General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2023)

[connorp]

The major issue with this year's offense has largely been the lack of performance by key members of the team who were retained and not the players who were sent out/acquired. Both of Teoscar and Gurriel are each sitting at 109 WRC+ values respectively so the lack of their presence on the roster hasn't been the key factor holding the offense back this season. Two of the three major additions have hit up to or even beyond expectations as well so the new roster additions largely did their part offensively. There was the weird 4 month stretch where the team floundered with runners on base that's reversed itself since August, but the lack of home run power has largely continued despite the amount of power contained on the roster. If you had a crystal ball to look ahead and know that nearly the entire team would stop hitting home runs to their capabilities you would have the chance to either adjust the hitting approach or tweak the roster as acquired.

 

I'd like to know what bats were available at the trade deadline as there weren't too many notable names that actually moved this year. I've seen Tommy Pham floated as a possibility but it seems unlikely that his 110 WRC+ since being traded would have been a massive difference maker.

 

It’s beyond RISP. It’s an army of .750 OPS bats coming at you. But there’s enough of them to score enough runs to win games with the pitching and D.

 

Nothing wrong with saying it’s not an exciting version. Playoffs are playoffs though. Not sure the team is built for a deep run, but other years when it seemed they could make a deep run, they got swept. Who knows

[Nexii]

Yea I think it's that the Jays don't have a single big superstar on offense to get excited about this year. So it feels like the offense is much worse than it is. Overall the lineup isn't that bad. 107 wRC+ puts them in a three-way tie for 7th in MLB

[wilko]

Jays are playing to projections though. They were projected for 88 wins and on pace for 90 wins.

 

Sweet profile pic.

[John_Havok]

Sweet profile pic.

 

Not creepy at all

[connorp]

Looks like an anime Tran. Nothing to see, it’s 2023

[wilko]

Looks like an anime Tran. Nothing to see, it’s 2023

 

Reported.

[Dick_Pole]

Manoah wasn't the ace last season FYI. It was Gausman.

 

Who got the Cy Young votes? Who led the team in ERA, pitching wins, IP? Who was named #1 starter this year? Who was tasked with starting the first playoff game last year? Just because a small cabal of dorks use their nerd stats to state that Gausman was relatively unlucky and predict that he would be better going forward doesn't mean that in 2022 Manoah didn't function as the ace to the franchise, to most fans and casual observers of the team.

 

All that aside, you f***ing knew exactly what I meant by the short form "ace" in this context. Significant pitcher, pitcher expected to be #1/#2 in 2023 etc. Using the one word "ace" gets the point across that Manoah taking a s*** all over 2023 was a significant setback to the team but despite that, the pitching has improved. You could have just stuck with your first paragraph and leave that little piece well enough alone. But no no, you had to be pedantic about it so you can feel good about yourself being one of those lame *******s from last year "but Gausman was better than Manoah" for a few seconds of your pathetic life. Was it really worth it?

[Spanky99]

Dick's PIST!

[deanmike]

Sounds like the Manoah fanbois are pissed off their favourite fatass sucks now and his ego's too big (and belly too big from inhaling Mary Brown's chicken and Doritos) to put in the effort required to work his way back to where he once was.

[Laika]

Sounds like the Manoah fanbois are pissed off their favourite fatass sucks now and his ego's too big (and belly too big from inhaling Mary Brown's chicken and Doritos) to put in the effort required to work his way back to where he once was.

 

there are literally no Manoah fanbois

 

I bet his family doesn't even like him

 

we are in Mat Latos territory here

[connorp]

Sounds like the Manoah fanbois are pissed off their favourite fatass sucks now and his ego's too big (and belly too big from inhaling Mary Brown's chicken and Doritos) to put in the effort required to work his way back to where he once was.

 

He simply rose a valid point. FIP may be a better indicator of what will happen going forward, but ERA/Wins/Whip are all what happened on the field. Across the whole year, Manoah was the guy. Sure, there were many that said 2023 would be a regression to a lesser mean, good for them, but that doesn’t mean Manoah wasn’t the ace on the field in 2022

[deanmike]

He simply rose a valid point. FIP may be a better indicator of what will happen going forward, but ERA/Wins/Whip are all what happened on the field. Across the whole year, Manoah was the guy. Sure, there were many that said 2023 would be a regression to a lesser mean, good for them, but that doesn’t mean Manoah wasn’t the ace on the field in 2022

 

So you're saying you think Manoah was the ace last year because Gausman routinely gets f***ed by the BABIP gods?

[deanmike]

there are literally no Manoah fanbois

 

I bet his family doesn't even like him

 

we are in Mat Latos territory here

 

I would hope his family is at least giving him the honest advice he needs to stop stuffing his face with family size bags of Doritos 24/7.

[connorp]

So you're saying you think Manoah was the ace last year because Gausman routinely gets f***ed by the BABIP gods?

 

Yeah it’s like giving the World Series mvp to the guy that pitched 15 innings with a 9.00 ERA, but a great FIP. Over the guy that pitched 15 innings of shutout ball with a worse FIP.

 

The MVP was the guy with the better old school numbers, lucky or not.

[connorp]

Next you’ll take away a guy hitting 40 HR bc his hr/fb ratio isn’t sustainable. Oh wait, you do that already lol. Enjoy the games. Nerd stats have their use too

[max silver]

Who got the Cy Young votes? Who led the team in ERA, pitching wins, IP? Who was named #1 starter this year? Who was tasked with starting the first playoff game last year? Just because a small cabal of dorks use their nerd stats to state that Gausman was relatively unlucky and predict that he would be better going forward doesn't mean that in 2022 Manoah didn't function as the ace to the franchise, to most fans and casual observers of the team.

 

All that aside, you f***ing knew exactly what I meant by the short form "ace" in this context. Significant pitcher, pitcher expected to be #1/#2 in 2023 etc. Using the one word "ace" gets the point across that Manoah taking a s*** all over 2023 was a significant setback to the team but despite that, the pitching has improved. You could have just stuck with your first paragraph and leave that little piece well enough alone. But no no, you had to be pedantic about it so you can feel good about yourself being one of those lame *******s from last year "but Gausman was better than Manoah" for a few seconds of your pathetic life. Was it really worth it?

 

There's no need to be so angry about this. It's perfectly defensible to prefer either of these guys as the team's best starter last season. They each produced xERA values within a few points of each other, with Gausman running a lower FIP due to lack of walks/homeruns and piling up strikeouts and higher ERA due to high BABIP. Manoah run a higher FIP due to fewer strikeouts but lower ERA as he generated more soft contact with a lower BABIP. I felt Manoah was more likely to see his numbers regress due the incoming shift ban as this would presumably lead to fewer batted balls turning into outs, whereas Gausman seemed to actually be hurt by the shift a good chunk of the time due to the unpredictable nature of the contact he gave up at times.

[Laika]

There's no need to be so angry about this. It's perfectly defensible to prefer either of these guys as the team's best starter last season. They each produced xERA values within a few points of each other, with Gausman running a lower FIP due to lack of walks/homeruns and piling up strikeouts and higher ERA due to high BABIP. Manoah run a higher FIP due to fewer strikeouts but lower ERA as he generated more soft contact with a lower BABIP. I felt Manoah was more likely to see his numbers regress due the incoming shift ban as this would presumably lead to fewer batted balls turning into outs, whereas Gausman seemed to actually be hurt by the shift a good chunk of the time due to the unpredictable nature of the contact he gave up at times.

 

You are missing the point, lol. Jaysblue was the one who did the initial "well actually...."

[max silver]

You are missing the point, lol. Jaysblue was the one who did the initial "well actually...."

 

I saw that actually. I have a ceasefire, albeit maybe temporary with Jaysblue so I can see his side of the argument.

[Spanky99]

Next you’ll take away a guy hitting 40 HR bc his hr/fb ratio isn’t sustainable. Oh wait, you do that already lol. Enjoy the games. Nerd stats have their use too

 

Was this a feeble attempt at a ball spike, lol?

[Spanky99]

I saw that actually. I have a ceasefire, albeit maybe temporary with Jaysblue so I can see his side of the argument.

 

He's passive aggressive.

[connorp]

Was this a feeble attempt at a ball spike, lol?

 

Uh, no? It was just a different example, weirdo

[deanmike]

Next you’ll take away a guy hitting 40 HR bc his hr/fb ratio isn’t sustainable. Oh wait, you do that already lol. Enjoy the games. Nerd stats have their use too

 

Trust me connorp, I f***ing wish Fatass G had 40 HR on the season.

[Omar]

You could have just stuck with your first paragraph and leave that little piece well enough alone. But no no, you had to be pedantic about it so you can feel good about yourself being one of those lame *******s from last year "but Gausman was better than Manoah" for a few seconds of your pathetic life. Was it really worth it?

 

While I generally enjoy Dick's posts due primarily to his pithy rhetoric and general accuracy of his takes (except when he called for the Jays to win the division post all-star break:rolleyes:), this response was way over the top. Most of this board is pedantic. Being pedantic is the calling card of most baseball message boards. Pointing out someones post as being pedantic is pedantic in itself. Then to call someone else's life pathetic because of a baseball opinion is uncalled for not to mention ludicrous and insulting.

 

Had to get that off my chest. If anyone if you has a problem with that you can meet me at Yonge-Bloor (the usual spot) and we can fight it out like real men.

 

End rant.

[Brownie19]

While I generally enjoy Dick's posts due primarily to his pithy rhetoric and general accuracy of his takes (except when he called for the Jays to win the division post all-star break:rolleyes:), this response was way over the top. Most of this board is pedantic. Being pedantic is the calling card of most baseball message boards. Pointing out someones post as being pedantic is pedantic in itself. Then to call someone else's life pathetic because of a baseball opinion is uncalled for not to mention ludicrous and insulting.

 

Had to get that off my chest. If anyone if you has a problem with that you can meet me at Yonge-Bloor (the usual spot) and we can fight it out like real men.

 

End rant.

 

What time Omar?

[Spanky99]

While I generally enjoy Dick's posts due primarily to his pithy rhetoric and general accuracy of his takes (except when he called for the Jays to win the division post all-star break:rolleyes:), this response was way over the top. Most of this board is pedantic. Being pedantic is the calling card of most baseball message boards. Pointing out someones post as being pedantic is pedantic in itself. Then to call someone else's life pathetic because of a baseball opinion is uncalled for not to mention ludicrous and insulting.

 

Had to get that off my chest. If anyone if you has a problem with that you can meet me at Yonge-Bloor (the usual spot) and we can fight it out like real men.

 

End rant.

 

Southwest corner @ Midnight...

[Spanky99]

What time Omar?

 

I got that guy to showup, lol.

[Laika]

The Blue Jays announced that they have selected the contract of outfielder Cam Eden. Infielder Ernie Clement has been optioned in a corresponding active roster move with infielder Mason McCoy designated for assignment to open a 40-man spot.

 

 

This must be a pinch runner move. 53/57 in SB attempts this year in 131 games

[Spanky99]

The Blue Jays announced that they have selected the contract of outfielder Cam Eden. Infielder Ernie Clement has been optioned in a corresponding active roster move with infielder Mason McCoy designated for assignment to open a 40-man spot.

 

 

This must be a pinch runner move. 53/57 in SB attempts this year in 131 games

 

Yup.

[G-Snarls]

The Blue Jays announced that they have selected the contract of outfielder Cam Eden. Infielder Ernie Clement has been optioned in a corresponding active roster move with infielder Mason McCoy designated for assignment to open a 40-man spot.

 

 

This must be a pinch runner move. 53/57 in SB attempts this year in 131 games

 

Kirk's dedicated late game pinch runner?

[Terminator]

The Blue Jays announced that they have selected the contract of outfielder Cam Eden. Infielder Ernie Clement has been optioned in a corresponding active roster move with infielder Mason McCoy designated for assignment to open a 40-man spot.

 

 

This must be a pinch runner move. 53/57 in SB attempts this year in 131 games

 

Great guy to have on the bench down the stretch and in the playoffs. Would prefer to keep Clement over Espinal though.