Mark Shapiro Discussion Thread

[Boxcar]

Um - it was a joke based on the movie clip. I've seen the movie.

 

Never mind I'm dumb

[CJ-Freeway]

From what I read on the net & twitter, he doesn't seem to be very appreciated by Indians fans. Where there's smoke there's fire. I'll give him a chance but I have a bad feeling about him.

[nmrch]

Moneyball is a great movie, some of you have no taste

[Orgfiller]

From what I read on the net & twitter, he doesn't seem to be very appreciated by Indians fans. Where there's smoke there's fire. I'll give him a chance but I have a bad feeling about him.

 

Like mentioned before, he's not liked by Indians' fans because Shapiro couldn't build a perennial contender with a consistent bottom 5-10 payroll. It's just not possible, he's not a miracle worker. He did as much as he could with what he had to work with.

[Swervin81]

Like mentioned before, he's not liked by Indians' fans because Shapiro couldn't build a perennial contender with a consistent bottom 5-10 payroll. It's just not possible, he's not a miracle worker. He did as much as he could with what he had to work with.

 

He still gets no credit for today's Indians and how well they are set up going forward, although a few big core pieces are his (namely Brantley, Santana and Carrasco). The same way Chuck LaMar (I believe he's a big part of our prospect scouting) never got any credit for those 2008 Rays, although a lot of those pieces were his.

[Brownie19]

Like mentioned before, he's not liked by Indians' fans because Shapiro couldn't build a perennial contender with a consistent bottom 5-10 payroll. It's just not possible, he's not a miracle worker. He did as much as he could with what he had to work with.

 

I'm going to remain positive because I generally agree that he did as much as he could with what he had. They have a good young team there. Kipnis, Brantley, Lindor, Santana, Salazar, Kluber, Carrasco....there's a lot to like there. If Swisher and Bourn didn't completely bomb out of nowhere - this team would have been a central division contender.

[Brownie19]

Never mind I'm dumb

 

Evidently, I need to work on my material...

[CJ-Freeway]

Like mentioned before, he's not liked by Indians' fans because Shapiro couldn't build a perennial contender with a consistent bottom 5-10 payroll. It's just not possible, he's not a miracle worker. He did as much as he could with what he had to work with.

 

True. Has he ever worked with a bigger budget before working with the Indians? Or will this be his first time?

[Captainobvious]

This guy will be exposed as a fraud very soon

A year from now, everyone will want this guy out

[GreekFatAss]

This guy will be exposed as a fraud very soon

A year from now, everyone will want this guy out

 

You can say that about anyone. Fans always know best with the benefit of hindsight and get to criticize others who unlike them have to make educated guesses before the final outcome is clear.

[Captainobvious]

You can say that about anyone. Fans always know best with the benefit of hindsight and get to criticize others who unlike them have to make educated guesses before the final outcome is clear.

 

The new guy will always be better than the previous guy

This is the mentality of fans

[Trouba95]

[Trouba95]

Trade Jose and Edwin for starters and then sign Heyward and maybe someone else.

[leaffie]

This guy will be exposed as a fraud very soon

A year from now, everyone will want this guy out

 

Half the fans want him gone now.

[ProfessionalAtBat]

Half the fans want him gone now.

 

Half the fans weren't following the Jays / baseball before the trade deadline

[Boogerloo]

Half the fans weren't following the Jays / baseball before the trade deadline

 

And now 25 000 more fans are packing the stadium.

[ProfessionalAtBat]

And now 25 000 more fans are packing the stadium.

 

They will come back very soon

[baubau]

This guy will be exposed as a fraud very soon

A year from now, everyone will want this guy out

 

I looked up the Cleveland Indians history and yep he's been there in those GM/President roles. Unless your definition of fraud is different than reality.

[SSTP]

Pretty cool article about the value of a win and value added by GM's

 

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/billion-dollar-billy-beane/

[thatoneguy]

This guy will be exposed as a fraud very soon

A year from now, everyone will want this guy out

 

Ok MJ.

[Krylian]

Does Mark Shapiro actually pronounce his last name SHUH - PIE - ROH? Or is it the more traditional SHUH - PEE - ROH?

 

Shuh - Pie - Roh sounds weird and wrong to me.

[204Jays]

Personally, I am very excited about the Shapiro era. Going to be interesting to see how he adapts his success with a small market team/mindset (and from my opinion, he was very successful given his parameters at Cleveland) to the Blue Jays.

 

From what I've gathered about him:

 

-

-Shapiro was the architect of an internal analytic software (D-Zone?) and some were worried that he may bring that software here.

-His major sticking point with FA's isn't necessarily the X price tag in Year 1,2 and hopefully 3, its the final years where teams are still paying them for today's price tag at what can be drastically reduced production.

[TheHurl]

Does Mark Shapiro actually pronounce his last name SHUH - PIE - ROH? Or is it the more traditional SHUH - PEE - ROH?

 

Shuh - Pie - Roh sounds weird and wrong to me.

 

Pie - Roe it is. Which makes it disappointing that no one has gone with a Shapiromaniac SN.

[Trouba95]

Personally, I am very excited about the Shapiro era. Going to be interesting to see how he adapts his success with a small market team/mindset (and from my opinion, he was very successful given his parameters at Cleveland) to the Blue Jays.

 

From what I've gathered about him:

 

-[ATTACH=CONFIG]1340[/ATTACH]

-Shapiro was the architect of an internal analytic software (D-Zone?) and some were worried that he may bring that software here.

-His major sticking point with FA's isn't necessarily the X price tag in Year 1,2 and hopefully 3, its the final years where teams are still paying them for today's price tag at what can be drastically reduced production.

 

Where did you find that chart? Link?

[204Jays]

Where did you find that chart? Link?

 

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/billion-dollar-billy-beane/

[reedjohnsonfan]

Personally, I am very excited about the Shapiro era. Going to be interesting to see how he adapts his success with a small market team/mindset (and from my opinion, he was very successful given his parameters at Cleveland) to the Blue Jays.

 

From what I've gathered about him:

 

-[ATTACH=CONFIG]1340[/ATTACH]

-Shapiro was the architect of an internal analytic software (D-Zone?) and some were worried that he may bring that software here.

-His major sticking point with FA's isn't necessarily the X price tag in Year 1,2 and hopefully 3, its the final years where teams are still paying them for today's price tag at what can be drastically reduced production.

 

Yeah but sometimes you need to give out contracts that will probably look poor in a few seasons. Since Toronto will have a pretty high payroll, he said he could add some more risk which makes sense. I'd like them to take some risks and then attempt to restock since the team is clearly in win now mode.

[GD]

Yeah but sometimes you need to give out contracts that will probably look poor in a few seasons. Since Toronto will have a pretty high payroll, he said he could add some more risk which makes sense. I'd like them to take some risks and then attempt to restock since the team is clearly in win now mode.

 

Why?

[Atothe]

Jon Paul Morosi is saying his sources told him Shapiro initially offered AA a 2 year deal. Which offended him (speculation)

[204Jays]

Yeah but sometimes you need to give out contracts that will probably look poor in a few seasons. Since Toronto will have a pretty high payroll, he said he could add some more risk which makes sense. I'd like them to take some risks and then attempt to restock since the team is clearly in win now mode.

 

WAR in the FA market costs about ~$10MM per. It's very hard for players to efficiently produce to justify that type of salary in the short term, compound that with players entering FA are in their late 20's/early 30's with the expectation that some players deteriorate much quickly than others and you have a highly inefficient market.

 

IMO, that's where this whole Small vs. Big market debate starts. In Cleveland, he literally was penny pinching the roster - they could barely afford to swing and miss. In Toronto, to quote Shapiro's reference to "risk aversion" does that translate to a increased willingness to gamble on players - production-wise, health, etc.?

 

A "role model" franchise is probably the Cards and even then they rely predominantly on internal development. I've said this a few times and I'll say it again, AA going for it was great in the sense that we saw the potential market at the gates, TV ratings etc. but it was never sustainable. He could never live up to the hype on that model which is why I suspect he left on "top" - that and a combination of Shapiro grilling him on the empty cupboard he would leave behind.

[Jimcanuck]

^ +1