General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2022)

[Spanky99]

DK offering a free bet up to $100, win or lose. Bet $10 on Jays to win + any Jay to hit a HR vs Red Sox this Friday.

 

Already at $50. 2 more days to reach $100 hopefully.

 

Wat?

[Stangstag]

Jays considering an All-Star game host bid for 2027

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/mlb/article/blue-jays-discussing-possible-bid-for-2027-all-star-game-with-major-league-baseball/

 

Tidbit from the article:

 

"Final plans aren’t yet known, but initial discussions included the outfield being redone with elevated bullpens and asymmetric walls this winter (some season-ticket subscribers were recently informed that they’ll be relocated in 2023). The rest of the lower bowl reset will start in the off-season to follow."

 

Would love it. I’ve been wanting to do the allstar week for a couple years now, almost decided to make a trip to Cleveland for the game/derby a couple years back but my plans didn’t work out. If its in Toronto im definitely going to every event I can

[Spanky99]

Would love it. I’ve been wanting to do the allstar week for a couple years now, almost decided to make a trip to Cleveland for the game/derby a couple years back but my plans didn’t work out. If its in Toronto im definitely going to every event I can

 

In this city? Good Luck... unless you're a ticket holder?

[Stangstag]

In this city? Good Luck... unless you're a ticket holder?

 

I’d be willing to buy season tix just to get dibs on the all-star game and events.

Just have the 1/4 season package this year

[mellowgold]

So what does the pitching look like for this Boston series?

 

Manoah/Gausman/Stripling?

[Spanky99]

So what does the pitching look like for this Boston series?

 

Manoah/Gausman/Stripling?

 

Gassman, Berrios, Manoah...

[glory]

[Jays333]

Bluejays would be dumb to give up a fortune for Soto when pitching wins in this league and pitching is what we need so bad

[Deadpool]

 

Misses bats, has 2 options remaining. Certainly couldn't hurt on a MiLB contract.

[L54]

[BigCecil]

Bluejays would be dumb to give up a fortune for Soto when pitching wins in this league and pitching is what we need so bad

 

Ryu/Kooch/Chatwood/Berrios/Gausman/Roark/Yates/Garcia/Ray/Matz - since 20 the FO has been signing a fair number of arms. Some have worked out.

 

They have gotten rid of a #1 pick and SWR arms in the process.

 

Takes a combo of D, offence and pitching to win in this league. Jays would be foolish to not look at what they have to give up for Soto, or any other asset that could add net value to this team. Maybe pitching isn't on the list to go.

[The Cats Ass]

Conforto would fit in well I think. He'd be a good DH for late Sept and Playoffs.

[BigCecil]

So bored no baseball. Committed heresy and listened to Wilner pod for first time because Devo was on it.

 

He reminded me the '93 WS winner went 3-13 at one point in July. Gives some perspective to the recent skid.

 

Lot of guys OTB too young to remember Devo. Swung too much and didn't get on base enough (so naturally Cito had him LO) 42 career WAR and started triple play in the WS that no video replay ruined. He was so smooth in CF.

 

(just realized other teams playing today. all is good)

Edited July 21, 2022 by BigCecil

[John_Havok]

So bored no baseball. Committed heresy and listened to Wilner pod for first time because Devo was on it.

 

He reminded me the '93 WS winner went 3-13 at one point in July. Gives some perspective to the recent skid.

 

Lot of guys OTB too young to remember Devo. Swung too much and didn't get on base enough (so naturally Cito had him LO) 42 career WAR and started triple play in the WS that no video replay ruined. He was so smooth in CF.

 

(just realized other teams playing today. all is good)

 

Even more are too young to remember his name is Devon Whyte. But when the family immigrated it got spelled wrong on the form.

[Deadpool]

So bored no baseball. Committed heresy and listened to Wilner pod for first time because Devo was on it.

 

He reminded me the '93 WS winner went 3-13 at one point in July. Gives some perspective to the recent skid.

 

Lot of guys OTB too young to remember Devo. Swung too much and didn't get on base enough (so naturally Cito had him LO) 42 career WAR and started triple play in the WS that no video replay ruined. He was so smooth in CF.

 

(just realized other teams playing today. all is good)

 

In the 90s, if you were fast you hit leadoff. That was the rule.

[bronson44]

Decent article with some interesting behind the scenes stuff. Impressive woman and not for nothing but pretty hot too.

 

A secret weapon in free-agent talks, Shannon Curley “does everything for everyone” in the Blue Jays organization

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/mlb/longform/how-shannon-curley-became-one-of-the-blue-jays-most-influential-voices/

[BigCecil]

In the 90s, if you were fast you hit leadoff. That was the rule.

 

That was kind of my point. Ron Leflore, Ricky Henderson, Willie Wilson, Raines when he came up, Vince Coleman, Otis Nixon on and on. That was the thing back then.

 

Henderson was ideal in that role given his speed and OBP. Brock/Wills were before my time.

[Olerud363]

So bored no baseball. Committed heresy and listened to Wilner pod for first time because Devo was on it.

 

He reminded me the '93 WS winner went 3-13 at one point in July. Gives some perspective to the recent skid.

 

Lot of guys OTB too young to remember Devo. Swung too much and didn't get on base enough (so naturally Cito had him LO) 42 career WAR and started triple play in the WS that no video replay ruined. He was so smooth in CF.

 

(just realized other teams playing today. all is good)

 

Joe Carter and Devo would have been great 5th and 6th hitters. Cito cost Joe Carter a chance to drive in 140 and an RBI title and Devo to drive in 100 with his 93 line up decisions.

 

Devo was great especially in 91 and 93. .340 on base, 40 doubles, 15-17 homers, 35 steals at a great rate and best defense in the game. Just should not have been lead off.

 

I guess the argument was at the time is that hitting him lead-off 'boosted' his confidence and thus his numbers. I once suggested why not do that for Kevin Pillar?

 

Everyone told me I was a f***ing moron... so I guess 'the boost' theory isn't true, or at least people here don't think so.

 

Maybe hit Tapia lead-off for 160 games next year just to test it... (kidding)

[Stangstag]

So bored no baseball. Committed heresy and listened to Wilner pod for first time because Devo was on it.

 

He reminded me the '93 WS winner went 3-13 at one point in July. Gives some perspective to the recent skid.

 

Lot of guys OTB too young to remember Devo. Swung too much and didn't get on base enough (so naturally Cito had him LO) 42 career WAR and started triple play in the WS that no video replay ruined. He was so smooth in CF.

 

(just realized other teams playing today. all is good)

 

Absolutely f***ing insane that he hit leadoff on a team with Alomar, Molitor and Olerud.

 

Jesus Christ those 93 playoff lineups are atrocious.

 

Henderson and White 1-2 with Olerud and Molitor hitting 5-6. And what the hell was with the love for Joe Carter hitting 4th all the time? He was a whole tier or two below Olerud/Molitor

[Stangstag]

Joe Carter and Devo would have been great 5th and 6th hitters. Cito cost Joe Carter a chance to drive in 140 and an RBI title and Devo to drive in 100 with his 93 line up decisions.

 

Devo was great especially in 91 and 93. .340 on base, 40 doubles, 15-17 homers, 35 steals at a great rate and best defense in the game. Just should not have been lead off.

 

I guess the argument was at the time is that hitting him lead-off 'boosted' his confidence and thus his numbers. I once suggested why not do that for Kevin Pillar?

 

Everyone told me I was a f***ing moron... so I guess 'the boost' theory isn't true, or at least people here don't think so.

 

Maybe hit Tapia lead-off for 160 games next year just to test it... (kidding)

 

Alomar was the perfect leadoff guy for that team. Cito is a brick

[Grant77]

Absolutely f***ing insane that he hit leadoff on a team with Alomar, Molitor and Olerud.

 

Jesus Christ those 93 playoff lineups are atrocious.

 

Henderson and White 1-2 with Olerud and Molitor hitting 5-6. And what the hell was with the love for Joe Carter hitting 4th all the time? He was a whole tier or two below Olerud/Molitor

 

It wasn't really insane at all. Lineup optimization wasn't a thing at the time, even with the other elite managers like Bobby Cox, Sparky Anderson, and Joe Torre.

[mellowgold]

Absolutely f***ing insane that he hit leadoff on a team with Alomar, Molitor and Olerud.

 

Jesus Christ those 93 playoff lineups are atrocious.

 

Henderson and White 1-2 with Olerud and Molitor hitting 5-6. And what the hell was with the love for Joe Carter hitting 4th all the time? He was a whole tier or two below Olerud/Molitor

 

Devo and Carter are black. Cito is racist.

[BlueJaysFever]

Analytics have come far. Clean-up hitters like Joe Carter were a thing. Lead-off hitters were guys with speed. That’s why Devo was the lead-off hitter. Same for Henderson although I’m not sure what your issue with Henderson is? He’s one of the greatest of all-time

[Olerud363]

It wasn't really insane at all. Lineup optimization wasn't a thing at the time, even with the other elite managers like Bobby Cox, Sparky Anderson, and Joe Torre.

 

Yes and No. It wasn't as advanced as today as they wouldn't have put a power hitter first or second but any other manager would have gone Alomar, Molitor, Olerud. No one would have hit Molitor 6th out of 'respect' for the other guys.

 

Line-ups were fast guy who got on base first (Alomar), bat control guy second (Molitor), and best hitter third (Olerud). No one hit their 5th and 6th best hitters 1st and 4th out of 'respect'.

 

Any other manager would recognize that Olerud was a 5 WAR guy and play him and never platooned him. Cito was a moron and a mean spirited dude who played favorites..

 

And yes, I realize Pat 'Tabby' Tabler, and Joe Carter loved him... you would to if they gave you 200 at bats when you couldn't hit anymore, or hit you 3rd for 5 striaight years even as you became a sub replacement player

[Olerud363]

Analytics have come far. Clean-up hitters like Joe Carter were a thing. Lead-off hitters were guys with speed. That’s why Devo was the lead-off hitter. Same for Henderson although I’m not sure what your issue with Henderson is? He’s one of the greatest of all-time

 

 

No one had an issue with Henderson. He got on base. On base was a thing even back then. No one other than Cito would make the lineup out of 'respect'. When Henderson came aboard 29 of the 30 managers would have gone Henderson, Alomar, Molitor, Olerud. Speedy guy who gets on base, another speedy guy who gets on base, 2 pure hitters contending for the batting title.

 

In 2022 the line-up would have been Henderson, Olerud, Alomar, Molitor... but they weren't advanced enough to hit a slow guy 2nd... they were advanced enough to hit the fast guys with .400 on based percentages ahead of the fast guy with a .330 on base percentage (except Cito).

[Ehjays]

we won in 92 amd 93, you cant argue with success.

[Olerud363]

Devo and Carter are black. Cito is racist.

 

He loved Tabby, Sprague, Kevin Millar and a few other white guys so he wasn't super racist. I think he had a warm spot for mediocre right handed hitters.

 

It's pretty simple. Cito himself was a mediocre right handed hitter. He was a guy pretty much like Sprague or Carter. He didn't have as many good seasons as Carter, so almost exactly like Sprague, a guy who had one good season.

 

Then he struggled lost his playing time and career ended. Probably bitter. Loved to platoon, just to give terrible right handed hitters 250 more PAs to give them a few last chances. Loved to play Carter and Sprague all the time, even when they didn't deserve it.

[BlueJaysFever]

No one had an issue with Henderson. He got on base. On base was a thing even back then. No one other than Cito would make the lineup out of 'respect'. When Henderson came aboard 29 of the 30 managers would have gone Henderson, Alomar, Molitor, Olerud. Speedy guy who gets on base, another speedy guy who gets on base, 2 pure hitters contending for the batting title.

 

In 2022 the line-up would have been Henderson, Olerud, Alomar, Molitor... but they weren't advanced enough to hit a slow guy 2nd... they were advanced enough to hit the fast guys with .400 on based percentages ahead of the fast guy with a .330 on base percentage (except Cito).

Yes I understand that. I was speaking directly to Stang, I seem to have not yet figured out fully to hit "reply with quote" rather than just "reply".

[BigCecil]

Absolutely f***ing insane that he hit leadoff on a team with Alomar, Molitor and Olerud.

 

Jesus Christ those 93 playoff lineups are atrocious.

 

Henderson and White 1-2 with Olerud and Molitor hitting 5-6. And what the hell was with the love for Joe Carter hitting 4th all the time? He was a whole tier or two below Olerud/Molitor

 

 

lol. Love this reaction. We still won cause immense talent and this line up was Leagues standard. Olerud was benched for Carter which is shocking if you look at the numbers today.

 

Simple answer on Carter in 4th spot = Dem' Ribbeys

 

Look at Carters career stats. Ungodly over rated.

[Terminator]

Joe Carter is actually underrated and you all need to stop hating on him.

 

He was really good as a Blue Jay for his age 31-33 seasons while they were contending the 3 years after acquiring him. It's not his fault he turned 34 and the team inexplicably batted him in the middle of the lineup for another 4 years. Also, let's not forget he hit one of the biggest home runs in baseball history. Dude is a legend.