Ohtani Thread - Special Sheriff's Edition (Update: confirmed going to the Dodgers)

[Laika]

0 chance I'd want to give any baseball player 600M... let alone a player who has a chance of just being a DH for most of the contract. This is a type of contract that rarely ever works out and can screw you for the entire length of it.

 

Obviously I'd be pumped to get Ohtani but the backend of that deal is gonna be extreme dark times.

 

On the contrary, I think the fact that he goes both ways makes him a bit more resilient to aging.

 

If he loses bat speed at 34 and is striking out 30% of the time, and continuously pulling his groin running to first...... just make him a full time pitcher.

 

And on the other side, if he develops TOS and can only throw 91 and just plain sucks.... he's a DH. Or a 1B, or OF. Whatever.

 

Like, he could experience COMPLETE AND UTTER CAREER RUINING DISASTER on one side of the ball and just continue along as a 2-4 win player on the flipside.

 

ANTI-FRAGILE.

[Stangstag]

I was just going to ask this also. At what point is his effectiveness on the mound no longer worth "wasting" him as a DH? Is he PRIME Mike Trout if he becomes a fulltime RFer? I think he's probably a 7-10 WAR player

 

I bet at worst he could play RF and pitch in relief a couple times a week when needed.

 

The dude is an incredible athlete

[Terminator]

I bet at worst he could play RF and pitch in relief a couple times a week when needed.

 

The dude is an incredible athlete

 

Yeah I think OF/RP would be an intriguing option as well. Might as well throw 1B in the mix too.

[Laika]

On a 10 year deal a star player might go:

 

6, 6, 5, 4, 3, 0, 2, 0, 1, 0 WAR

 

Ohtani could go:

 

9, 8, 5, 8, 5, 4, 2, 2, 2, 2 WAR

[Terminator]

If you move him to RP you wouldn't get the WAR out of him that you would as a starter. But if he was a lights out late inning guy you could get plenty of WPA out of him.

[Terminator]

I don’t care if they give him 600M if they sign one of the greatest FA in all of sports I will not complain for the next 13 years

 

Yeah I don't care if we win 70 games a year in the last 5 years of his contract and he's putting up 1 to 2 WAR. Ohtani going into the HoF with a Jays cap on would be the greatest thing this franchise has experienced since the back to back WS. And he's pretty damn good so hopefully he adds a trophy or two as well.

[Jays24]

I don’t care if they give him 600M if they sign one of the greatest FA in all of sports I will not complain for the next 13 years

 

Maaannn... you know that's a crock because you'd complain this upcoming season if we still suck. Angels sucked with the same guy AND Trout so it's very possible lol.

[Eat My Shatkins]

Maaannn... you know that's a crock because you'd complain this upcoming season if we still suck. Angels sucked with the same guy AND Trout so it's very possible lol.

 

Of course it's possible the Jays would sign Ohtani and suck, but it's not probable.

Look at the Jays rotation and bullpen compared to what the Angels had the last half dozen years with Ohtani and Trout.

Then you throw in Bichette, Springer, Varsho, Vaddy and a top 5 catching tandem, all of whom are contributors and not black holes...

[max silver]

Maaannn... you know that's a crock because you'd complain this upcoming season if we still suck. Angels sucked with the same guy AND Trout so it's very possible lol.

 

Jesus man the team has a legitimate opportunity to sign the greatest free agent in the history of the sport and you're still f***ing complaining.

 

The Blue Jays would be surrounding Ohtani with a very good core of players, unlike the Angels who largely employed a stars and scrubs type of roster construction.

[Brownie19]

0 chance I'd want to give any baseball player 600M... let alone a player who has a chance of just being a DH for most of the contract. This is a type of contract that rarely ever works out and can screw you for the entire length of it.

 

Obviously I'd be pumped to get Ohtani but the backend of that deal is gonna be extreme dark times.

 

You're impossible man. First off, if he's a "DH for most of the contract" than he's also pitching. If he isn't pitching, he's likely a GG RFer who putting up 7-10 WAR a season. Obviously there are risks in any deal this big, but Ohtani has fewer risks than most as Laika points out. You also can't downplay the potential to have one of the best baseball players in the world (and of all time?) on your roster.

 

Nothing seems to make you happy (unrealistic expectations much?).

[Jays24]

No doubt the Jays look good on paper with Ohtani but we all know games aren't won like that. I was just talking about people who say they won't complain if we get Ohtani lol

[Terminator]

**UPDATE**

 

Ok folks my sources are telling me that Drake has officially been given the BOOT. He is no longer a part of the negotiating team.

 

I'm told that Geddy and others haven't been thrilled with Drake's efforts (earlier this week in the team meeting he asked if Ohtani's career batting average was high enough much to the disgust of everyone in attendance). We are trying to sign the second coming of Babe Ruth and he's still dicking around with that mediocre basketball team so he's OUT.

 

The final straw was when Geddy brought up how Drake fumbled the courting of Kawhi and that he was "going to %&@# this up too" and they damn near got into a fistfight. At that point Geddy point blank told Ed Rogers that it's either him or Drake and the answer was easy. We are keeping the great Geddy Lee and Drake can take a hike.

 

The last minute shakeup obviously isn't ideal but the word is that Ohtani doesn't even know who Drake is so I don't think it will hurt our chances that much. The negotiating team is scheduled to meet with Ohtani in LA this weekend. I will keep you all posted.

[Marew]

Does anyone know if this contract has been signed yet?

[Brownie19]

No doubt the Jays look good on paper with Ohtani but we all know games aren't won like that. I was just talking about people who say they won't complain if we get Ohtani lol

 

Given your history - you're probably talking to yourself.

[max silver]

No doubt the Jays look good on paper with Ohtani but we all know games aren't won like that. I was just talking about people who say they won't complain if we get Ohtani lol

 

You seem to be missing how transformative signing a player like this would be for the franchise. It would instantly catapult the organization upwards in world wide popularity, would add an elite bat (best is MLB last season) to a lineup desperately in need of offensive firepower, make the team much more attractive as a destination for other potential free agent signings, and if Ohtani is able to fully bounce back after surgery adds a top of the rotation talent to the team as well.

[gruber92]

I think we can almost realistically look at Springer as a league average player moving forward, hopefully not. Hopefully one of our younger players can excel in an outfield spot to absorb some of it.

 

I'd rather have The Weekend do some Ohtani courting opposed to loser Drake, lol.

[glory]

A 12-13 year deal would take Ohtani to age 40-41, so there would definitely be some dead money in there unless he defies aging on top of all the other great things he can do, but he's not Pujols or Cabrera. Aside from his ability to pitch, he's also a great athlete, plus base runner, and if he needs to take a break from pitching then he can likely transition into a plus defensive OF for a few years, so he'll be able to provide value aside from his bat (which is elite). That's not even factoring the marketing aspect and how much he changes the Jays "brand".

 

So yeah, if the Jays actually pull off this miracle and sign him, you can certainly dread what his production could look like in 2030-35, but I don't think too many Jays fans would care about that in 2023.

[wilko]

I think we can almost realistically look at Springer as a league average player moving forward, hopefully not. Hopefully one of our younger players can excel in an outfield spot to absorb some of it.

 

I'd rather have The Weekend do some Ohtani courting opposed to loser Drake, lol.

 

I'll take a 2 WAR Springer.

[Laika]

Think about it though.

 

Shiny new stadium interior will be completely done next year, it has been a multi-year process.

Toronto the ultimate international city. Uncle Tetsu's is here.

The Blue Jays core has been treading water, struggling to get to that "next level" of playoff success or division winning.

Corporate owner that is uniquely positioned to squeeze all the juice out of Ohtani.

Looking less and less likely that Bo will extend here, or that Vlad will even be worth an extension, so the 2025 on payroll is more open.

Short term, one of the biggest issues was LHB thump in the lineup...

 

Toronto should probably be blowing LAD out of the water to make this happen

[Frenchsoup]

Just win the world series and put the most complete team on the field.

[Spanky99]

Jesus man the team has a legitimate opportunity to sign the greatest free agent in the history of the sport and you're still f***ing complaining.

 

The Blue Jays would be surrounding Ohtani with a very good core of players, unlike the Angels who largely employed a stars and scrubs type of roster construction.

 

You're impossible man. First off, if he's a "DH for most of the contract" than he's also pitching. If he isn't pitching, he's likely a GG RFer who putting up 7-10 WAR a season. Obviously there are risks in any deal this big, but Ohtani has fewer risks than most as Laika points out. You also can't downplay the potential to have one of the best baseball players in the world (and of all time?) on your roster.

 

Nothing seems to make you happy (unrealistic expectations much?).

 

He's the f***ing worst.

[Carlos Danger]

This is going to be like when we thought we were going to get the Japanese SP that the Red Sox got, the name escapes me.

 

There was even a false report last minute that we had won the bidding as we were all listening with baited breadth.

 

If LAD wants him they will get him. We only signed Ryu since LAD didn't want him.

 

I am afraid there is going to be some serious blue balls for the Blue Jays...

[Frenchsoup]

Daiske Matzuzaka?

[Stangstag]

I think we can almost realistically look at Springer as a league average player moving forward, hopefully not. Hopefully one of our younger players can excel in an outfield spot to absorb some of it.

 

I'd rather have The Weekend do some Ohtani courting opposed to loser Drake, lol.

 

Next year will be telling for Springer. Was it age decline or just a down year? Was he hindered by the concussion he suffered in 2022?

 

If he looks the same next year I think you’d have to consider the contract a sunk cost

[wilko]

Daiske Matzuzaka?

 

Hideo Nono

[John_Havok]

Hideo Nono

 

Hideki Irabu?

[Terminator]

This is going to be like when we thought we were going to get the Japanese SP that the Red Sox got, the name escapes me.

 

There was even a false report last minute that we had won the bidding as we were all listening with baited breadth.

 

If LAD wants him they will get him. We only signed Ryu since LAD didn't want him.

 

I am afraid there is going to be some serious blue balls for the Blue Jays...

 

Yeah definitely see similarities.

 

But the Dice-K situation seemed like pure fan speculation that got out of hand.

 

The Yu Darvish saga seemed a little bit more real but also was hard to believe because the franchise just wasn't a big spender back in 2011.

 

This Ohtani situation feels different because we are now big spenders and it appears that we are a finalist.

 

The gorilla in the room is the Dodgers of course but (1) it's possible we could get crazy and outbid them and (2) we don't know what he is looking for exactly. If we make a pitch about keeping him healthy on the mound for a long time and he likes that maybe he could choose us. Last time it seemed like virtually every single team in the league was interested in him and he chose the Angels of all teams.

 

So yeah, LAD remains the heavy favorites but it definitely seems like we are in the running as much as anyone else and that we do have a legit shot to land him.

[John_Havok]

Yeah definitely see similarities.

 

But the Dice-K situation seemed like pure fan speculation that got out of hand.

 

The Yu Darvish saga seemed a little bit more real but also was hard to believe because the franchise just wasn't a big spender back in 2011.

 

This Ohtani situation feels different because we are now big spenders and it appears that we are a finalist.

 

The gorilla in the room is the Dodgers of course but (1) it's possible we could get crazy and outbid them and (2) we don't know what he is looking for exactly. If we make a pitch about keeping him healthy on the mound for a long time and he likes that maybe he could choose us. Last time it seemed like virtually every single team in the league was interested in him and he chose the Angels of all teams.

 

So yeah, LAD remains the heavy favorites but it definitely seems like we are in the running as much as anyone else and that we do have a legit shot to land him.

 

It really feels like the Dodgers would be unsurprising to land both Ohtani and Yamamoto. They sat out last offseason on virtually everyone of note in order to get under the luxury tax for Ohtani, and still won 100 games. They can now blow their wads on both guys if they like and be 100+ win team in their sleep for the next decade.

 

Might even get to the CS a time or two.

[Terminator]

It really feels like the Dodgers would be unsurprising to land both Ohtani and Yamamoto. They sat out last offseason on virtually everyone of note in order to get under the luxury tax for Ohtani, and still won 100 games. They can now blow their wads on both guys if they like and be 100+ win team in their sleep for the next decade.

 

Might even get to the CS a time or two.

 

Yeah it's possible and in general it's hard to see the Jays outbidding the Dodgers but I think Ohtani helps the Jays franchise more than he does the Dodgers, and that could lead us to putting up a bigger bid.

 

Think of it this way, Ohtani doesn't really transform the Dodgers organization. He cranks things up to another level perhaps, but it isn't transforming their organization. They are still one of the top orgs with or without him.

 

Ohtani coming to the Jays just completely changes things for this franchise. Honestly, it probably changes things for the country a little bit as crazy as that sounds. I think everyone could be pretty damn proud that the biggest free agent in sports history chose to play in Canada. So the transformative value that he brings to the Jays could give us the extra juice it needs to throw a gargantuan number at him that even the Dodgers won't match.

 

Now I'm not saying this to suggest we have even a 30% chance. It's probably like 10 if I had to guess. But if we do get him I think this is why/how it happens.

[Marew]

I thought linyl messy was biggest sports signing