Toronto Blue Jays Roster Discussion (2022)

[The Cats Ass]

Why do people want Rogers? He's not all that great. He's guaranteed to be over paid because he's a save collector.

 

Give me Adam Ottavino. https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/adam-ottavino-493603?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

Edited October 26, 2022 by The Cats Ass

[Stangstag]

Why do people want Rogers? He's not all that great. He's guaranteed to be over paid because he's a save collector.

 

Yeah hard pass

[Carlos Danger]

So what's the trade for those 3?

 

Not exactly sure what it would take. Probably something like Kirk and Martinez.. I would trade those two or one of those and Pearson for that deal. Probably two of the three and maybe a lesser milb player.. I def think it would make the overall team better.

[Laika]

I don't get that trade at all, other than Drey Jameson who looks to have good stuff.

 

Mantiply probably just had a career year and has traditionally not been a big whiff guy. Isn't he a soft tosser?

 

Stone Garrett peaked in the upper minors at 25 and 26 with 112 and 116 wRC+ lines. He looks like a weak side platoon player in an outfield corner.

[The Cats Ass]

Not exactly sure what it would take. Probably something like Kirk and Martinez.. I would trade those two or one of those and Pearson for that deal. Probably two of the three and maybe a lesser milb player.. I def think it would make the overall team better.

 

So you want to trade Kirk and Martinez for a pitching prospect who's projected for the bullpen, a AAAA pinch hitter, and a 32 year old middle reliever.

[Spanky99]

Not exactly sure what it would take. Probably something like Kirk and Martinez.. I would trade those two or one of those and Pearson for that deal. Probably two of the three and maybe a lesser milb player.. I def think it would make the overall team better.

 

You're severely underestimating Kirk's value, bro. You could get one of Pfaadt or Nelson on top of that and I think that's still light. No bueno, man.

[wamco]

I just feel Brantley will be here at some point. 35, lefty, of, ops decreasing 3 years in a row but still 785 last year in injury year, cleveland ties, almost here before, springers friend, veteran , shouldn’t be expensive or long term.

 

Fwiw from baseball trade values-Here are some trades people had suggested that the site grades as near equal value. See if any peak your fancy.

 

 

Kirk, tiedemann, teo, Kikuchi for ohtani.

 

Jansen and toman for turnbull and haase (tigers)

 

Tiedemann and espinal for Cedrick Mullins

 

Kirk for Pablo lopez

 

Espinal for Ian Happ

 

Jansen for karinchak and curry (Cleve)

 

Moreno for Reynolds (Pitt)

 

Jansen and lgj for Carlson and matz (stl)

 

Moreno for gallen (Ariz)

 

Moreno for. Bieber. (C leve)

 

Moreno and Orelvis for Burnes (mil)

 

Jansen for Mitchell (mil)

 

 

I also plugged in the suggested trade with Astros being discussed and they see it very lopsided;

 

Kirk (39) plus biggio(1) ~ 40

Urquidy (3.6) plus Abreu (11) ~ 14.6

[Spanky99]

Why do people want Rogers? He's not all that great. He's guaranteed to be over paid because he's a save collector.

 

Give me Adam Ottavino. https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/adam-ottavino-493603?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

 

Well he's a LHP, far younger and more consistent than Ottavino. Meh...

[Stangstag]

I just feel Brantley will be here at some point. 35, lefty, of, ops decreasing 3 years in a row but still 785 last year in injury year, cleveland ties, almost here before, springers friend, veteran , shouldn’t be expensive or long term.

 

Fwiw from baseball trade values-Here are some trades people had suggested that the site grades as near equal value. See if any peak your fancy.

 

 

Kirk, tiedemann, teo, Kikuchi for ohtani.

 

Jansen and toman for turnbull and haase (tigers)

 

Tiedemann and espinal for Cedrick Mullins

 

Kirk for Pablo lopez

 

Espinal for Ian Happ

 

Jansen for karinchak and curry (Cleve)

 

Moreno for Reynolds (Pitt)

 

Jansen and lgj for Carlson and matz (stl)

 

Moreno for gallen (Ariz)

 

Moreno for. Bieber. (C leve)

 

Moreno and Orelvis for Burnes (mil)

 

Jansen for Mitchell (mil)

 

 

I also plugged in the suggested trade with Astros being discussed and they see it very lopsided;

 

Kirk (39) plus biggio(1) ~ 40

Urquidy (3.6) plus Abreu (11) ~ 14.6

 

Weren’t people saying Jansen for Urquidy/Abreu??

[Spanky99]

Weren’t people saying Jansen for Urquidy/Abreu??

 

Yes.

[wamco]

My bad…hang on

[wamco]

Jansen (26.6) plus biggio(1) ~ 27

Urquidy (3.6) plus Abreu (11) ~ 14.6

[Spanky99]

Yeah, Jansen's worth more than that, Urquidy is projected fugly, he suxxxxxxxxxx

[Laika]

Urquidy has good stuff and is probably underrated by fWAR / FIP.

[jaysblue]

Big difference between a 1 year and a multi year. Jays should qualify Stripling.

 

Stripling can't even pitch more than 5 innings per outing because he can't pitch three times through an order. I think the Jays could use that $20M much more efficiently on another arm + other pieces.

 

Strip was awesome this season, though expect some regression in 2023 a bit. He's not worth $20M regardless. There are so many other SPs available via free agency and trade who likely won't cost as much.

[Spanky99]

Urquidy has good stuff and is probably underrated by fWAR / FIP.

 

Idk man, those 2 together projected at 1 WAR while Jano at 3.1... that's a big gap friendo.

[Laika]

Whether or not to qualify Stripling is a very hard decision.

 

Don't offer --> he walks, Jays get nothing but lose nothing. It's possible he could still come back on a friendlier deal.

Offer --> he walks, Jays get compensation. Or he accepts and most of their budget increase is locked up in Stripling.

 

I think I just don't offer. There is downside to offering.

[wamco]

Hot take alert- Springer and Kirk for ohtani lines up.

 

Sign Nimmo to replace springer.

 

If payroll doesn’t increase after a 20m increase this off-season-

 

Would leave about 70m (minus arby raises, my rough estimate 23m ~ so about 47m) after next year to replace/resign ohtani, chapman, teo and LGJ.

 

Coming off books - ohtani, chap, teo, lgj, ryu, springer, witt, grichuck.

 

Coming on books - nimmo

 

Keeps another year of the farm growing which should produce a few reinforcements for the departed.

[jaysblue]

Matt Moore stinks. If I was 30 years younger I could get some base hits off of him easy.

 

He did stink before, though he's found new life as a reliever.

 

This season: 1.98 ERA, 2.98 FIP, 10.09 K/9, 1.3 WAR, 5 saves, 14 holds

 

His BB rate is a little high though if he improves in that area, he definitely can be even better. Would love to see the Jays work with him. Definitely would be nice to have him and Mayza as the two lefties down in the pen. Probably won't cost as much as a Rogers, so he's not a bad Plan B option.

[Laika]

Idk man, those 2 together projected at 1 WAR while Jano at 3.1... that's a big gap friendo.

 

Yeah maybe by some lame, publicly available, outdated, lagging projection system.

[wamco]

Whether or not to qualify Stripling is a very hard decision.

 

Don't offer --> he walks, Jays get nothing but lose nothing. It's possible he could still come back on a friendlier deal.

Offer --> he walks, Jays get compensation. Or he accepts and most of their budget increase is locked up in Stripling.

 

I think I just don't offer. There is downside to offering.

 

I’d just sign someone else for cheaper than 19m in this case or pony up for rodon preferably

[Spanky99]

Yeah maybe by some lame, publicly available, outdated, lagging projection system.

 

So Fangraphs is no longer a good barometer in projections?

[jaysblue]

Why do people want Rogers? He's not all that great. He's guaranteed to be over paid because he's a save collector.

 

Give me Adam Ottavino. https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/savant-player/adam-ottavino-493603?stats=statcast-r-pitching-mlb

 

2018: 2.33 FIP, 9.88 K/9, 1.8 WAR

 

2019: 2.85 FIP, 11.74 K/9, 2.1 WAR

 

2021: 2.13 FIP, 13.17 K/9, 1.5 WAR

 

2022: 3.32 FIP, 11.75 K/9, 1.0 WAR

 

He's been one of the best relievers in baseball since 2018.

[jaysblue]

Yeah hard pass

 

He's been one of the best relievers in baseball since 2018.

[wamco]

Idk man, those 2 together projected at 1 WAR while Jano at 3.1... that's a big gap friendo.

 

How much better is Romano than abreu though

 

Romano 2.9 last year (mlbtv 30)

Abreu 1.3 last year. (Mlbtv 11)

 

That doesn’t seem like reality. Getting the save seems to boost this entirely too far. I’d think if you have Romano pitch the 8th and Abreu the 9th, you’d see the WAR flip-flop.

 

I don’t think enough to get Jansen still even if you boost abreu up. I think a better pitcher than Urquidy should be included. Plus I can’t stand his wind up.

[John_Havok]

How much better is Romano than abreu though

 

Romano 2.9 last year (mlbtv 30)

Abreu 1.3 last year. (Mlbtv 11)

 

That doesn’t seem like reality. Getting the save seems to boost this entirely too far. I’d think if you have Romano pitch the 8th and Abreu the 9th, you’d see the WAR flip-flop.

 

I don’t think enough to get Jansen still even if you boost abreu up. I think a better pitcher than Urquidy should be included. Plus I can’t stand his wind up.

 

Hang on... are you suggesting that the inning a reliever pitches in will somehow change their fWAR?

[jaysblue]

A lot of these suggestions derive from some of these guys rosters in Fantasy Sports, as per usual. Just ignore it, lol.

 

Lmao you keep propping up Conforto who you own in some leagues as well

[Spanky99]

How much better is Romano than abreu though

 

Romano 2.9 last year (mlbtv 30)

Abreu 1.3 last year. (Mlbtv 11)

 

That doesn’t seem like reality. Getting the save seems to boost this entirely too far. I’d think if you have Romano pitch the 8th and Abreu the 9th, you’d see the WAR flip-flop.

 

I don’t think enough to get Jansen still even if you boost abreu up. I think a better pitcher than Urquidy should be included. Plus I can’t stand his wind up.

 

What's that all about?

[Spanky99]

Lmao you keep propping up Conforto who you own in some leagues as well

 

The FC who cares, Conforto shouldn't be expensive? He's the best LHB available in FA imo.

[Brownie19]

Hot take alert- Springer and Kirk for ohtani lines up.

 

Sign Nimmo to replace springer.

 

If payroll doesn’t increase after a 20m increase this off-season-

 

Would leave about 70m (minus arby raises, my rough estimate 23m ~ so about 47m) after next year to replace/resign ohtani, chapman, teo and LGJ.

 

Coming off books - ohtani, chap, teo, lgj, ryu, springer, witt, grichuck.

 

Coming on books - nimmo

 

Keeps another year of the farm growing which should produce a few reinforcements for the departed.

 

Why would the Angels want Springer? You think they want to move Ohtani and still try to contend? I can't imagine that's the case, but the Angels are kind of nuts, so maybe?