2023 Trade Deadline

[jaysblue]

The players would revolt if the team was torn down while still in the thick of the playoff hunt. This team has been built with the playoffs in mind and if the players perform up to their capabilities they can make some noise in the post season. Knee jerk reactions like firing the GM mid-season would accomplish nothing, but if the team fails to make the post season I agree Atkins should be shown the door.

 

Right now this team is a fringe playoff contender. They need to start playing better. The status quo isn't working. You can't keep relying on hoping that Vladdy, Kirk, Varsho and everyone struggling are suddenly going to heat up and be .900 OPS bats the rest of the way or hope Manoah magically comes back in July and pitches like he did in 2021 and 2022.

 

I hope this team adds to make upgrades around the roster rather than just keeping the status quo. Can't throw away this season given the small window. Try to make upgrades without mortgaging the farm system.

[jaysblue]

If this was a fantasy team sure. But there are other factors at play that will drive the decision to sell or not

 

Yeah pretty much the decision will be based on how the Jays play this month. So far on what is considered the easy part of the schedule, the team is 7-8. Lets hope they show signs of turning things around. These next two-three weeks will be crucial in deciding whether the FO adds or sells at the deadline.

[max silver]

Right now this team is a fringe playoff contender. They need to start playing better. The status quo isn't working. You can't keep relying on hoping that Vladdy, Kirk, Varsho and everyone struggling are suddenly going to heat up and be .900 OPS bats the rest of the way.

 

I hope this team adds to make upgrades around the roster rather than just keeping the status quo. Can't throw away this season given the small window. Try to make upgrades without mortgaging the farm system.

 

Given the cost and makeup of this roster I don't know if any major external upgrades are going to be in the cards for this season. There is always room for another leverage bullpen arm and a righty slugging outfielder/DH type would be nice to have, but I have a hard time seeing Vlad/Kirk/Varsho etc. being benched moving forward so they are eventually going to need to find their way out of their respective funks. This team still hasn't really gotten it's offense going at the midway point of the season so it's perfectly fair to wonder if this is all the offense is going to be capable of, but given the names on the roster there should be more in the tank. If/when they finally figure out the RISP issues runs scoring will be far less of an issue, and this team has hit a surprising lack of home runs given how much power there is up and down the lineup. They really need to be examining the practice routines, approach, coaching methods etc. to get to the bottom of how badly this offense has underperformed so far.

[jaysblue]

Given the cost and makeup of this roster I don't know if any major external upgrades are going to be in the cards for this season. There is always room for another leverage bullpen arm and a righty slugging outfielder/DH type would be nice to have, but I have a hard time seeing Vlad/Kirk/Varsho etc. being benched moving forward so they are eventually going to need to find their way out of their respective funks. This team still hasn't really gotten it's offense going at the midway point of the season so it's perfectly fair to wonder if this is all the offense is going to be capable of, but given the names on the roster there should be more in the tank. If/when they finally figure out the RISP issues runs scoring will be far less of an issue, and this team has hit a surprising lack of home runs given how much power there is up and down the lineup. They really need to be examining the practice routines, approach, coaching methods etc. to get to the bottom of how badly this offense has underperformed so far.

 

Yeah not saying bench guys like Vladdy, Kirk or Varsho. You gotta hope at least one of those guys get out of their funks. Maybe Kirk sees only playing time behind the plate instead of at DH if the Jays bring in a power RHB.

 

Adding another RH power bat who could play in the OF and DH wouldn't be a bad thing at all IMO. Might help the lineup overall if you can add another solid bat and might help with the RISP issues. Another high leverage bullpen arm would help IMO, along with getting Green back at some point. Would rather add a high leverage bullpen arm if possible instead of a starter.

[Daniel Labude]

The Marlins aren’t moving Cabrera for two months of Chapman. I think Ross would get fired for turning that down.

 

They have an excess of SP and their infield outside of Arraez is horrible. Segura and Wendle are barely rosterable. I think they would do it given how great they have played and Chapman is exactly what they need to help their offense and D. Cabrera is also a huge wildcard with some of the worse command problems at tines in baseball. Exactly the Jays calling card to fix it seems

 

I think both teams would accept, Miami is the 3rd best team in the NL. Its a move that pushes them up without taking from their SP

[jaysblue]

Vladdy for Jesus Luzardo. Would be an interesting trade idea.

[jaysblue]

What would it take to get Paul Goldschmidt? He's a free agent after 2024 and making $26M next season. Cards aren't making the Postseason this year. His bat would be perfect, though position wise would be tough with Vlad at 1B, unless you split both of them between 1B and DH, though sure both wouldn't be too pleased. Regardless, adding a bat like Goldy would definitely improve this lineup!

 

Arenado would be a great target in the offseason, though doubt Cards trade him after signing him to that extension.

[L54]

They have an excess of SP and their infield outside of Arraez is horrible. Segura and Wendle are barely rosterable. I think they would do it given how great they have played and Chapman is exactly what they need to help their offense and D. Cabrera is also a huge wildcard with some of the worse command problems at tines in baseball. Exactly the Jays calling card to fix it seems

 

I think both teams would accept, Miami is the 3rd best team in the NL. Its a move that pushes them up without taking from their SP

 

You don’t think they could get a better piece than Chapman for Cabrera?

[Daniel Labude]

You don’t think they could get a better piece than Chapman for Cabrera?

 

Not really

[43211234]

Vladdy for Ryan Noda

[Jonn]

The players would revolt if the team was torn down while still in the thick of the playoff hunt. This team has been built with the playoffs in mind and if the players perform up to their capabilities they can make some noise in the post season. Knee jerk reactions like firing the GM mid-season would accomplish nothing, but if the team fails to make the post season I agree Atkins should be shown the door.

 

Team really is in no position to revolt. They haven’t shown any reason to invest in them further. It was a massive disappointment would prefer to take a step back and recoup some prospect capital. And re-engage in the off-seson. I don’t think there’s a clear fix available to fix everything this team struggles with.

[jaysblue]

Hunter Renfroe as a power RH bat who could play a corner OF spot and DH if he came cheap. 14 HR with 40 RBI so far and a 1.0 WAR. He's pretty much been worth the same as Varsho so far this season haha. Varsho is still a better player obviously.

[max silver]

Team really is in no position to revolt. They haven’t shown any reason to invest in them further. It was a massive disappointment would prefer to take a step back and recoup some prospect capital. And re-engage in the off-seson. I don’t think there’s a clear fix available to fix everything this team struggles with.

 

This team is right smack dab in the middle of what appears to be a 5 year competitive window. Each of Bo and Vlad only have two years of remaining control, with Gausman and Springer are under control for similar timeframes. Throwing away this season gives a giant middle finger to the players on the roster as well as the fanbase. That's great if some prospects are attained, but unless they are of the nearly major league ready variety they are not going to do anything to help with this current window.

[L54]

Hunter Renfroe as a power RH bat who could play a corner OF spot and DH if he came cheap. 14 HR with 40 RBI so far and a 1.0 WAR. He's pretty much been worth the same as Varsho so far this season haha. Varsho is still a better player obviously.

 

This is the guy I was thinking of too if the Angels fall far enough back. He can get hot and carry a team for a while hitting tanks

[glory]

Team really is in no position to revolt. They haven’t shown any reason to invest in them further. It was a massive disappointment would prefer to take a step back and recoup some prospect capital. And re-engage in the off-seson. I don’t think there’s a clear fix available to fix everything this team struggles with.

 

Ross Atkins stinks at selling/trading for prospects. His main/only strength is his ability to make good short term MLB moves, so buying at the deadline is playing more to his strong points. I’d rather he trade marginal prospects for another Merrifield than have to talk myself into getting hyped for more Thomas Hatch’s.

[Spanky99]

Rangers got Alrodis Chapman for Cole Ragans and Roni Cabrera. Seems like a pretty good deal for the Rangers.

 

A pen arm, and something like that deal would've been great.

[Spanky99]

Lmao... this team is not selling, Atkins said they're looking at an arm.

 

Renfroe would be a good target, but the Angels won't move him.

[Spanky99]

You don’t think they could get a better piece than Chapman for Cabrera?

 

You're being baited, mate.

[Jimcanuck]

Cleveland has a glut of SP, have Cody Morris and Logan Allen among others in AAA

[Spanky99]

#3 or better SP

 

Cleveland has a glut of SP, have Cody Morris and Logan Allen among others in AAA

 

This is very different, sir.

[BigCecil]

Right now this team is a fringe playoff contender. They need to start playing better. The status quo isn't working. You can't keep relying on hoping that Vladdy, Kirk, Varsho and everyone struggling are suddenly going to heat up and be .900 OPS bats the rest of the way or hope Manoah magically comes back in July and pitches like he did in 2021 and 2022.

 

I hope this team adds to make upgrades around the roster rather than just keeping the status quo. Can't throw away this season given the small window. Try to make upgrades without mortgaging the farm system.

 

Just going to rant to myself for a second. The narrative after the disaster of missing the playoffs in '21 by a game was "the core gained experience so we gonna be ready. just you wait" and "if we played at home all the time we would have won the division" and all kinds of ******** magic elixir theorems, as if team development and success was necessarily linear. Its not.

 

We had the CY, 2 and 3 in MVP. Its malpractice that pen/buntoyo were allowed to f*** up that season. Its entirely possible we look back in a few years and that team/year was our best chance in this window. (lets hope not)

 

The team has changed so much since even '21 and by the end of '25 its going to change a ton more. Every year is precious. We can't just punt on a season and assume the next is better. Way way too many variables in baseball.

[bluejaysinternNo5]

The roster is mostly set as it is. There’s no big black hole anywhere where it’s obvious you need to upgrade. As mentioned before it’s really up to guys to start playing better. Here’s what I would do if I woke up as Ross Atkins on July 31:

 

1) Get a new hitting coach. Time for a change. I don’t care if he deserves it or not.

 

2) Another bullpen arm. Could be anybody. Doesn’t have to be a big name but a guy with intriguing potential that we can rotate in and out of the bullpen with some guys getting injured, sent down, etc. If things work out this is a guy who could see leverage in the playoffs.

 

3) Get a prototypical power hitting, poor defence outfielder / 1b / dh. Another guy with intriguing potential but somebody who’s on the fringe of another teams roster. Again give him a look and see what happens.

 

I’m also not opposed to a big shakeup and the Goldschmidt suggestion earlier would have been really interesting if is contract ended this season and he was a rental. Then I could see us rotating Vlad, Belt, and Goldschmidt around depending on matchups. Plus, going out of the organization to get more production at 1b has the added bonus of bruising Vlad’s ego and hopefully lighting a fire under his ass.

[jaysblue]

Just going to rant to myself for a second. The narrative after the disaster of missing the playoffs in '21 by a game was "the core gained experience so we gonna be ready. just you wait" and "if we played at home all the time we would have won the division" and all kinds of ******** magic elixir theorems, as if team development and success was necessarily linear. Its not.

 

We had the CY, 2 and 3 in MVP. Its malpractice that pen/buntoyo were allowed to f*** up that season. Its entirely possible we look back in a few years and that team/year was our best chance in this window. (lets hope not)

 

The team has changed so much since even '21 and by the end of '25 its going to change a ton more. Every year is precious. We can't just punt on a season and assume the next is better. Way way too many variables in baseball.

 

Yeah definitely the failure to address the bullpen in 2021 is one of the things you can criticize Atkins and the FO on. They thought they could patch it up with washed up relievers and it cost them the Postseason by ONE game. Instead of taking the cheap route, they should have coughed up more for better arms, especially with that roster they had.

 

I look back at the roster the past three seasons and yeah I think the team in 2021 was their best chance in this window. You had a Cy Young winner in Ray, a dangerous lineup with huge power and all having breakout years, and a decent rotation with guys like Manoah, Berrios, Matz and Ryu. The bullpen was an utter disaster and its a shame they never properly addressed the BP at all in 2021.

 

Like you said, a lot of things can change so much year to year. Even 2022 was precious and this season as well. If this team decides to keep the status quo and sit on the fence in 2023 and say "we'll focus on 2024 more," then you have to question the FO and blame the players for the wasted opportunity in 2023.

[jaysblue]

This is the guy I was thinking of too if the Angels fall far enough back. He can get hot and carry a team for a while hitting tanks

 

Yeah if the cost isn't that high, he makes a lot of sense for this team.

[AMS528]

Just going to rant to myself for a second. The narrative after the disaster of missing the playoffs in '21 by a game was "the core gained experience so we gonna be ready. just you wait" and "if we played at home all the time we would have won the division" and all kinds of ******** magic elixir theorems, as if team development and success was necessarily linear. Its not.

 

We had the CY, 2 and 3 in MVP. Its malpractice that pen/buntoyo were allowed to f*** up that season. Its entirely possible we look back in a few years and that team/year was our best chance in this window. (lets hope not)

 

The team has changed so much since even '21 and by the end of '25 its going to change a ton more. Every year is precious. We can't just punt on a season and assume the next is better. Way way too many variables in baseball.

 

Looking back at that season is the most frustrating thing. That team was amazing. They underperformed their differential terribly. They should have been at least a 95 win team. We had 6 position guys who were performing at a 4 WAR level. Springer, Semien, Bo, Vlad and Teo were a literal murderers row to face as a pitcher. Ray, Berrios, and Manoah were great and importantly super steady.

 

I said it at the time as well, that this was a season they might really regret in a few years.

[John_Havok]

Luis Robert Jr as a trade target. Fits all the needs the Jays want, plus is cost controlled for the next 2 seasons for sure at 9.5m- possibly 4 if they pick up 20M options for 2026 and 2027.

 

Feasible with what the Jays have for prospects to acquire? Would the Chi Sox even entertain moving him?

[Eat My Shatkins]

21/22 Manoah

Ryu

Green

 

 

Pretty good trade deadline acquisitions without giving up prospects haha

[keggy]

Realistically moving forward we have one roster slot for one of Cimber, Green, or Pop. If they decide to upgrade the pen it would likely be an elite arm, preferably a lefty to share the load with Mayza.

 

We could also upgrade the rotation, ideally with at least a #3 level SP. This would allow us to put Kikuchi in the pen during the playoffs where he would be a weapon.

 

Realistically, the best chance we'll have to upgrade is a lefty mashing outfielder which should be way cheaper than an elite RP or SP. I would sit one or both of Varsho/Kiermaier against LHP until the team starts hitting. Their defence is elite but it doesn't matter when we're getting shut out.

 

Guys like Tommy Pham, Rob Refsneyder, or maybe a guy like Victor Robles really shouldn't break the bank.

[Jonn]

Luis Robert Jr as a trade target. Fits all the needs the Jays want, plus is cost controlled for the next 2 seasons for sure at 9.5m- possibly 4 if they pick up 20M options for 2026 and 2027.

 

Feasible with what the Jays have for prospects to acquire? Would the Chi Sox even entertain moving him?

 

Very on board with him being the new LF.

[John_Havok]

Very on board with him being the new LF.

 

What do you figure it would cost…even assuming Chicago would move him…which I doubt…but just for kicks