General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2022)

[Laika]

I could see Toronto signing a RF or trading for a RF like Nootbar who is above average in RF and keeping Springer in CF for one more season. Springer may be able to handle CF a bit better if he doesn't have two boat anchors in LF and RF.

 

Yeah he had crummy defenders all around him last year. Not just LF and RF with their limited range and poor decision making, but cannonball Bo barreling out at top speed with his head down on every shallow flyball.

[Laika]

I've thought of this also. If you traded for Nootbar and added Conforto (with Gurriel becoming the 4th OFer/DH), the OF defense would be much improved - whether Springer is in CF or in RF.

 

Yeah this would work. And at least with someone like Nootbaar who could be an acceptable CF for one year, if Springer gets hurt or struggles defensively you can just flip them around. Even if Noot is 100% not the CF solution.

 

I really want Gurriel gone (traded) or as the 4th OF/DH.

[max silver]

The most unrealistic thing about this scenario is “healthy Pearson”.

 

I don’t think that exists

 

He managed to avoid his arm falling off in winter ball so that's a start.

[Brownie19]

Yeah this would work. And at least with someone like Nootbaar who could be an acceptable CF for one year, if Springer gets hurt or struggles defensively you can just flip them around. Even if Noot is 100% not the CF solution.

 

I really want Gurriel gone (traded) or as the 4th OF/DH.

 

Nootbar + Conforto + Senga = World Series? A bench with Espinal, Gurriel and Biggio has to be one of the deepest in recent memory. That's what a winning team needs!

[max silver]

Nootbar + Conforto + Senga = World Series? A bench with Espinal, Gurriel and Biggio has to be one of the deepest in recent memory. That's what a winning team needs!

 

Barger may very well end up knocking down the door in AAA as well.

[John_Havok]

What are the odds that a fairly significant move gets done by Atkins at the meetings? Like, catcher trade or higher type of significant

[Brownie19]

What are the odds that a fairly significant move gets done by Atkins at the meetings? Like, catcher trade or higher type of significant

 

26.4%

[Ehjays]

What are the odds that a fairly significant move gets done by Atkins at the meetings? Like, catcher trade or higher type of significant

 

I think odds are slim on the trade front as Ross said he's more focused on free agency right at the moment. So unless a club comes and blows him away, I would bet if anything happens, it will be a signing.

[Brownie19]

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/alek-manoahs-steamer-projection-is-a-feature-not-a-bug/

[Ehjays]

Here is the latest article Ive read on the upcoming meetings

 

https://theathletic.com/3958668/2022/12/01/blue-jays-winter-meetings/

 

Where the Blue Jays stand as baseball’s winter meetings approach

 

TORONTO — Major League Baseball’s annual Winter Meetings are set to begin next week in San Diego. It’ll be the first time the event has been held in person since 2019 after the pandemic moved the 2020 meetings to a virtual setting and last year’s meetings were canceled because of the lockout.

 

As has become the norm, MLB’s offseason has been slow to develop so far, but there is a chance the pace of transactions picks up once the baseball industry is gathered in one spot. Back in 2019, several top free agents signed at the Winter Meetings including Gerrit Cole, Anthony Rendon and Stephen Strasburg, all represented by Scott Boras. The mega-agent is once again representing some of the top free agents, including Xander Bogaerts and Carlos Correa and Brandon Nimmo — who could be of interest to Toronto.

 

Speaking to the Toronto media this week in anticipation of the upcoming meetings, Blue Jays general manager Ross Atkins said he expected the market to begin moving in San Diego while adding the Blue Jays won’t feel obligated to get something done next week just for the sake of it.

 

“Everyone is maximizing those windows with other teams,” Atkins said. “We don’t spend much time just (as) the Toronto Blue Jays talking about opportunities. We spend the bulk of our time with representatives of other players, with other players and with other teams, so that does push things to the forefront. I would expect that there will be some news coming out of the Winter Meetings. Having said that, there is no deadline Thursday.”

 

The Blue Jays haven’t been completely stagnant this offseason, however. They made their first big move by trading Teoscar Hernández to the Seattle Mariners for reliever Erik Swanson and pitching prospect Adam Macko. That first domino falling gave the Blue Jays additional financial and roster flexibility and while it’s not written in stone what their next move will be, Atkins said the Blue Jays have an idea of paths they could take.

 

“We don’t have the full picture painted on exactly how to do A, B and C to make our team better, but we do have a very clear understanding of where we could take our next strategic step,” the GM said.

 

Let’s look ahead at where the Blue Jays could go at next week’s Winter Meetings.

 

Roster needs

The Blue Jays need another starter to fill out their rotation after the departure of Ross Stripling in free agency. There are also openings in the outfield now that the team has moved on from Hernández, Raimel Tapia and Bradley Zimmer, the latter two having been designated for assignment and then non-tendered, making them both free agents. And, even with Swanson added to the bullpen, they could still continue to look to complement their relief staff with more swing-and-miss potential.

 

Those appear to be the clear roster needs and if there is an over-arching organizational focus this winter, it skews toward improving at run prevention — pitching and defence — considering they already boast one of the best offences in the league. (Although, getting better offensively is on the table, too, of course.)

 

Under Atkins, the club has always placed a great value on flexibility when it comes to building its roster, so it was no surprise when asked what positions Toronto is targeting this winter, the Blue Jays GM kept his answer wide open, with the exception of saying a starter was as close to a “definite” need as they have.

 

“This is really as honest as I can possibly say it is we’re just looking for good players,” Atkins said. “It’s not definitely a left-handed hitting right fielder to fill the role of Teoscar Hernández. Would that work? Sure. Can we consider a centre fielder as well? Sure. Can we think about it in a completely different way depending on the potential of trades? How do we think about run prevention? Is it just a starter and then thinking about complementing the bullpen? Is it some other combination of run prevention?

 

“We have had a lot of dialogue about a lot of different permutations of how we can make our team better and see a lot of opportunity to do that. And feel like our starting point is as good as any other teams in baseball from where our 40-man and 26-man (roster) is.”

 

In terms of starting pitchers, Atkins didn’t rule out shopping at the top of the market, which is headlined by Jacob deGrom, Carlos Rodón and Justin Verlander, although the GM acknowledged if they devoted substantial resources on a starter then “we need to think through what that means for other areas of needs and opportunities.”

 

Of those three names, Verlander is the most interesting because the Blue Jays pursued him a year ago and came close to signing him, according to a report from ESPN.

 

In terms of outfield options, we looked at a few players who could be fits for Toronto and they include the aforementioned Nimmo, Cody Bellinger and Andrew Benintendi, all of whom have been linked to the Blue Jays in some way.

 

Trade market

The Blue Jays have already tapped into the trade market to address some of their roster needs, with the aforementioned Hernández-Swanson deal. Could the Blue Jays make another trade before the season begins?

 

It’s possible, with their trio of MLB-calibre catchers — Danny Jansen, Alejandro Kirk and Gabriel Moreno — drawing considerable interest from other clubs, especially with a shallow free-agent catching market.

 

The Blue Jays have been open to listening to offers from other teams, but they also believe they’re not in a position where they absolutely have to trade one of them if they don’t get an offer that benefits their club. In other words, the team is comfortable rostering all three of their backstops next season, a decision that’s made easier by both Jansen’s and Kirk’s ability to DH, while Moreno can also play other positions such as third base or left field.

 

We previously surveyed several The Athletic beat writers to gauge what the Blue Jays catchers could fetch on the trade market. Heading into the meetings, however, Atkins did say the team’s focus is “probably more” so on free agency than trade at the moment.

 

Financial picture

The Blue Jays’ estimated 2023 payroll is $176 million with a luxury tax payroll estimate coming in at just over $201 million. The Blue Jays never disclose their year-to-year budget, but Atkins has repeatedly pointed to the support the club has received from owners, Rogers Communications, in pursuit of building a winning ball club.

 

“We are in a great position and we understand from a business and practical standpoint what we think is ideal for the Toronto Blue Jays organization. And (Rogers chairman) Edward Rogers and (Rogers CEO) Tony Staffieri are 100 percent on board,” Atkins said. “We have an understanding, a mutual understanding, of where that range is and if we need to go past it, I’m sure that they will answer the phone when (Blue Jays president) Mark (Shapiro) calls.”

 

It’s fair to wonder, however, just how high Rogers will be willing to go, especially as their young players begin to enter their more extensive arbitration years. The Blue Jays have historically not been a team willing to go above the Competitive Balance Tax, which is set at $233 million for 2023.

 

Rule 5 draft

The Rule 5 draft is set to take place on Wednesday. The draft allows teams to select certain non-40-man-roster players from other clubs for a $100,000 fee. A drafted player has to go on his new club’s 40-man roster and during the season, must remain on its 26-man roster all season, barring an injury. If the player doesn’t, he has to be offered back to his original club for $50,000. Players eligible for the Rule 5 draft this year include those who were 19 or older and signed in 2019 or earlier or players who were 18 or younger and signed in 2018 or earlier.

 

Generally speaking, the Rule 5 draft offers an opportunity for mature prospects who may be blocked from graduating to the majors for whatever reason in their own organization a chance to stick with another.

 

Last month, teams had the chance to protect Rule-5 eligible players by adding them to their 40-man roster. The Blue Jays protected four prospects, including pitcher Yosver Zulueta and infielders Orelvis Martinez, Addison Barger and Spencer Horwitz.

 

Prospects the Blue Jays left unprotected who could garner some interest in the draft include 22-year-old right-handed reliever Adrián Hernández, who had a 4.96 ERA in Triple A last year but has a plus-changeup that could be a weapon in the majors. Gabriel Martinez, a 20-year-old outfielder, was also left off their 40-man. He’s the team’s No. 14 prospect, per Baseball America, but he’s never played above A-ball so there’s probably a slim chance he’s taken.

[glory]

What are the odds that a fairly significant move gets done by Atkins at the meetings? Like, catcher trade or higher type of significant

 

Based on Atkins' history and the market itself, it's going to be a FA signing, if anything. The catcher trade will depend on a lot of other factors (where Contreras goes, where Murphy is traded, etc) that are out of his control, so that might come later in the winter.

[John_Havok]

26.4%

 

I accept your number as valid, more or less.

[Sorrow]

Well lads Pat Tabler looks like he's retiring as per Sportsnet Twitter.

 

As an edit it looks like his contract wasn't renewed. Wonder if it's Dan and Joe or Dan and Ben or Dan and Buck.

Edited December 2, 2022 by Sorrow

[Laika]

awesome.

[L54]

Nice guy, terrible in the booth. Enjoy retirement Patty

[John_Havok]

Nice guy, terrible in the booth. Enjoy retirement Patty

 

Has Buck officially announced whether he's coming back or not?

 

If not, I might be able to watch with the sound on again when Shulman isnt there.

[Captain Adama]

Well lads Pat Tabler looks like he's retiring as per Sportsnet Twitter.

 

Barring the Jays getting Aaron Judge and his agent high on LSD and getting them to sign a 4 year 100 million dollar deal, this is the best news of the offseason.

[L54]

Has Buck officially announced whether he's coming back or not?

 

If not, I might be able to watch with the sound on again when Shulman isnt there.

 

I hope so. I enjoy Buck, it’s when he’s paired with Tablet that is brutal

[43211234]

I actually liked the Shulman/Tabler combination they had for much of the season this year.

 

Can't stand Buck. I'm happy for him that he was healthy enough to come back to the booth but I can't stand his work there.

 

Tabler > Buck

 

 

I assume this means much more Siddall in the booth.

[Slade]

Siddall in the booth with Shulman will be really good.

 

Broadcast needed an update.

[Dick_Pole]

What do people think of taking on Bumgarner's contract in order to lessen the return back to Arizona for one of the outfielders? Based on the timing of salary commitments for this team, I'd rather try to shore up the OF in this way rather than commit long term to Nimmo. Not sure if he has any no trade clause but my guess if he does, Toronto would be on that list based on his personality lol.

[Laika]

What do people think of taking on Bumgarner's contract in order to lessen the return back to Arizona for one of the outfielders? Based on the timing of salary commitments for this team, I'd rather try to shore up the OF in this way rather than commit long term to Nimmo. Not sure if he has any no trade clause but my guess if he does, Toronto would be on that list based on his personality lol.

 

He's basically a replacement level arm and he's owed $37M

 

In theory you could get Alek Thomas + Bumgarner for literally nothing going to other way, which I would of course do, but I doubt Toronto has the budget to eat $23M in 2023 payroll and that's not a realistic trade idea.

[polar bear]

Has Buck officially announced whether he's coming back or not?

 

If not, I might be able to watch with the sound on again when Shulman isnt there.

 

I have been like that for the last few years now,all my sports viewing is muted.So much repetitive nonsense being spouted.

[Ehjays]

I actually liked the Shulman/Tabler combination they had for much of the season this year.

 

Can't stand Buck. I'm happy for him that he was healthy enough to come back to the booth but I can't stand his work there.

 

Tabler > Buck

 

 

I assume this means much more Siddall in the booth.

 

I agree with all of this.

[Ehjays]

Well lads Pat Tabler looks like he's retiring as per Sportsnet Twitter.

 

As an edit it looks like his contract wasn't renewed. Wonder if it's Dan and Joe or Dan and Ben or Dan and Buck.

 

[Omar]

Love him or hate him, Tabby had a good run. Enjoy your retirement.

 

 

[Laika]

The tone of that text makes me thing this was not his choice

[Jonn]

Can’t say I saw this coming. Not really a huge fan of Sidal so if that means more him kinda sucks. He’s fine on the pannel with the ginger. But 3 hours of him is not ideal.

[Brownie19]

Can’t say I saw this coming. Not really a huge fan of Sidal so if that means more him kinda sucks. He’s fine on the pannel with the ginger. But 3 hours of him is not ideal.

 

I think I much prefer Sidal or Ben Wagner to Buck or Tabby.

[Omar]

I think I much prefer Sidal or Ben Wagner to Buck or Tabby.

 

Yep. Siddall is good. Not afraid to give criticism when it's due.