teams that has a snowball's chance in hell.

 

I bet they are one of the teams rumored to be in on him. And I bet you they probably end up as at least semi-finalists. The rumor mill will churn out the Jays as one of the teams interested and when the list whittles down to 5 or so the Jays will still be in it. And then when it gets cut down to two or three they'll be one of the teams no longer in it.

[deanmike]

There's no way Ohtani joins an organization headed by 2 snakes in Shatkins.

[wilko]

There's no way Ohtani joins an organization headed by 2 snakes in Shatkins.

 

[max silver]

There's a non-zero chance it happens.

 

You've got the big players like the Dodgers, the Yankees (I don't think they can afford a 450 million dollar DH on top of the 300 million dollar one they already have) and a couple of others but I would put us in the next group of teams that has a snowball's chance in hell.

 

I bet they are one of the teams rumored to be in on him. And I bet you they probably end up as at least semi-finalists. The rumor mill will churn out the Jays as one of the teams interested and when the list whittles down to 5 or so the Jays will still be in it. And then when it gets cut down to two or three they'll be one of the teams no longer in it.

 

The Jays have been fishing in the deep waters of free agency in years past as they were reportedly in on the bidding for the likes of Gerrit Cole, Corey Seager, Boegarts etc. I have a hard time seeing this organization ponying up the $400/500+ million required for the likes of Ohtani though as they have yet to pay truly top dollar for a free agent, settling in more in the slightly lower tier for players like Springer and Gausman.

[Terminator]

The Jays have been fishing in the deep waters of free agency in years past as they were reportedly in on the bidding for the likes of Gerrit Cole, Corey Seager, Boegarts etc. I have a hard time seeing this organization ponying up the $400/500+ million required for the likes of Ohtani though as they have yet to pay truly top dollar for a free agent, settling in more in the slightly lower tier for players like Springer and Gausman.

 

I completely agree. Ohtani might give the TV execs boners which causes them to change their tune this time.

 

I'm putting the chance at 0.1%-1%

[John_Havok]

you're out of your mind if you think Ohtani is signing with Toronto

 

Crazier things have happened, but yeah it's probably a pipe dream

[John_Havok]

The Jays have been fishing in the deep waters of free agency in years past as they were reportedly in on the bidding for the likes of Gerrit Cole, Corey Seager, Boegarts etc. I have a hard time seeing this organization ponying up the $400/500+ million required for the likes of Ohtani though as they have yet to pay truly top dollar for a free agent, settling in more in the slightly lower tier for players like Springer and Gausman.

 

If there was ever a time for a contract that includes stock options, now is that time

[Brownie19]

There's no way Ohtani joins an organization headed by 2 snakes in Shatkins.

 

When he signs with LA, are you going to come back and remind us how smart you are because you predicted Ohtani won't sign here because of our FO? I sure hope so.

[Spanky99]

I'm ok on todays presser. Accountability very firmly on Shatkins now where I think it should be.

 

They are smart guys. They will either figure it out or not, but the stakes for 2024 go up for the team - results, fandom attendance and TV eyeballs. Use of renovated stadium etc.

 

Not what I want, but I thought it was less than 40% chance Mark did anything today. That was high.

 

I legit thought they were done, with such a shitshow around the FO on accountability, etc... colour me surprised, lol.

[Spanky99]

The Jays have been fishing in the deep waters of free agency in years past as they were reportedly in on the bidding for the likes of Gerrit Cole, Corey Seager, Boegarts etc. I have a hard time seeing this organization ponying up the $400/500+ million required for the likes of Ohtani though as they have yet to pay truly top dollar for a free agent, settling in more in the slightly lower tier for players like Springer and Gausman.

 

Yeah, it's highly likely we'd never land him, but what Term said is true, they'll be bidding no doubt, the Dodgers have the money so Term is wrong in saying that. He'll be a Dodger soon.

[jaysblue]

I wonder if that's because that statement isn't true? Just a thought.

 

The 2016 roster was majority of leftovers from AA's tenure. I have stated numerous times on the board giving Atkins credit for some of the moves he made in the offseason (Happ) and deadline deals (Liriano, Grilli etc.) to help the Jays that season. Not denying that. Easier to add to a roster when you have All-Stars like Bautista, EE and others and a former AL MVP.

 

After the 2016 season, Jays struggled and Atkins then was able to do a quick rebuild and reshape the roster with his touches. The teams/rosters Atkins built up on his own haven't won a Postseason game yet. Facts.

[Stangstag]

The 2016 roster was majority of leftovers from AA's tenure. I have stated numerous times on the board giving Atkins credit for some of the moves he made in the offseason (Happ) and deadline deals (Liriano, Grilli etc.) to help the Jays that season. Not denying that. Easier to add to a roster when you have All-Stars like Bautista, EE and others and a former AL MVP.

 

After the 2016 season, Jays struggled and Atkins then was able to do a quick rebuild and reshape the roster with his touches. The teams/rosters Atkins built up on his own haven't won a Postseason game yet. Facts.

 

Ok, but you specifically said “the Jays under Atkins haven’t won a postseason game” which is false.

 

I think we can all agree with your second paragraph here

[Terminator]

Yeah, it's highly likely we'd never land him, but what Term said is true, they'll be bidding no doubt, the Dodgers have the money so Term is wrong in saying that. He'll be a Dodger soon.

 

Yeah I think he’ll sign with the Dodgers too.

 

The only other team other than the Jays that I mentioned was the Yankees who won’t sign him bc they can’t afford 65 mil a year on two DHs.

[Spanky99]

Yeah I think he’ll sign with the Dodgers too.

 

The only other team other than the Jays that I mentioned was the Yankees who won’t sign him bc they can’t afford 65 mil a year on two DHs.

 

Yup, they saved and got under the luxury tax to add Ohtani, everyone knows it. The injury to Ohtani won't deter them for one season, he'll just replace JD. Martinez next season.

[jaysblue]

Ok, but you specifically said “the Jays under Atkins haven’t won a postseason game” which is false.

 

I think we can all agree with your second paragraph here

 

Yeah I should have been more specfic.

 

I think Brownie knew what I meant obviously and so did you. It's kind of sad that Brownie has to resort to the 2016 Postseason as a victory to display the success Atkins has had in the Postseason when the teams he actual built since 2020 and that what were expected to contend for a World Series never won a Postseason game. But alright.

[glory]

Yeah the Dodgers are getting Ohtani. They didn’t spend for the 2023 season specifically for that reason. The Yankees have the motivation to get him but Hal isn’t George so there will be a limit on what they will offer. Either way the Jays would have to blow both those offers out the window to have a chance at him and that’s not happening.

 

Unfortunately the FA market aside from him is weak.

[jaysblue]

Yeah the Dodgers are getting Ohtani. They didn’t spend for the 2023 season specifically for that reason. The Yankees have the motivation to get him but Hal isn’t George so there will be a limit on what they will offer. Either way the Jays would have to blow both those offers out the window to have a chance at him and that’s not happening.

 

Unfortunately the FA market aside from him is weak.

 

Yeah I'm sure the Jays are doing their due diligence on Ohtani. Think he would be a great fit here. But still would have the Dodgers and Yankees at the heavy favourites to land him IMO.

[Jaysareus]

For the Varsho trade alone. Yes

[BigCecil]

The 2016 roster was majority of leftovers from AA's tenure. I have stated numerous times on the board giving Atkins credit for some of the moves he made in the offseason (Happ) and deadline deals (Liriano, Grilli etc.) to help the Jays that season. Not denying that. Easier to add to a roster when you have All-Stars like Bautista, EE and others and a former AL MVP.

 

After the 2016 season, Jays struggled and Atkins then was able to do a quick rebuild and reshape the roster with his touches. The teams/rosters Atkins built up on his own haven't won a Postseason game yet. Facts.

 

The core was all there in '16. Below is an article on the moves in 2016. They '16 deadline was not major deals but good pieces.

 

Its a stretch to give Atkins too much credit or blame for 2016 even though he was hired Dec 3 2015. If 2016 sucked I doubt anyone who is a big fan of this FO would be giving him any blame for it. They would be distancing from it, saying it was an AA season and he was a one hit 2015 wonder here.

 

https://jaysjournal.com/2019/08/08/ross-atkins-2016-year-in-review/

 

Mixed bag mostly good stuff. I forgot Harold Ramirez left us in the original Liriano deal. Then in one of the best Jays deals ever they flipped him for Teo July 2017.

[Brownie19]

Yeah I should have been more specfic.

 

I think Brownie knew what I meant obviously and so did you. It's kind of sad that Brownie has to resort to the 2016 Postseason as a victory to display the success Atkins has had in the Postseason when the teams he actual built since 2020 and that what were expected to contend for a World Series never won a Postseason game. But alright.

 

I literally never know what you mean

 

You were responding to travisinfla who said "how about win their first playoff game in 8 years" and I think I've seen a few others suggest the same thing. I do take issue with statements that are just flat out false. If you don't think he had much impact on 2016 and are going to discount those playoff wins (which would be fair to some extent), then you can't, at the same time, cite that he's had 8 years here to build a winner. Obviously the core was already here in 2016 and then after that he had to re-tool/re-build because the contention window was slammed shut after AA "went for it".

 

IMO, the contention window opened for Atkins in 2021 and we've swung and missed 3 years now. I'm not going to tar and feather Atkins for now producing a winner in 2017, 2018 or 2019 as that was never realistic and I think we were premature contenders in 2020 - much like a team like Florida was this year.

[connorp]

I feel like the Jays in the national media were considered a dangerous WC team in 2020. Didn’t work out but I wouldn’t say it was a Marlins situation.

[hanton]

I feel like the Jays in the national media were considered a dangerous WC team in 2020. Didn’t work out but I wouldn’t say it was a Marlins situation.

 

even this season, MLB Network had them as one of the teams "you don't want to play in the post season, becuase of their piching" (paraphrasing)

[Terminator]

 

Looks like Click is sticking around.

[Laika]

 

Looks like Click is sticking around.

 

Wow! But he was going to fly the nest and win a World Series with the Red Sox in the next two years!

 

He's a genius, Jimmy Gluck is. Lucky us he is stickin' around. wow!

[deanmike]

Ripping on a world series winning GM like Click just because you want to kiss Atkins micropenis is embarassing lmao. Take the f***in kneepads off Shatkins cucks.

[Brownie19]

Which posters don’t take his opinion seriously? I think dean has been an above average poster here since he joined.

 

I'm just going to bump this if that's OK.

[L54]

I'm just going to bump this if that's OK.

 

It’s completely defensible to prefer Click to Ross my teams look like the Cleveland Indians with 3x payroll Atkins