Around Baseball 2023

[Stangstag]

The Cards made that whole public spectacle over moving their expensive new catcher off the position, only to move him back a week later.

 

Model organization. Contreras is a true Card

[jaysblue]

Is Max Muncy the most valuable Mendoza Line batter ever lol?

 

900 OPS and batting .202 is nuts lol.

 

1.1 fWAR so far and projects for 5 fWAR over a full season, and all he needs to do is continue to walk and homer the same way and he'll do it batting 200 lol.

 

Wonder if anyone ever hit below .200 and posted an OPS close to .900 over a full season.

[max silver]

Wonder if anyone ever hit below .200 and posted an OPS close to .900 over a full season.

 

My first thought was to check Joey Gallo. He's only posted over .900 OPS once in his career, and that season he batted .253. He had another season with a .869 OPS and .209 so he's been close.

 

The dude who didn't like baseball Adam Dunn was another guy I checked, his closest full season was .236 batting average w/.898 OPS.

[Maine Jays]

Jays and Tigers should be in the same division as well. You basically drive across a bridge for series with these teams.

 

This. Grew up hating the Tigers starting when we finished a very distant second place to them in '84. That last week of the '87 season was the worst week of baseball in my life. Watching that last game of the season when Key threw an absolute gem, the only run being that Gibson homer, and losing

1-0, I could have thrown my parents TV out the window I was so mad.

Even with them being in the Central Division almost 30 years now, I still dislike them more than the Yanks, Rays, or Orioles (I'll always hate the Red Sox more than anyone).

[max silver]

This. Grew up hating the Tigers starting when we finished a very distant second place to them in '84. That last week of the '87 season was the worst week of baseball in my life. Watching that last game of the season when Key threw an absolute gem, the only run being that Gibson homer, and losing

1-0, I could have thrown my parents TV out the window I was so mad.

Even with them being in the Central Division almost 30 years now, I still dislike them more than the Yanks, Rays, or Orioles (I'll always hate the Red Sox more than anyone).

 

I think it's literally impossible for anyone on the face of the earth to hate the Red Sox more than board member Grant77.

[BTS]

The Cards made that whole public spectacle over moving their expensive new catcher off the position, only to move him back a week later.

 

The team is a circus. We're to believe he learned how to catch in his week as a DH?

[Maine Jays]

I meant any other team than the Red Sox, not that I hated them more than anyone else on earth

[BigCecil]

We're like 25% of the way through the season and it's rermarkable how almost every contract has been a disaster so far.

 

Trea Turner (11/300) - K-rate up like 7% and basically a slap hitter right now per Statcast

Carlos Correa (6/100)- has been replacement-level trash

Jake deGrom (6/185) - shut down after 30 innings because of multiple injuries

Carlos Rodon (6/162) - immediately diagnosed with chronic back issue and hasn't pitched

Edwin Diaz (5/102) - blew out his knee, hasn't pitched

Willson Contreras (5/87.5) - scapegoated for Cards pitching being terrible and moved off catcher for a week

Justin Verlander (2/86.6) - has only thrown 12 mediocre innnings

Andrew Benintendi (5/75) - replacement-level slap hitter

Kodai Senga (5/75) - no command, looks like a 1-2 WAR SP

Taijuan Walker (4/72) - the same 1-2 WAR SP he's always been outside of a decent 2022

Chris Bassitt (3/60) - showing signs of significant skill erosion

Jose Abreu (3/60) - looks completely cooked

Robert Suarez (5/46) - injured and hasn't thrown a pitch

Mitch Haniger (3/43.5) - has been injured and terrible

Tyler Anderson (3/39) - doesn't even look like a viable SP anymore

 

Well over $1 billion paid out to the above players, and they're cumulatively hovering around replacement level. Draft and develop, kids. Building through FA is a recipe for being very bad for a very long time.

 

There were some value signings out there: The Rays seem to have got it right with Eflin. Strahm, Lugo, and Bellinger all look shrewd. Some vets re-signing with their former teams for reasons other than $ look good (Kershaw and Rizzo).

 

So much risk. Not that I want don't want to have Bo or Vlad long term (Chappy will be here all his walk year unless we fall out early which is unlikely). If we can sign Bo/Vlad for Franco/Riley ish money it makes some sense, but if not, you have to wonder if $600-700M could be spent elsewhere better.

 

FO will determine next year probably trade for value; push signing hard; or play them out and let walk (most likely). Just my view, but I think they are all going to test free agency. The Astros and Rays have done a great job letting some core pieces move on, while still building a sustainable winner. So have the BoSox.

[Jimcanuck]

7 shutout innings, 13K for Mitch Keller

 

breakout is real

[John_Havok]

So much risk. Not that I want don't want to have Bo or Vlad long term (Chappy will be here all his walk year unless we fall out early which is unlikely). If we can sign Bo/Vlad for Franco/Riley ish money it makes some sense, but if not, you have to wonder if $600-700M could be spent elsewhere better.

 

FO will determine next year probably trade for value; push signing hard; or play them out and let walk (most likely). Just my view, but I think they are all going to test free agency. The Astros and Rays have done a great job letting some core pieces move on, while still building a sustainable winner. So have the BoSox.

 

True, but how many of those they let walk or traded were in their mid 20s putting up 150~ wRC+?

 

Essentially they’ve let them go at the end of their 20s when the decline phase was in sight, or mid 30s vets still performing well just not wanting to keep paying them premiums.

 

CHappy would be the example on the Jays roster, not Vlad or Bo this season. 1 of them walking when they hit FA would be similar to Xander leaving Boston.

[Terminator]

There were some value signings out there: The Rays seem to have got it right with Eflin. Strahm, Lugo, and Bellinger all look shrewd. Some vets re-signing with their former teams for reasons other than $ look good (Kershaw and Rizzo).

 

I apologize but I would be doing the board a serious disservice if I didn't point out that Bellinger has a wRC+ of 52 in the month of May.

 

In other words, he had a nice April which is great for a guy who hit like John McDonald the past few years. But it's now struck midnight on the board's Cinderella and his 2023 season is turning back into a pumpkin. Sorry guys.

[BigCecil]

True, but how many of those they let walk or traded were in their mid 20s putting up 150~ wRC+?

 

Essentially they’ve let them go at the end of their 20s when the decline phase was in sight, or mid 30s vets still performing well just not wanting to keep paying them premiums.

 

CHappy would be the example on the Jays roster, not Vlad or Bo this season. 1 of them walking when they hit FA would be similar to Xander leaving Boston.

 

Xander had a deal already and opted out. Not sure on that comparable. Bo will be 27/28 when he hits FA in 2026. He is already 25. That’s pretty close to end of your 20’s. Especially when you are a below average SS to begin with. I get the argument they are young rare talents. Still a good debate whether they are worth what some think they will want when and if they test the market. Or if we want to go a different route and spend that money in alternative ways.

[max silver]

I apologize but I would be doing the board a serious disservice if I didn't point out that Bellinger has a wRC+ of 52 in the month of May.

 

In other words, he had a nice April which is great for a guy who hit like John McDonald the past few years. But it's now struck midnight on the board's Cinderella and his 2023 season is turning back into a pumpkin. Sorry guys.

 

Are you going to point out the same with Matt Chapman who had a 49 WRC+ for the month of May heading into today? Didn't think so. A bad few weeks doesn't erase an entire month of success you absolute nincompoop.

[Terminator]

Are you going to point out the same with Matt Chapman who had a 49 WRC+ for the month of May heading into today? Didn't think so. A bad few weeks doesn't erase an entire month of success you absolute nincompoop.

 

So a good April wipes out not only what he's doing in May, but also what he did in:

 

April 2021

May 2021

June 2021

July 2021

August 2021

September 2021

April 2022

May 2022

June 2022

July 2022

August 2022, and

September 2022?

 

Why does April of 2023 mean so much more to you than the other 13 months?

[max silver]

So a good April wipes out not only what he's doing in May, but also what he did in:

 

April 2021

May 2021

June 2021

July 2021

August 2021

September 2021

April 2022

May 2022

June 2022

July 2022

August 2022, and

September 2022?

 

Why does April of 2023 mean so much more to you than the other 13 months?

 

Unlike you I actually enjoy when a player makes changes to his swing/routine/approach etc. and then experiences success as a result. It remains to be seen if Bellinger can recreate his April success but I'm not the type to make grand assumptions that just because he had several bad seasons in a row that he's automatically going to return to that previous form based on a few weeks where he isn't experiencing the same kind of success.

[Terminator]

Unlike you I actually enjoy when a player makes changes to his swing/routine/approach etc. and then experiences success as a result. It remains to be seen if Bellinger can recreate his April success but I'm not the type to make grand assumptions that just because he had several bad seasons in a row that he's automatically going to return to that previous form based on a few weeks where he isn't experiencing the same kind of success.

 

Oh I'm sorry...I'll wait for a sample size that's larger than "several bad seasons in a row" before I make any more assumptions about Bellinger lol

[Spanky__99]

Oh I'm sorry...I'll wait for a sample size that's larger than "several bad seasons in a row" before I make any more assumptions about Bellinger lol

 

lol...

[John_Havok]

Xander had a deal already and opted out. Not sure on that comparable. Bo will be 27/28 when he hits FA in 2026. He is already 25. That’s pretty close to end of your 20’s. Especially when you are a below average SS to begin with. I get the argument they are young rare talents. Still a good debate whether they are worth what some think they will want when and if they test the market. Or if we want to go a different route and spend that money in alternative ways.

 

Bo is not a below average shortstop. Bo is a below average defensive shortstop. There’s a really big distinction between those two comments. If all that mattered at SS was defense, Espinal would be playing everyday

 

As for the rest, yeah. We can debate all day long whether player X or Y is worth whatever contract they sign, the answer is almost always no if it’s a free agent deal that pays the going rate. Usually the only deals that ever turn out to be worth it are the early extensions that get cost certainty in place and buy out a few FA years at below market rate.

[max silver]

Oh I'm sorry...I'll wait for a sample size that's larger than "several bad seasons in a row" before I make any more assumptions about Bellinger lol

 

Bellinger's best month over the entire 2021-2022 seasons saw him produce a 125 WRC+. It's certainly far from a guarantee but his 152 WRC+ over his first 28 games of 2023 make it appear possible that he's figured some stuff out.

[BTS]

ESPN crew going on about how there are no breaks in a Boston lineup that includes Casas, Enmanuel Valdez, Pablo Lopez, and Reese McGuire.

[Stangstag]

So a good April wipes out not only what he's doing in May, but also what he did in:

 

April 2021

May 2021

June 2021

July 2021

August 2021

September 2021

April 2022

May 2022

June 2022

July 2022

August 2022, and

September 2022?

 

Why does April of 2023 mean so much more to you than the other 13 months?

 

Loll tell em Term

[L54]

Kirk’s wRC+ for May is 13

[L54]

ESPN crew going on about how there are no breaks in a Boston lineup that includes Casas, Enmanuel Valdez, Pablo Lopez, and Reese McGuire.

 

Scary how deep their lineup is wow

[Pendleton]

[Terminator]

 

At one point in the exchange you can see Harper tell the Rockies that everyone in the entire organization is a loser lol

[connorp]

So hindsight 20/20, it looks like Lars Nootbaar was the proper target. Looking legit. Wonder if he was on the table

[Carlos Danger]

Kirk’s wRC+ for May is 13

 

Is that a typo? Are you missing a digit?

[BTS]

So hindsight 20/20, it looks like Lars Nootbaar was the proper target. Looking legit. Wonder if he was on the table

 

He's a stud

[Orgfiller]

So hindsight 20/20, it looks like Lars Nootbaar was the proper target. Looking legit. Wonder if he was on the table

 

He wasn’t available? Weren’t there rumours that the Jays were targeting Nootbar for one of their catchers but all the Cards would offer was Helsley for Jansen or something like that?

[Jonn]

This ESPN Baseball crew is so bad.

 

Atleast the Red Sox are getting s*** on