Blue Jays acquire Daulton Varsho for Moreno and Gurriel

[Captain Adama]

You have him for a corner spot, could have just signed Conforto or get a better return than Varsho back.

 

You're really underrating the importance of having an elite defensive outfielder.

 

What's more important, Kiermaier gets injured, Varsho offers such an excellent replacement to CF that the defense doesn't suffer much.

[Jays24]

Doesn’t corner OF make Varsho less valuable?

 

Yes considering most of his WAR came from his defense.

[wilko]

I like this deal. Looks like Jano's staying put for now. It's funny because Moreno has a chance to become Varsho (without the power) at some point. The OF went from one of the worst defensively to one of the best.

[Jonn]

Outfield defense is insane now after being a clown show.

 

That is the bright side to all of this. Jays went from having one of the worst defensive outfields to one of the best in one off-season

[BTS]

You have him for a corner spot, could have just signed Conforto or get a better return than Varsho back.

 

Varsho will probably be in CF every day against lefties. He's insurance in CF vs. RHP if Kiermaier sucks. He's also the 3rd catcher. He's a lot better than Conforto. Like, a lot better.

[Laika]

For those who care

 

Baseball trade values

Varsho is worth 74.5

Moreno+Guerriel is 59.3

[Captain Adama]

This seems like a copium type comment. Not an impact bat? His numbers don't lie. Gurri was a very good hitter. Durability was his biggest concern. He was still young and was improving.

 

Impact bat? Lol are you ok?

 

He had a 114 wRC+ with zero power to speak of. There was no improvement from previous seasons.

[Terminator]

Terminator was wrong

 

That is all

 

Lol nope I was right again but nice try. I was hellbent on not trading Kirk and the Jays didn’t. Just like when I said we should sign KK over Bellinger. I also voted for Moreno in the poll, have a mod check it.

 

Obviously no one wanted Jansen but Atkins made the brilliant move to grab an OF that can also play C so when Jansen inevitably gets hurt again we are still good there.

[Jonn]

.302 On Base makes me nauseous.

[BTS]

I'm barely a Jays fan and I'm excited about how perfect Varsho fits this team. You guys need to be happier.

[John_Havok]

Of all the Outfielders discussed this off-season Daulton Varsho was probably near the bottom of the list. Sure left-handed power but no ability to get on base. Expect a lot of wild swings and frustrating at-bats.

 

Kinda shocked he cost that much. Tough to trade an Athletic Catcher with that much upside with the bat and keeping a fat Kirk. Diamondbacks did very well here.

 

Just comparing Varsho to Teo in 2022.

 

Varsho: 7.8% BB rate, 24.5% K rate, babip .269, 27 HR. wRC+106. Premium defense in CF - 4.6 fWAR

Teo: 6.4% BB, 28.4% K rate, babip .335, 25 HR, wRC +129. Bonehead defense in LF - 2.4 fWAR

 

Varsho definitely doesn't have Teo's average exit velos, but his max exit velo is still 66th percentile.

 

Power favours Teo by a large margin. Run prevention favours Varsho by a very large margin with some pop and he's pretty much a dead pull hitter. With the shift restrictions this upcoming season, he will likely see a slight uptick in singles getting through, not to mention more of an asset on the basepaths with the new pitching restrictions.

[Jays24]

This seems like a copium type comment. Not an impact bat? His numbers don't lie. Gurri was a very good hitter. Durability was his biggest concern. He was still young and was improving.

 

Exactly... to call Gurriel nothing is hilarious. He alone is projected to have a higher wRC+. Then you trade one of the best prospects in baseball who will probably have a higher wRC+ too. Come on now lol

[PhillyBlueJay]

MLB Trade Simulator says this:

 

Varsho is worth 74.5

Moreno + Gurriel is worth 59.3

[Laika]

This is when we simply turn on Moreno

 

He’s a noodle bat that will take three years to figure out how to homer

 

And he’s not as athletic as people said.

[Slade]

At least the OF looks pretty solid and we desperately needed that left handed bat. Honestly think they need another one.

[BTS]

When Toronto wins a game next year and some Robinson Chirinos goes 0-4 for the other team, remind yourself that you don't have to put up with that s***. Because of Dalton Varsho.

[Jonn]

Just comparing Varsho to Teo in 2022.

 

Varsho: 7.8% BB rate, 24.5% K rate, babip .269, 27 HR. wRC+106. Premium defense in CF - 4.6 fWAR

Teo: 6.4% BB, 28.4% K rate, babip .335, 25 HR, wRC +129. Bonehead defense in LF - 2.4 fWAR

 

Varsho definitely doesn't have Teo's average exit velos, but his max exit velo is still 66th percentile.

 

Power favours Teo by a large margin. Run prevention favours Varsho by a very large margin with some pop and he's pretty much a dead pull hitter. With the shift restrictions this upcoming season, he will likely see a slight uptick in singles getting through, not to mention more of an asset on the basepaths with the new pitching restrictions.

 

Varsho is definitely better than Teo. But this isn’t about Teo. Varsho needs to cut the strikeout rate and figure out how to get on base though.

[Jonn]

When Toronto wins a game next year and some Robinson Chirinos goes 0-4 for the other team, remind yourself that you don't have to put up with that s***. Because of Dalton Varsho.

 

Back up Catchers always have huge games against the Jays though.

[Stangstag]

For those who care

 

Baseball trade values

Varsho is worth 74.5

Moreno+Guerriel is 59.3

 

“Those values are highly innaccurate though”

 

- people on this board

[TheHurl]

Varsho is Moreno's best case scenario

[THANOS]

I do not like this trade at all. We got an all defense guy who is Grichuk with the bat.

 

Moreno could have a 6 fWAR within the next 3 years and I wouldn't be surprised at all.

[lovemyjays]

Varsho is Moreno's best case scenario

 

copium

[gruber92]

I don't think anyone hates on Varsho but we paid too much.

[John_Havok]

.302 On Base makes me nauseous.

 

he'll probably improve that with the shift restrictions, his walk rate is only slightly below league average. 46th percentile

[Stangstag]

Im excited that we finally have a bonafide CF thats young, can hit, and is under control for several years. Feels like we haven’t had someone like this since… young Vernon??

[Jonn]

So Springer or Varsho in RF? I don’t think Springer has played LF in his career. Actually apparently he played 3 innings in 2018.

[gruber92]

Varsho is Moreno's best case scenario

 

Moreno's on base numbers will be always better than Varsho's

[BTS]

Another benefit: you guys can stop looking at Gurriel through homer glasses. He's not good. He's a 1-2 win all bat corner OF. If the team actually misses him they can go sign AJ Pollock to do the same thing. But they're not going to do that because nobody actually needs a 1-2 win corner OF making 5+M.

[Stangstag]

I don't think anyone hates on Varsho but we paid too much.

 

Maybe, yeah. Arizona is also a hitters park so hopefully the numbers don’t take a hit. But this move was needed, the OF situation was looking bleak for 2024 and beyond

[John_Havok]

I don't think anyone hates on Varsho but we paid too much.

 

I think Gurriel was just something to sweeten the pot to ensure the deal got done. Sucks at D, still can't take a walk. if he doesnt regain his power stroke... what use is he?

 

Do you think Moreno for Vasrho straight up would have been an even trade?