Toronto Blue Jays Roster Discussion (2022)

[Brownie19]

All that means is we need to match/exceed value to get it done.

 

It could still happen. The above trade matches the value. You could sub out Jimenez and add someone better to exceed Carroll's value and get it down, or add another guy to the proposed package and achieve the same result.

 

It's not impossible.

 

Carroll is a budding superstar. Arizona isn't trading him unless we're including guys like Vlad or Bo.

[Krylian]

Guys - let's stop pretending that we're going to land Corbin Carroll in a trade. Dave Stewart is no longer the GM.

 

His stench may still linger though.

[InsideThePark]

Carroll is a budding superstar.

 

So is Gabby Moreno

[glory]

Yeah no chance Arizona is trading Carroll. Not even for Moreno+. They want an upgrade at catcher but they have an in house option so it's not like they are desperate. That would be an amazing move for the Jays if it were possible but I can't see a scenario where it is. They are more likely to move someone like Alek Thomas, but that's a bit risky for the Jays since they lost Hernandez so replacing him with someone who may or may not hit well in 2023 might not be the best idea.

 

If Nootbaar is available, then I think he's the guy to go after. He has a 2.9 WAR and 125 wRC+ projection for 2023 + 5 years of control + a good amount of red on his Savant page. Not sure if he's a long term CF but he might be able to play there for at least part of the season. Jansen + Pop for Nootbaar works on Trade Values, and that site is never wrong, so let's do it.

[Stottlemyres_Bloody_Chin]

What about Nootbars actual stats (not just savant stuff) is making him so desirable?

 

Career minor league OPS hovering around .700, and in this year despite the red on his savant page his numbers weren't amazing.

[Brownie19]

What about Nootbars actual stats (not just savant stuff) is making him so desirable?

 

Career minor league OPS hovering around .700, and in this year despite the red on his savant page his numbers weren't amazing.

 

Yes they were. 125 wRC+ and 2.7 WAR in only 347 PA's is REALLY good. I have no f***ing idea if he can repeat this. The minor league numbers definitely scare me, but his Savant page certainly gives hope that he's figured something out and is ready to be a stud. Will the league adjust? will he adjust back? Who knows.

 

I'd give up Jansen to find out. I wouldn't give up Kirk to find out.

 

The flip side is Dylan Carlson. He has a great pedigree, but the results haven't been there in the majors and his Savant page suggest he still needs to figure it out. I'll be watching with interest to see who carves out a better career.

 

Jansen for Tyler O'Neill is another interesting fit. He reminds me a lot of Teo - although he already has a massive season under his belt (2021).

[jaysblue]

It's kind of annoying that everyone now is going to be using Baseball Trade Values to assess a trade.

[connorp]

It's kind of annoying that everyone now is going to be using Baseball Trade Values to assess a trade.

 

Yeah, teams should really be relying more on this publicly available data, so they don’t get fleeced like this

[Solaxys]

It's kind of annoying that everyone now is going to be using Baseball Trade Values to assess a trade.

 

I'm pretty annoyed this didn't happen. Fire Atkins.

 

[jaysblue]

Trades like this are how smart teams remain competitive for longer even as it angers the fanbase occasionally

 

If Swanson posts 1.5-2 WAR seasons for the next three years sure. We know relievers are volatile though. If he flames out and doesn't provide any value, you're pretty much relying on Macko to provide something.

 

Also, don't forget if Teo goes out and has a monster season like he did in 2021, Mariners offer him a QO. If he accepts, they get him for another season for around $18-20M.

 

From a roster control and payroll perspective, I like the move. Jays need to follow up bringing another solid OF on board which I think they will. As well, got to hope Swanson can be a valuable late inning arm for this club and a difference maker down in the BP.

[jaysblue]

According to MLB the Show, Jays could have got way more for Teo than just Swanson and Macko.

[jaysblue]

Yes they were. 125 wRC+ and 2.7 WAR in only 347 PA's is REALLY good. I have no f***ing idea if he can repeat this. The minor league numbers definitely scare me, but his Savant page certainly gives hope that he's figured something out and is ready to be a stud. Will the league adjust? will he adjust back? Who knows.

 

I'd give up Jansen to find out. I wouldn't give up Kirk to find out.

 

The flip side is Dylan Carlson. He has a great pedigree, but the results haven't been there in the majors and his Savant page suggest he still needs to figure it out. I'll be watching with interest to see who carves out a better career.

 

Jansen for Tyler O'Neill is another interesting fit. He reminds me a lot of Teo - although he already has a massive season under his belt (2021).

 

Jansen for Tyler O'Neill would be great and a very solid replacement for Teo. Very fair swap for both teams IMO. Under control for two more seasons and can even be better than Teo (5-6 WAR potential as we've seen). Plus in his second arbitration year and with the season he had, he won't take up as much payroll as Teo would obviously.

[wilko]

It's kind of annoying that everyone now is going to be using Baseball Trade Values to assess a trade.

 

I beg to differ.

 

[Spanky99]

Teoscar for Swanson + Adam Macko

 

Seems light to me. Swanson is legit but Macko is kind of a lottery ticket. starting Position player for reliever + Lottery ticket just rubs me the wrong way

 

Macko isn't a lottery ticket, he's a legit prospect.

[Jonn]

Jansen for Tyler O'Neill would be great and a very solid replacement for Teo. Very fair swap for both teams IMO. Under control for two more seasons and can even be better than Teo (5-6 WAR potential as we've seen). Plus in his second arbitration year and with the season he had, he won't take up as much payroll as Teo would obviously.

 

I think I would take a polar plunge into Lake Ontario if that is the trade they made.

 

I would like to see them make a bigger splash. A big fish like Bryan Reynolds. Which would probably start with Kirk and one of our better prospects along with some secondary pieces.

[Spanky99]

I think I would take a polar plunge into Lake Ontario if that is the trade they made.

 

I would like to see them make a bigger splash. A big fish like Bryan Reynolds. Which would probably start with Kirk and one of our better prospects along with some secondary pieces.

 

Pirates aren't trading for a catcher, bro.

[jaysblue]

I think I would take a polar plunge into Lake Ontario if that is the trade they made.

 

I would like to see them make a bigger splash. A big fish like Bryan Reynolds. Which would probably start with Kirk and one of our better prospects along with some secondary pieces.

 

You must really love Canadian ballplayers!

[Captain_Obvious]

Jansen for Tyler O'Neill would be great and a very solid replacement for Teo. Very fair swap for both teams IMO. Under control for two more seasons and can even be better than Teo (5-6 WAR potential as we've seen). Plus in his second arbitration year and with the season he had, he won't take up as much payroll as Teo would obviously.

 

Yea let's evaluate O'Neill based on a career year a couple of years ago, not on his most recent s*** performance where he barely out slugged f***ing Tapia. Let's buy high when his actually performance is low. Brilliant idea.

[Captain_Obvious]

I think I would take a polar plunge into Lake Ontario if that is the trade they made.

 

I would like to see them make a bigger splash. A big fish like Bryan Reynolds. Which would probably start with Kirk and one of our better prospects along with some secondary pieces.

 

Pittsburgh does NOT need a catcher. They have top catching prospects very close to the majors.

[jaysblue]

Yea let's evaluate O'Neill based on a career year a couple of years ago, not on his most recent s*** performance where he barely out slugged f***ing Tapia. Let's buy high when his actually performance is low. Brilliant idea.

 

You idiot. His career year was in 2021, only one season ago lmao and he's only 27. If O'Neill had a 5 WAR season in 2022, he wouldn't even be available for Jansen. You're buying low on O'Neill!

[Jonn]

You must really love Canadian ballplayers!

 

Honestly I don’t. I would not do O'Neill for Jansen 1 for 1 no f***ing shot. I don’t believe O’Neal will ever touch his career season. I actually don’t think he will half it again.

[Jonn]

Pirates aren't trading for a catcher, bro.

 

Pittsburgh does NOT need a catcher. They have top catching prospects very close to the majors.

 

You guys are right but if he’s available like it’s rumoured that he is. You gotta presume that. That’s impact bat at a premium position.

[Captain_Obvious]

You idiot. His career year was in 2021, only one season ago lmao and he's only 27. If O'Neill had a 5 WAR season in 2022, he wouldn't even be available for Jansen. You're buying low on O'Neill!

 

2022 is closer to his true performance level you dumbass. 2021 was the outlier. He has huge swing and miss issues. So yea.. let's f***ing trade the catcher who has been the best hitter on the team since June 2021 for f***ing "rich man's Tapia".

[Jonn]

Tyler O'Neill is like Randal Grichuk with more speed and substantially less good looking. Don’t even know why we are talking about him. We definitely wouldn’t be if he wasn’t Canadian. I heard the word used this off-season by the Jays wanting to diversify the lineup more. We would literally be adding what we just shed to probably do a worse job lol

[Krylian]

Tyler O'Neill is like Randal Grichuk with more speed and substantially less good looking. Don’t even know why we are talking about him. We definitely wouldn’t be if he wasn’t Canadian. I heard the word used this off-season by the Jays wanting to diversify the lineup more. We would literally be adding what we just shed to probably do a worse job lol

 

So Colby Rasmus?

[Jonn]

So Colby Rasmus?

 

I mean he’s better looking than Colby Rasmus but he looks like a thumb with a GI-Joe body. And at the very least Rasmus hit Left-Handed.

[TwistedLogic]

Updated my payroll estimate chart for another community and thought to cross-post it here in case people might find it useful!

 

[Terminator]

Updated my payroll estimate chart for another community and thought to cross-post it here in case people might find it useful!

 

 

He’s back!

[wamco]

Best breakdown I have seen. I always forget about the AAV affecting cba, not that current year salary so back loading a contract doesn’t help to say under the “cap”.

 

Plenty of room to play with still. I wouldn’t be against trading guierriel at this point either.

[Olerud363]

Tyler O'Neill is like Randal Grichuk with more speed and substantially less good looking. DonÂ’t even know why we are talking about him. We definitely wouldnÂ’t be if he wasnÂ’t Canadian. I heard the word used this off-season by the Jays wanting to diversify the lineup more. We would literally be adding what we just shed to probably do a worse job lol

 

Sort of, but O'Neil has a .320 career on base percentage compared to Grichuk's .293. That's a big difference. If you want to use the fancy Stat O'Neil is 115 wRC+, Grichuk 100 career.

 

Actually O'Neil is a much better hitter when you look at it.