What the F is Manoah on a major league rotation? Does the org not have any idea? LOL

[BCZ]

Haha what

[BCZ]

This is the start of a quality thread, I assure you.

[L54]

It’s bizarre to keep handing him starts in the middle of a playoff race. I don’t have the answer but as of today it’s clearly not Manoah. I was shocked to see him brought back up so quickly, I didn’t think we’d see him again this year

[L54]

Actually I shouldn’t say that. I didn’t think he should be up again this year. You don’t fix being the worst starter in the majors with two minor league starts

 

The pitching lab is broken

[connorp]

About time you guys stopped over-rating Dunedin like it’s some voodoo lab

[Terminator]

I agree it was too fast to bring him up but he looked okay in AA and then okay again against the Tigers. And they are working with far more data than we are.

 

With the trade deadline coming up they want to know what they've got. You hate to give up anything, even if it's a 40FV, for something you've already got on the roster. With the added WCs it's turned the deadline into a constant seller's market. Look at last year, they traded for Mitch White and it hasn't gone well.

[L54]

I agree it was too fast to bring him up but he looked okay in AA and then okay again against the Tigers. They are working with far more data than we are.

 

With the trade deadline coming up they want to know what they've got. You hate to give up anything, even if it's a 40FV, for something you've already got on the roster. With the added WCs it's turned the deadline into a constant seller's market. Look at last year, they traded for Mitch White and it hasn't gone well.

 

They should proceed from here on out like Alek Manoah doesn’t even exist. He should not factor in to a single decision for the remainder of 2023

[glory]

The Jays willing to lose games during a playoff push is mind boggling to me. Sending him down and trying to get him right for 2024-beyond seems like a much smarter way to go than hoping a 6.00 ERA starter whose stuff/command looks like dog s*** is going to win games against competent offenses.

[RobinThicc]

Listening to the radio today, I believe it was Blake Murphy who said that in his first start in the minors the slider was trash and in his 2nd start it still wasnt great.

 

Obviously rushed him back considering it doesnt seem like they addressed his slider.

[Terminator]

They should proceed from here on out like Alek Manoah doesn’t even exist. He should not factor in to a single decision for the remainder of 2023

 

That doesn't make sense. Not being able to count on Manoah most certainly does factor into their decisions for the deadline.

[JaysAllMighty]

I think it's time for some Stro time

[Terminator]

Last year they traded for a 26 year old former Top 100 prospect who had an ERA of 3.58 in over 105 MLB innings last year and it has since blown up in their face.

 

People here bitch about that trade almost daily. So perhaps excuse the team if they want to be careful in trading for more backend starting pitchers if they don't have to. But after Manoah's last start, I can ssure you they are looking to acquire someone with Ryu also playing a factor.

[L54]

That doesn't make sense. Not being able to count on Manoah most certainly does factor into their decisions for the deadline.

 

Huh?

 

You proceed like he is injured. He shouldn’t make another start this season

 

Gausman

Berrios

Bassitt

Kikuchi

Ryu on the way

 

That means they need to add an SP

[Stangstag]

I think it's time for some Stro time

 

Extra salt if Stroman demands #6 and the org takes it from Manoah haha. (I know it wouldn’t happen but still fun to think about)

[L54]

Last year they traded for a 26 year old former Top 100 prospect who had an ERA of 3.58 in over 105 MLB innings last year and it has since blown up in their face.

 

People here bitch about that trade almost daily. So perhaps excuse the team if they want to be careful in trading for more backend starting pitchers if they don't have to. But after Manoah's last start, I can ssure you they are looking to acquire someone with Ryu also playing a factor.

 

You can cry over split milk or keep moving forward and make the best decisions possible for the current roster. A failed trade doesn’t mean you don’t make another one

 

Ryu is a massive question mark. Manoah shouldn’t be in the bigs. They hold the second WC spot and have four starters. Something has to give

[Terminator]

You can cry over split milk or keep moving forward and make the best decisions possible for the current roster. A failed trade doesn’t mean you don’t make another one

 

Ryu is a massive question mark. Manoah shouldn’t be in the bigs. They hold the second WC spot and have four starters. Something has to give

 

Correct. They need to trade for a starting pitcher. Ross Atkins said today that they are looking for one.

[Jays333]

I think the FO needed to see if he was going to bounce back before Ryu comes back and before the deadline. Its going to dictate what they do. Judging by the outing yesterday I would have to assume that he will be sent back down. We will acquire a starter at the deadline, (not Stroman, farm not strong enough). And either it will be a 6 man rotation or Ryu or Kikuchi is bullpen bound.

 

I have to agree though the situation was handled quite poorly. Before he got sent down the first time how many games did we punt into the sun when it seemed everyone on earth knew what the results were going to be except the team.

[L54]

The front office didn’t need to see him in the majors. They have all the spin rate and data they need to make the decision. They’re simply too chicken s*** to sit Manoah down and tell him he’s going down and that he needs to lose 50 pounds

 

That’s my guess anyway. You guys really think the data from getting nuked by 17 year olds was positive?

[MikeM3]

We have no one else to use that's why.

[Terminator]

The front office didn’t need to see him in the majors. They have all the spin rate and data they need to make the decision. They’re simply too chicken s*** to sit Manoah down and tell him he’s going down and that he needs to lose 50 pounds

 

That’s my guess anyway. You guys really think the data from getting nuked by 17 year olds was positive?

 

This is crazy pills. They already sent him down once. I highly doubt any sort of fear of confrontation is playing a role in this lol.

 

And no the data from the FCL start was most certainly not good lol. But he looked good in AA, looked good against the Tigers and probably looked ok in whatever lab he was in.

 

And it hasn't really even hurt us that much. He had 1 good start and 1 bad start while eating a few innings. I doubt 2 bullpen games would have worked out that much better. Now it's trade deadline time and Ryu is almost back.

 

If anything, they sent him down too late which didn't give them enough time to try and fix him to get a good look before the deadline. But it's not everyday your Top 3 Cy Young finisher turns into a pumpkin in one offseason. The decisions surrounding that aren't going to be easy.

[L54]

So we’re relying on the eye test now to evaluate pitchers? I’m so confused

[L54]

We have no one else to use that's why.

 

Ya I guess this is why I just looked at the 40 man. It’s either Alek or Jesus Christ himself Mitch White

[wamco]

How bout Mitch white as an opener. Get an out or two and then pull him. Seems about his ceiling at the moment.

[Terminator]

So we’re relying on the eye test now to evaluate pitchers? I’m so confused

 

I think you're being obtuse but you're often confused so it's hard to say for sure.

 

When I say he "looked good" I'm using that colloquially to reference the "data" that both you and I have been referencing. The "data" didn't look good when he was getting nuked by FCLers. The "data" probably looked good in AA, against the Tigers and in the lab, etc.

[L54]

How bout Mitch white as an opener. Get an out or two and then pull him. Seems about his ceiling at the moment.

 

Hopefully this is what happens

 

Ryu activated

Manoah optioned

Green activated

White DFA’d

SP acquired

Jay Jackson optioned

Kikuchi to the pen

[Laika]

Hopefully this is what happens

 

Ryu activated

Manoah optioned

Green activated

White DFA’d

SP acquired

Jay Jackson optioned

Kikuchi to the pen

 

sounds good to me

[Laika]

Jordan Montgomery

[Brownie19]

I think you're being obtuse but you're often confused so it's hard to say for sure.

 

When I say he "looked good" I'm using that colloquially to reference the "data" that both you and I have been referencing. The "data" didn't look good when he was getting nuked by FCLers. The "data" probably looked good in AA, against the Tigers and in the lab, etc.

 

But his Stuff+ was 82 in the game v. the Tigers. That data suggests he's not a ML pitcher.

[L54]

I think you're being obtuse but you're often confused so it's hard to say for sure.

 

When I say he "looked good" I'm using that colloquially to reference the "data" that both you and I have been referencing. The "data" didn't look good when he was getting nuked by FCLers. The "data" probably looked good in AA, against the Tigers and in the lab, etc.

 

The data “probably” looking good and the data looking good are two different things my guy

[L54]

But his Stuff+ was 82 in the game v. the Tigers. That data suggests he's not a ML pitcher.

 

Thank you for sharing this