Dickey trade

[ElNik2013]

If the Jays make the playoffs and/or win a World Series with Dickey in the rotation, then the three players we gave up could be HOF'ers and I'd get over it.

 

You have 1 (maybe 2) more years, R.A. Don't let us down.

 

Edit: but the trade itself was bad. No question. That package the year before could have gotten Latos or Gio, possibly.

 

 

 

This is not to say I liked the Dickey trade in any way, but I doubt the bolded part.

 

As much as we all loved Syndergaard, he was traded after finishing his first year in full-season ball and those guys don't have that much value.

 

For Latos, San Diego got 2 MLB ready players in Alonso and Grandal, that's clearly a more attractive package.

[glory]

This is not to say I liked the Dickey trade in any way, but I doubt the bolded part.

 

As much as we all loved Syndergaard, he was traded after finishing his first year in full-season ball and those guys don't have that much value.

 

For Latos, San Diego got 2 MLB ready players in Alonso and Grandal, that's clearly a more attractive package.

 

Possibly. I remember reading that Beane wanted Syndergaard (+ others) for Gio, and AA refused, but maybe I'm mixing that up with something else. I guess Gio was possible, while Latos may have required more going to the Padres since it was too early in Syndergaard's career.

[TheHurl]

I don't see what's so bad about that wiki page, it's humorous. If that was done by him or someone close to him then it was probably as a joke.

 

You don't see what's wrong about it? It doesn't even lead with the fact that he interviewed Rob Nelson, from Big League Chew fame

[ElNik2013]

Possibly. I remember reading that Beane wanted Syndergaard (+ others) for Gio, and AA refused, but maybe I'm mixing that up with something else. I guess Gio was possible, while Latos may have required more going to the Padres since it was too early in Syndergaard's career.

 

 

It might be a stretch even for Gio Gonzalez. Beane got 3 MLB-ready players in Norris, Peacock and Milone plus a lower minors guy (AJ Cole).

 

Who knows really.

[G-Snarls]

Aren't the Mets considering moving D'Arnaud to the outfield? It just seems like an organization that's determined to shoot themselves in the foot

 

Hasn't he injured his foot a bunch of times?

[GD]

This trade has resulted in zero trips to the post season. This trade was suppose to "put us over the top". It's been a terrible trade from the moment it happened. With that being said Dickey has been decent. But no ace. Solid 3rd starter at best. I will take his production. But Syndergaard is going to be awesome if he stays healthy. And I don't see why he wouldn't.

 

He's a pitcher.

[GD]

Hes built like a tank though. I thought Latos was going to be more durable though and it hasn't panned out.

 

Becuz pitcherz r dumn.

[Key22]

CY Young winner who had the most quality starts over three consecutive years at $10 million a season - to get that quality on the free agent market would be $20million and no free agents would sign in Toronto if offered $18m someplace else. At the time Syndergaard was felt by many to be a reliever and D'Arnaud's catching ability was in doubt. Good bat but if he had to move to left field his bat would be average to a bit above average."

 

Jays were going for it and with the offense - probably felt Dickey only needed o be a number 3 innings eater - that's exactly what Dickey is.

 

The problem isn't so much with the trade at the time - as a put you over the top pitcher it was fine - the error was doing all these moves with 80ish win team. When the Jays trade for Cone the team was already viewed as a favorite to win it. So you can overpay - the Jays in this era it was about trying to win with EE and Bausta because when those guys go there is ZERO in the farm system that can replace that offense.

 

It's fine to hang onto prospects but management (may not be AA) often rushes the plan to fill the seats. Maple Leafs have been doing this for years.

 

In a vacuum the trade looks bad - but the goal is to win a WS. If the Jays had won as they did with Cone then all is forgiven. When you lose these things get magnified.

 

But if they lose this year - they can probably trade Bautista for 1 top 10 pitching prospect and they can trade EE for 1 top 10 pitching prospect and probably trade Beuhrle and Dickey for 1 top 100 prospect at the deadline. They can essentially get back a Syndergaard and D'Arnaud if they're 10 games out at the trade deadline. They can get these kinds of prospects back anytime they want.

[Boxcar]

Hes built like a tank though. I thought Latos was going to be more durable though and it hasn't panned out.

 

Please tell me how him being "built like a tank" has any bearing on his injury proneness.

[Spanky__99]

This was basically us laughing when Mets fans were calling for Syndergaard OR d'Arnaud for Dickey, and then we found out that we traded BOTH for Dickey:

 

http://i.imgur.com/4Ae5tVh.gif

 

That's perfect, lol.

[saskjayfan]

This trade has resulted in zero trips to the post season. This trade was suppose to "put us over the top". It's been a terrible trade from the moment it happened. With that being said Dickey has been decent. But no ace. Solid 3rd starter at best. I will take his production. But Syndergaard is going to be awesome if he stays healthy. And I don't see why he wouldn't.

 

Yes when looking at this trade josh Johnson was suppose to bounce back and post an era around his career average of 3.15. Morrow coming off a breakout sub 3 era was suppose to have continued success and post a low 3 era. Romero was suppose to bounce back and be a solid number 5 and post an era around 4. Dickey who posted a sub 3 era on average for the previous 3 years was suppose to post a low 3 era at an affordable price. all this to some degree seemed plausible at the time.

 

Everything that could go wrong did go wrong. Yeah Alex gambled on the wrong guy. Hindsight is still 20/20

Edited February 1, 2015 by saskjayfan

[GNick49]

How do you Jays fans feel about the RA Dickey deal? Syndergaard should be emerging this year and dArnaud may be a top ten catcher. Glad to see Dickey doing well for you

Blue Jays had number of young arms, needed a veteran Cy Young winner to go with them. Just picked wrong one. Dickey not as effective at Rogers as he was in NL. But not total loss as he is solid #2 starter

[Jimcanuck]

Yes when looking at this trade josh Johnson was suppose to bounce back and post an era around his career average of 3.15. Morrow coming off a breakout sub 3 era was suppose to have continued success and post a low 3 era. Romero was suppose to bounce back and be a solid number 5 and post an era around 4. Dickey who posted a sub 3 era on average for the previous 3 years was suppose to post a low 3 era at an affordable price. all this to some degree seemed plausible at the time.

 

Everything that could go wrong did go wrong. Yeah Alex gambled on the wrong guy. Hindsight is still 20/20

 

Except it wasn't AA, it seems clear now that it was Beest

[reedjohnsonfan]

CY Young winner who had the most quality starts over three consecutive years at $10 million a season - to get that quality on the free agent market would be $20million and no free agents would sign in Toronto if offered $18m someplace else. At the time Syndergaard was felt by many to be a reliever and D'Arnaud's catching ability was in doubt. Good bat but if he had to move to left field his bat would be average to a bit above average."

 

Jays were going for it and with the offense - probably felt Dickey only needed o be a number 3 innings eater - that's exactly what Dickey is.

 

The problem isn't so much with the trade at the time - as a put you over the top pitcher it was fine - the error was doing all these moves with 80ish win team. When the Jays trade for Cone the team was already viewed as a favorite to win it. So you can overpay - the Jays in this era it was about trying to win with EE and Bausta because when those guys go there is ZERO in the farm system that can replace that offense.

 

It's fine to hang onto prospects but management (may not be AA) often rushes the plan to fill the seats. Maple Leafs have been doing this for years.

 

In a vacuum the trade looks bad - but the goal is to win a WS. If the Jays had won as they did with Cone then all is forgiven. When you lose these things get magnified.

 

But if they lose this year - they can probably trade Bautista for 1 top 10 pitching prospect and they can trade EE for 1 top 10 pitching prospect and probably trade Beuhrle and Dickey for 1 top 100 prospect at the deadline. They can essentially get back a Syndergaard and D'Arnaud if they're 10 games out at the trade deadline. They can get these kinds of prospects back anytime they want.

 

Exactly. A+ post.

[Boxcar]

Cause hes beeg and strongg obviously.

 

I shouldn't be amazed at this point, but I am anyway. Congrats.

[TheHurl]

Except it wasn't AA, it seems clear now that it was Beest

 

All solid value moves are AA's. All stupid spending moves are Beeston's. All non-moves are Rogers fault.

[TwistedLogic]

All solid value moves are AA's. All stupid spending moves are Beeston's. All non-moves are Rogers fault.

 

Sounds about right

[Stangstag]

Damn. Im just thinking about how we had a rotation of:

 

Dickey

Johnson

Morrow

Buehrle

Romero/Happ

 

Realistically, that should have been a top 5 rotation in baseball. Johnson ended up missing 2/3 of the season, Dickey regressed alot, Morrow was injured for 2/3 of the season and he was terrible, Buehrle was good, Romero completely fell apart, Happ missed a couple months with injury....

 

What a f***ing mess. We should have made the postseason that year for sure.

[RealAccountant]

Damn. Im just thinking about how we had a rotation of:

 

Dickey

Johnson

Morrow

Buehrle

Romero/Happ

 

Realistically, that should have been a top 5 rotation in baseball. Johnson ended up missing 2/3 of the season, Dickey regressed alot, Morrow regressed, Buehrle was good, Romero completely fell apart, Happ missed a couple months with injury....

 

What a f***ing mess. We should have made the postseason that year for sure.

 

AA did the same thing that year that he is doing now

 

Ignoring depth

[GD]

AA did the same thing that year that he is doing now

 

Ignoring depth

 

SP depth is not an issue rn

[Stangstag]

AA did the same thing that year that he is doing now

 

Ignoring depth

 

Yes. It's gonna be fun when one of our starters gets injured this year.

[Stangstag]

SP depth is not an issue rn

 

Yes it is

[TheHurl]

SP depth is not an issue rn

 

Agreed (although the Donaldson deal took some depth I liked). Now the 30 something position players...different story behind them. No team has replacements for 5 WAR players in the minors, but having above replacement level would be nice. Anything near 100 games lost for Reyes, EE, Donaldson and Bautista, requires one of these minor league signees playing well above their projections to make up some of the loss. It wasn't so bad last year as those 4 only lost 64 games between them.

[Stangstag]

Estrada

Norris

Sanchez

Hendriks

Oramas

Redmond?

Cole

Boyd

Francis

Osuna

Castro

Hoffman?

 

If 2 of our starters get injured for a significant amount of time, do you really see any of those guys being able to hold a rotation spot for 1-2 months? Maybe Sanchez or Norris, but one of them will be in the rotation already to start the year.

 

I don't know, I personally see this rotation falling apart halfway through the season.

[RealAccountant]

It's an absolute travesty that this team is not making a play for shields. It surprises me that AA isn't being more aggressive after all the end is nigh for him if the Jays don't win

[glory]

I'm sure Rogers is going to give $80M to a guy they want to replace (AA) so he can sign Shields.

[TwistedLogic]

It's an absolute travesty that this team is not making a play for shields. It surprises me that AA isn't being more aggressive after all the end is nigh for him if the Jays don't win

 

For some reason, that isn't hard to believe.

[reedjohnsonfan]

It's an absolute travesty that this team is not making a play for shields. It surprises me that AA isn't being more aggressive after all the end is nigh for him if the Jays don't win

 

I was always thinking Lester/Scherzer would have been a better signing but now that they are gone, and Shields still hasn't signed they have no excuse not to pursue him. Shields/Dickey/Buerhle gives you awesome stability, if the front office doesn't allow a slightly back-loaded Shields contract they are f***ing clueless. I think AA realizes this but really he is just a puppet unfortunately. At least JPR was controversial and spoke his mind, I like AA but he tries too hard to keep his "good boy" image.

[Maahfaace]

I was always thinking Lester/Scherzer would have been a better signing but now that they are gone, and Shields still hasn't signed they have no excuse not to pursue him. Shields/Dickey/Buerhle gives you awesome stability, if the front office doesn't allow a slightly back-loaded Shields contract they are f***ing clueless. I think AA realizes this but really he is just a puppet unfortunately. At least JPR was controversial and spoke his mind, I like AA but he tries too hard to keep his "good boy" image.

 

Not throwing your superiors under the bus is not about keeping a "good boy" image, its called common sense.

[Dick_Pole]

hmm...this thread has predictably...gone to hell.