GDT (3/3) | Blue Jays (23-18) vs. Red Sox (26-18) | May 20 — 7:37 PM

[Jaysareus]

Nearing June and springer has played what 2 friggen games while we burn through pitching depth

[Brownie19]

What does this have to do with me commenting on one pitch? Like are you diagnosed with OCD or something?

 

I'm just saying Matt Barnes is f***ing nasty. Ripping a guy for fouling off a pitch that's way off the plate is stupid. Our hitters are up there literally hanging on for dear life, just praying for a mistake.

[gruber92]

This team needs pitching. They’re not going anywhere without it. Too bad they wasted money on Springer instead.

 

I agree the springer signing looking more and more like a mistake. Money diverted away from pitching

 

Lol

[5ToolPhenom]

You want our 3rd best relief pitcher facing the heart of the order in the 7th instead?

 

I don't like Charlie at all - but he handled this just fine. His players didn't execute. It happens.

 

If he planned on rolling with Dolis in the 9th, he should have at least had a backup plan if things got hairy. It was clear as day to anyone that he didn't have his command and that he was going to blow it.

[Djack]

Can anyone at all tell me why Montoya keeps trotting Dolis out at all during any game, especially when it’s on the line? This is maddening !!!

[Brownie19]

Reading GDT's when we lose is like jabbing yourself with AIDS straight to the eyeballs.

[Stangstag]

Damn. From .5 to 2.5 behind

 

Its May relax lol

[5ToolPhenom]

Is this a result of making our board more visible on Google? Atrocious

 

Everyone you quoted turned out to be right... Come on, man:rolleyes:

[Stangstag]

People s***ing on the bullpen and manager is a f***ing joke. That's out first loss when leading in the 9th inning - on a team that lost Yates, Merryweather, Castro, Borucki, Romano, Dolis, etc. at one point or another. I don't like Charlie - but him and this bullpen deserve credit when credit is due. Expecting perfection is just plain stupid.

 

It's like they've never watched or followed baseball before.

 

This. I really don’t like Charlie, but can’t really pin this loss on him. Dolis is always wild, usually he pulls it together. Tonight he didn’t. Suck it up and move on to the next series.

[gruber92]

Montoya thought or planned that Chatwood was in to burn their 2-3-4 for the seventh inning save, he's done it recently and successfully. Maybe Dolis should have been used in the eighth and Romano to close is another conversation. It did line up pretty well, but Dolis failed to retire not even one of their 8-9 hitters. s*** happens.

[thatoneguy]

This GDT is so f***ing awful good god.

[Acemeister79]

People s***ing on the bullpen and manager is a f***ing joke. That's out first loss when leading in the 9th inning - on a team that lost Yates, Merryweather, Castro, Borucki, Romano, Dolis, etc. at one point or another. I don't like Charlie - but him and this bullpen deserve credit when credit is due. Expecting perfection is just plain stupid.

 

It's like they've never watched or followed baseball before.

 

Take a stroll to the MLB stat board. Right now, in nearly every stat - offense or defense, Espinal IS > Biggio. Comments during the game are like play by play - and your expertise is = to Tabler. Get stuffed, know it all.

[5ToolPhenom]

People s***ing on the bullpen and manager is a f***ing joke. That's out first loss when leading in the 9th inning - on a team that lost Yates, Merryweather, Castro, Borucki, Romano, Dolis, etc. at one point or another. I don't like Charlie - but him and this bullpen deserve credit when credit is due. Expecting perfection is just plain stupid.

 

It's like they've never watched or followed baseball before.

 

You're missing the point. It was clear to anyone with baseball IQ that Dolis didn't have it and was going to blow it. You need to be able to recognize that if you're a manager. It was clear to everyone in this thread. You can rationalize it any way you want, but there was no reason to leave Dolis in there to blow it. Plain and simple.

[5ToolPhenom]

Can anyone at all tell me why Montoya keeps trotting Dolis out at all during any game, especially when it’s on the line? This is maddening !!!

 

Dolis reminds me of the old Jays closer Kevin Gregg... Never an easy inning

[Dr.Tubes]

This team needs pitching. They’re not going anywhere without it. Too bad they wasted money on Springer instead.

All of the bullpen injuries really haven’t helped the cause so far this season. As to the starting rotation, I had read somewhere Atkins stating they didn’t want to block any of their young arms by signing more free agents. I think they were hoping Hatch was going to take a step forward and possibly Stripling and kay as well.

The Hatch injury is unfortunate and neither Stripling or Kay have been very strong.

 

The time is fast approaching that the front office has to make some moves. The bats have been good despite injuries and 1-3 in the rotation along with the healthy members of the bullpen have been performing well. I understand not wanting to rush Manoah but if he continues pitching lights out in triple A for a couple more starts it is time to see what he has in the show. The other option should be to move the timeline up a little bit on trading for a front line starter and another bullpen arm. Tougher this far from the deadline but teams make early moves every year. Hopefully Pearson can get something going as well but I don’t think the FO should count on anything from him and if he does come up and pitch well that is a luxury.

 

Tough loss tonight....6 runs on two hanging breaking balls. Hopefully the boys rebound and f*** up the Rays.

[Jaysareus]

I agree with whoever said Espinal is better than Biggio defensively and equal or better offensively

[BTS]

I agree with whoever said Espinal is better than Biggio defensively and equal or better offensively

 

lol

[Jgarza868899]

I agree with whoever said Espinal is better than Biggio defensively and equal or better offensively

Definitely better defensively, no debate there. They both aren’t very good offensively

[BigCecil]

Well that sucked badly. As much as I’d like to, I can’t really fault Buntoyo. Dolis looked like he always looks to me. Lots of pitches. One pitch bounced. One a filthy strike. Rinse. Repeat. I thought he would come through. If Vlad comes up with that first tough chance for Dolis maybe it’s a different outcome. Inches. That’s baseball. It’s May 20th. We move on. Chatwood is nails. While he is hot hand he has been our best pen arm. Matz sure battled tonight. Props.

[Stangstag]

You're missing the point. It was clear to anyone with baseball IQ that Dolis didn't have it and was going to blow it. You need to be able to recognize that if you're a manager. It was clear to everyone in this thread. You can rationalize it any way you want, but there was no reason to leave Dolis in there to blow it. Plain and simple.

 

This your first time watching Dolis pitch?

[Brownie19]

Take a stroll to the MLB stat board. Right now, in nearly every stat - offense or defense, Espinal IS > Biggio. Comments during the game are like play by play - and your expertise is = to Tabler. Get stuffed, know it all.

 

There are lots of know it all's around here man. If that bothers you and you prefer a crowd that agrees every blown save is avoidable and that Espinal is a better baseball player than Biggio then this might not be the place for you. I might suggest Facebook or Reddit.

[Brownie19]

This your first time watching Dolis pitch?

 

This. It's like half the crowd turned on the Blue Jays game tonight for the first time since 2016.

[Stangstag]

Well that sucked badly. As much as I’d like to, I can’t really fault Buntoyo. Dolis looked like he always looks to me. Lots of pitches. One pitch bounced. One a filthy strike. Rinse. Repeat. I thought he would come through. If Vlad comes up with that first tough chance for Dolis maybe it’s a different outcome. Inches. That’s baseball. It’s May 20th. We move on. Chatwood is nails. While he is hot hand he has been our best pen arm. Matz sure battled tonight. Props.

 

Exactly, thank you. Dolis has always been shaky, usually he manages a few strikeouts to balance it out. Its only 1 game. These types of games are tough to swallow but it happens, usually multiple times in a season.

 

Its May and the team is still a handful of games over .500 having played the toughest schedule in baseball with multiple significant injuries including arguably our best player.

 

Relax people.

[TwistedLogic]

Is this a result of making our board more visible on Google? Atrocious

 

Only one of those people joined this month.

[Eat My Shatkins]

s*** happens. Relievers can't be perfect all the time, and despite Dolis' warts, he's been a pretty goddamn effective high leverage reliever for the Jays.

 

I miss having a hammer though, to nail it down. It's a shame we had to waste 14k/9 100 miles Giles on a non contender. He'd look f***ing incredible on the back end right now.

[Daniel Labude]

This. I really don’t like Charlie, but can’t really pin this loss on him. Dolis is always wild, usually he pulls it together. Tonight he didn’t. Suck it up and move on to the next series.

 

Dolis shouldn't be the 9th inning man...really shouldn't

[Angrioter]

I prefer Dolís facing best Red Sox hitters in the 7th than closing the game.

 

More chances to the Jays to tie the game (6 more outs). Dolís is low leverage situation game pitcher.

[Deadpool]

Take a stroll to the MLB stat board. Right now, in nearly every stat - offense or defense, Espinal IS > Biggio. Comments during the game are like play by play - and your expertise is = to Tabler. Get stuffed, know it all.

 

I agree with whoever said Espinal is better than Biggio defensively and equal or better offensively

 

Definitely better defensively, no debate there. They both aren’t very good offensively

 

Here's a collection of people who don't understand sample sizes. Behold!

 

I like Espinal, and he is an excellent defender, but he is absolutely, 100% not remotely a better hitter than Biggio. Biggio is a career 112 wCR+ hitter, Espinal is a career 75 wRC+ hitter. One is decently above average, the other is well below average. Even this year, Biggio's slow-start 81 wRC+ is higher than Espinal's "hot start" 77 wRC+.

[Stangstag]

Dolis shouldn't be the 9th inning man...really shouldn't

 

I mean I agree he’s not the best reliever on the team, but he did have the easier tasast night of facing the 8-9-1 hitters and he f***ed that up royally.

 

There were plenty of times he pitched the 9th last season (and a few times this season) and he was absolutely fine, even had some nasty strikeouts in big situations.

 

Its not like Romano or Chatwood would have magically guaranteed a win by pitching the 9th

[Olerud363]

Here's a collection of people who don't understand sample sizes. Behold!

 

I like Espinal, and he is an excellent defender, but he is absolutely, 100% not remotely a better hitter than Biggio. Biggio is a career 112 wCR+ hitter, Espinal is a career 75 wRC+ hitter. One is decently above average, the other is well below average. Even this year, Biggio's slow-start 81 wRC+ is higher than Espinal's "hot start" 77 wRC+.

 

Well Espinal doesn't have enough at bats to take his major league numbers seriously. So you have to look at minor league numbers too.

 

The difference between them in the minors is about 30 points of on base percentage and 30 points of slugging... chances are the difference would be similar in the majors long term. Biggio is better.

 

You might consider platooning them. Not that Biggio has much of a platoon split, but perhaps both would perform better in a part time role. Or maybe they wouldn't.