Stroman to the... METS!?

[BlueRocky]

[Barkerfan23]

I'm sick of the bias Roger's media

[Boxcar]

Hi, Mets fan here. Yes, mets fans are on average 80/20 against this trade.

 

One reason is, the mets fans want the team to rebuild, not buy, so, that's part of it.

 

Another, is, reading this thread and reading mets threads, the views on how good Stroman is varies depending on the board. You guys see him as a #1 type. Mets fans see him as a guy who's been hot lately, due for a correction downwards, and only 1 year of control past this one, which makes little sense for a losing team. 3.52 FIP this year, 3.91 and 3.90 last 2 years might be closer to a #2 starter. Still good, not an ace.

 

Mets fans also LOVE SWR, and, 19 year old in low A - there's some risk there, but he's one of our favorite pitchers. Probably #1 overall until Allen gets a better look, by fan ranking.

 

Brodie has also hurt us by being too eager to trade prospects so him doing it again . . . met with some concern from fans, and especially among fans with their hearts set on rebuilding.

 

I think this is a wait & see. If Stroman pitches like an ace for us, 2019 and 2020, mets stole him from you. If he doesn't, and if in 2 years, SWR is a top 40 prospect in all of baseball, you didn't do so bad. Some media guys like Kay more than others. I think he's a borderline guy, better than AAAA certainly, but could be a #4/#5 starter, which isn't all that interesting and he's a work in progress, but he was apparently pitching with a partial tear in college. He's added about 2 MPH since returning from TJ and he's a more interesting prospect than he was. Also, lefty. Lefty helps.

 

Reading this board, I see your point. I get you guys wanting more. I remember Marlins fans being disappointed in the return the mets gave them for AJ Ramos, at the time, their closer. Then Ramos proceeded to pitch his way out of baseball after joining the mets. He was awful. Not that the prospects the Fish got were any better, but that's how it works sometimes. I think there's some wait and see in a lot of trades.

 

Maybe it works out for both our teams. / / / and as a Yankee hater, I really do come in peace.

 

You guys would likely be alright with the trade if you were a legit contender, but the Mets are not that. SWR is a fine pitcher but the likelihood that he ends up being as good as Stroman is about 10%. The probability of him becoming an ace is pretty small.

 

It's a weird trade for the Mets to make so I totally get why Mets fans are upset, but it was still poor value for what Stroman is. Really, a lose-lose for both teams.

[Angrioter]

Official.

Stroman + money for Kay and SWR

[TheHurl]

Tell me the last time a trade of a pitcher as good as Stroman with additional control got only 2 prospects, none of whom are current top 100 prospects or decent major leaguers.

 

Trades this bad rarely happen. It wouldn't shock me if it hasn't happened this decade.

 

Gerrit Cole? Sonny Gray (James Kap was top 100 I realize), Matt Moore, Mike Fiers (although Hader became Hader), David Price?

[TheHurl]

why are you taking a best case scenario and a pitcher that has one more year of develop and information on and drawing the comparison? Vlad is 20 years old. He had much higher pedigree in terms of his perceived value as a baseball player on the position side at the same age...he's 20 now. Did he put up a 6 win season. The idea that this kid is going to be at the majors and pitching like an ace at 20 is ridiculous. Yes there is an extremely low percentage that it could happen, but to throw it out there like it's reasonable probably is dumn.

 

I never once mentioned the word ACE. i said in the majors. I traded 2018 Gore for a shot at Yusei in fantasy. I hate the risk aspect of this deal, but 2018 Gore is the best comp for Sim

[Terminator]

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/marcus-stroman-is-now-a-met-for-some-reason/

[Krylian]

 

That curve is very slurvy.

[Olerud363]

Simeon Woods-Richardson looks like Aaron Sanchez 8 years ago

 

No. His strike out rate is higher. In terms of

 

1. Strike outs

2. walks

3. HR

 

He is way better then Sanchez. Aaron Sanchez (19) 51 walks... 90ish strikeouts

 

This other guy -- 17 walks, 97 strikeouts.

 

He is closer to Syndergard at 19, except a year younger... less walks.

 

Three people

 

Syndergard 31 walks 122 ks 100 innings 3 hr

Sanchez 51 walks 90iwsh ks 100 innings 7 hr

Simeon 17 walks (17!) 97 ks 78 innings 5 hr

 

Simeon has the strikeout rate of Syndergaard and an even lower walk rate.

 

Don't know anything about the scouting... this is just stats

 

Simean is a year younger than Sanchez and Syndergard (18 vs 19) in their low a year

[Grant77]

Official.

Stroman + money for Kay and SWR

 

Money too, excellent. At this rate we might be able to pry away a backup outfielder at AAA for Giles.

[saskjayfan]

I'm down on the return but get out with this overreacting and hyperbole.

 

well i have been drinking so there's that, but what's the rotation in 2021 or 2022 that will lead us to the playoffs.

[flafson]

Great, let’s trade Pompey for Thor because just until recently Pompey was also a top 100 prospect...

To sweeten the pot, we can also give them Hudson cause he’s a flamethrower.

[Boxcar]

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/marcus-stroman-is-now-a-met-for-some-reason/

 

Jay Jaffe is a moron.

 

His floor is as a high-leverage reliever

 

Lol yeah, ok

[saskjayfan]

I never once mentioned the word ACE. i said in the majors. I traded 2018 Gore for a shot at Yusei in fantasy. I hate the risk aspect of this deal, but 2018 Gore is the best comp for Sim

 

whatever, as i said, I've been drinking....the poster I originally responded to said Ace....this trade f***ing sux....we could have had stroman and pearson as early as mid next year for the next several years and still had a crap ton of money to spend to add around that. Now we have a lone wolf in pearson waiting for the prospects to join him in 21, 22, 23 or 24.....You ask Vlad, Bo, Lourdes and Cavan what they think of this s*** show trade.

[Andry]

Woods-Richardson seems promising, but is a ways away.

 

Kay seems OK.

 

I feel like the deal is missing another solid piece coming back.

 

Expected more, but maybe this is the market. I guess we'll see when other pitchers start getting traded.

[Angrioter]

Mlb prospects list upgraded

Kay 5

SWR 7

[Boxcar]

Gerrit Cole? Sonny Gray (James Kap was top 100 I realize), Matt Moore, Mike Fiers (although Hader became Hader), David Price?

 

David Price scored Devout Dan and Matt Boyd

Matt Moore sucked

Mike Fiers sucked

Sonny Gray sucked

 

So Gerrit Cole, which was regarded as an awful deal from the get go

 

Oops, you meant Price to the Tigers. Too lazy to look it up but pretty sure they got Adames and the return was also viewed as underwhelming

[Slade]

 

 

This is some funny s*** the Mets weakened their own leverage.

[Grant77]

Gerrit Cole? Sonny Gray (James Kap was top 100 I realize), Matt Moore, Mike Fiers (although Hader became Hader), David Price?

 

The Cole trade landed a really solid big leaguer in Joe Musgrove, although I do agree that the return was light.

 

Dustin Fowler was also top 100 in the Gray trade.

 

Matt Moore was a total mess at the time of the trade. I don't think he had the value of Stroman but feel free to debate this. Matt Duffy was also a solid big leaguer as well.

 

Mike Fiers was part of a larger deal that had at least one or two top 100 guys in Phillips and Santana.

 

David Price went for a really solid big league pitcher in Drew Smyly.

[TheHurl]

David Price scored Devout Dan and Matt Boyd

Matt Moore sucked

Mike Fiers sucked

Sonny Gray sucked

 

So Gerrit Cole, which was regarded as an awful deal from the get go

 

I meant Price 1.0 which returned Willy Adames and Drew Smyly

[Boxcar]

I meant Price 1.0 which returned Willy Adames and Drew Smyly

 

Yeah I amended

 

Smyly could have been pretty damn good if he could have stayed healthy.

[saskjayfan]

 

 

This is some funny s*** the Mets weakened their own leverage.

 

at this point, why don't the mets just stand pat and make a run with a rotation of Degrom Sydergaard and Stroman next year. They have 2 more years beyond this year of control for Sydergaard...there's not rush to trade the guy.

[Angrioter]

at this point, why don't the mets just stand pat and make a run with a rotation of Degrom Sydergaard and Stroman next year. They have 2 more years beyond this year of control for Sydergaard...there's not rush to trade the guy.

 

Because Mets suxx. Rebuilt is the better idea

[Jonn]

at this point, why don't the mets just stand pat and make a run with a rotation of Degrom Sydergaard and Stroman next year. They have 2 more years beyond this year of control for Sydergaard...there's not rush to trade the guy.

 

Its Wheeler who they will try to move now not Syndergaard.

[Dick_Pole]

s*** trade.

 

And to all the apologists trying to justify this deal:

 

1. An 18 year old prospect should not be the centerpiece of a deal, unless we're talking Griffey level here. The other guy, yeah he's okay. Thornton level. And they gave up Diaz to get him.

 

2. If Stroman is so undervalued as a pitch-to-contact type of guy, then the Jays should have extended him, recognizing market inefficiencies. And this is coming from someone who has been tired of Stroman's antics for longer than most.

 

Atkins' actions here makes me remember again why I was a bully in school. I want to smash his glasses, give him a wedgie and throw him in a locker after this.

 

And you apologists can mark this f***ing post too. If in 2025 this 18 year old wins a Cy Young in his second full season you can come back to this and I will STILL tell you this was a bad trade. If this guy gets this far it'll be on Jays' PD taking him there, not Atkins' trading skills.

 

No surprises that Hurl is working overtime here to defend this trade. He hated AA with a personal passion so it makes sense for him to prop up the next guy. Atkins is undoubtedly below AA now. Still ahead of Ricciardi but only because the verdict is still out on his drafts while we know JP's was dogshit. Then there's Ash which yeah he was a terrible beta male trying to run a team with guys like Gaston, Carter and Clemens steamrolling him and Ken Williams treating him like a patsy, but even HE got Cruz Jr. for relievers.

[Angrioter]

Jays owner hate Stroman

[Slade]

Just FYI for those wondering MLB Pipeline updated their rankings.

 

Kay ranks 5th and SWR ranks 7th.

 

http://m.mlb.com/prospects/2019?list=tor

[saskjayfan]

s*** trade.

 

And to all the apologists trying to justify this deal:

 

1. An 18 year old prospect should not be the centerpiece of a deal, unless we're talking Griffey level here. The other guy, yeah he's okay. Thornton level. And they gave up Diaz to get him.

 

2. If Stroman is so undervalued as a pitch-to-contact type of guy, then the Jays should have extended him, recognizing market inefficiencies. And this is coming from someone who has been tired of Stroman's antics for longer than most.

 

Atkins' actions here makes me remember again why I was a bully in school. I want to smash his glasses, give him a wedgie and throw him in a locker after this.

 

And you apologists can mark this f***ing post too. If in 2025 this 18 year old wins a Cy Young in his second full season you can come back to this and I will STILL tell you this was a bad trade. If this guy gets this far it'll be on Jays' PD taking him there, not Atkins' trading skills.

 

No surprises that Hurl is working overtime here to defend this trade. He hated AA with a personal passion so it makes sense for him to prop up the next guy. Atkins is undoubtedly below AA now. Still ahead of Ricciardi but only because the verdict is still out on his drafts while we know JP's was dogshit. Then there's Ash which yeah he was a terrible beta male trying to run a team with guys like Gaston, Carter and Clemens steamrolling him and Ken Williams treating him like a patsy, but even HE got Cruz Jr. for relievers.

 

the problem with atkins is he's dealing with a bunch of guys who were the bullies....and he's still a beta bitch getting bent over by veteran GMs who he is just hoping pick up his calls...

[Grant77]

Just FYI for those wondering MLB Pipeline updated their rankings.

 

Kay ranks 5th and SWR ranks 7th.

 

http://m.mlb.com/prospects/2019?list=tor

 

I like SWR better than Kay and I think that Pardinho should be higher than both pf them, but the rankings are fairly reasonable.

[AintNoThang]

I think my biggest issue with the trade is that if you're trading for players on that level, you better be getting back more than 2, to spread out the risk. If you're getting a pitcher who projects as back end, and an 18 yr old in low ball, at least get another interesting piece. I always said I'd rather one top propsect than a few lower level propsects. But since they went that route, they should've got another interesting piece....even if it's a very raw low minors guy. This is incredibly frustrating!