Fire Charlie Montoyo - The thread worked guys!

[Boxcar]

The "savage takedown" words were sarcasm. It doesn't matter much either way.

 

"The play you are so up in arms is probably taking things to the 5th decimal point."

 

that's just... how many decimal points were produced by the basic multiplication. truncate it at round percentages and it doesn't change the point. not sure why people are getting offended at the number of digits. 89438594375894375894375893758943758937458975439 spooky!!

 

I'm comfortable assuming Jansen is not an above average bunter.

 

There are lots of little considerations that it was impossible to work into the simple mathematical example. Most of those other hypothetical scenarios would have little influence next to the broad, prevailing scenarios used in the comparison because they are just very rare. Jansen's chance of bunting for a hit or forced error would be incredibly small. He's slow as s***. You could include something like that with the other bullet points of possible outside considerations but I don't think it changed the point.

 

Numbers are scary, obviously. My eye test said that the bunt was a good idea. Stats and probabilities are for nerds.

[Boxcar]

Tellez numbers improved drastically in one game. He would have completely turned those numbers around if his last foul ball had been 3 inches to the right and hit the foul pole for his 2nd home run. Still 3 for 5 with 2 doubles and a homer is a good start.

 

Every player is going to run into one from time to time. For God's sake, would you look at the entire body of work for once in your life? Tellez hitting a flat 90mph fastball for a home run off of a s***** pitcher doesn't change the fact that he's been a consistently awful hitter at the big league level.

 

Does your opinion on player skill fluctuate from game to game? Explains a lot if so.

[FrozenRopes]

This is not the guy to lead a team of young stars.

 

I watch a lot of baseball. His decisions are some of the worst on a regular basis.

[saskjayfan]

Every player is going to run into one from time to time. For God's sake, would you look at the entire body of work for once in your life? Tellez hitting a flat 90mph fastball for a home run off of a s***** pitcher doesn't change the fact that he's been a consistently awful hitter at the big league level.

 

Does your opinion on player skill fluctuate from game to game? Explains a lot if so.

 

Oh my god. 528 plate appearances split over 3 years is not a big enough sample size to conclude anything. Player development is an actual thing. The growth in Rowdy is there, you're just too busy looking at numbers 2 and 3 years ago. He is fitter this year, his swing path is very good. His plate discipline is improved. You refute these assertions with data from the past. He's made adjustments to his body and his at bats. There are tons of players who went from being not so good in their first 500 to 1000 ABs to being very good players. Rowdy doesn't even have a full year of at bats yet.

 

My opinion does not change from game to game. I came out and said he was a good hitter when his numbers were awful. His numbers still don't look that great. Give it time. A guy that hits more fly balls than grounders and looks like this has a chance.

 

 

Edited August 13, 2020 by saskjayfan

[BlueRocky]

Extend Buntoyo how many years?

[John_Havok]

Extend Buntoyo how many years?

 

-3 years please

[Terminator]

Joe Panik batting 2nd today lol

[King]

Joe Panik batting 2nd today lol

He is replacing Bo in the resumed game.

[BTS]

I wonder if Justin Bour debates took over the Marlins forum the way Rowdy Telellez has the BJMB.

[Terminator]

He is replacing Bo in the resumed game.

 

Oh ok thats for the resumed game. Fire terminator.

[Deadpool]

He is replacing Bo in the resumed game.

 

So, we're conceding the loss then? Gotcha.

[King]

So, we're conceding the loss then? Gotcha.

Bo is probably out for a few weeks or more lol. We are conceding many losses, yes

[Terminator]

Buntoyo just had Reese McGuire bunt with a runner on first and second and no outs in order to put the runners in scoring position for....Brandon Drury?

 

Montoyo is Ned Yost levels of bad.

[bones10]

Buntoyo just had Reese McGuire bunt with a runner on first and second and no outs in order to put the runners in scoring position for....Brandon Drury?

 

Montoyo is Ned Yost levels of bad.

 

didnt pinch hit shaw for drury either

[glory]

Buntoyo just had Reese McGuire bunt with a runner on first and second and no outs in order to put the runners in scoring position for....Brandon Drury?

 

Montoyo is Ned Yost levels of bad.

 

He had Travis Shaw on the bench and a righty on the mound and still kept Drury in the game.

 

I would be 100% ok with a bad 2020 season if it meant this man was fired after the season.

[BigCecil]

Buntoyo just had Reese McGuire bunt with a runner on first and second and no outs in order to put the runners in scoring position for....Brandon Drury?

 

Montoyo is Ned Yost levels of bad.

 

Unbelievable ********. Jesus f***. Give up an out to let hitting machine Drury drive him in. Another loss.

[Jonn]

I wonder if Justin Bour debates took over the Marlins forum the way Rowdy Telellez has the BJMB.

 

If the Marlins had a fan forum I would be shocked. Pretty sure nobody in Miami gives a f*** about that team. I have a friend who lives down there who actually likes Baseball and could name everyone on the Miami Hurricanes but doesn’t know s*** about the Marlins. That is a College sports town through and through.

[Boxcar]

Unbelievable ********. Jesus f***. Give up an out to let hitting machine Drury drive him in. Another loss.

 

Everyone needs to have a turn to hit with runners in scoring position. Did your kids never play house league sports? That's the way it should be done. Charles is bringing fairness back to the sport, and more players are going to want to play for the Jays if they know they will actually get a chance to play.

 

BC, you really need to get your head out of your ass and think about the 4D chess long game here. Professional baseball isn't all about "winning".

[BigCecil]

Everyone needs to have a turn to hit with runners in scoring position. Did your kids never play house league sports? That's the way it should be done. Charles is bringing fairness back to the sport, and more players are going to want to play for the Jays if they know they will actually get a chance to play.

 

BC, you really need to get your head out of your ass and think about the 4D chess long game here. Professional baseball isn't all about "winning".

 

Egalitarian baseball. We need more Panik and Drury...and cowbell. I’m so pissed off. I heard my father in law say “good job Charlie we need more small ball” and I had to leave the room. At least Joe Siddal pointed out how dumb that was topped off by leaving Shaw on bench. I thought this f***head was supposed to bring us some Tampa voodoo (in a positive way).

[Stangstag]

Everyone needs to have a turn to hit with runners in scoring position. Did your kids never play house league sports? That's the way it should be done. Charles is bringing fairness back to the sport, and more players are going to want to play for the Jays if they know they will actually get a chance to play.

 

BC, you really need to get your head out of your ass and think about the 4D chess long game here. Professional baseball isn't all about "winning".

 

You’ve got Charlie’s mind mapped, seriously

[gruber92]

I just noticed, but did Montoya pull Alford defensively in the top of the seventh for Gurriel and left Teo in the game?

[Spanky99]

I just noticed, but did Montoya pull Alford defensively in the top of the seventh for Gurriel and left Teo in the game?

 

Yes, they did. Also didn't bring in Espinal and move Drury or Shaw to 1B, asinine.

[Deadpool]

I just noticed, but did Montoya pull Alford defensively in the top of the seventh for Gurriel and left Teo in the game?

 

Technically not Montoyo, though he most likely was still involved even after the ejection.

[gruber92]

Yes, they did. Also didn't bring in Espinal and move Drury or Shaw to 1B, asinine.

 

Technically not Montoyo, though he most likely was still involved even after the ejection.

 

Wow. I think this team is talented enough now where they seem they will be competitive on a more consistent basis starting next season.

 

Time to bring in a real coaching staff Ross.

[Abomination]

I just noticed, but did Montoya pull Alford defensively in the top of the seventh for Gurriel and left Teo in the game?

 

Well, it is Alford. He probably sneezed and injured himself again.

[Terminator]

Let's recap today's insane managing.

 

Game 1

Bottom of the 6th, game tied at 2

-Runners on first and second and nobody out. Montoyo bunts with McGuire to put the runners in scoring position.

-The Rays take out Beeks (LHP) and bring in Fairbanks (RHP) to pitch to Drury.

-Montoyo opts to not use Travis Shaw to pinch hit! Shaw bats left so not only would he have had the Lefty-Righty matchup but he's also MILES better than Brandon Drury. Shaw also plays the very same position. This was set up on a tee for Montoyo and he whiffed. WHY WOULDN'T HE PINCH HIT HERE?

-Not only does Drury get out, but he hits a weak dribbler down the line and Grichuk gets thrown out at home. We now have 1 runner in scoring position and 2 outs instead of having 1 runner in scoring position and 0 outs.

 

Top of the 7th, Game Tied

-Montoyo brings in Borucki to face the top of the Rays lineup.

-After a K and a double, Montoyo intentionally walks Yandy Diaz? Why?

-Then the Rays pinch hit to get the matchup and he leaves the left handed Borucki in the game. He walks another batter to load the bases.

-THEN Montoyo brings in Dolis to face the righty Brosseau but Cash pinch hits again to get the matchup with Wendle.

-In the end it didn't matter because Dolis got the job done. But between the Bottom of the 6th and the Top of the 7th, Cash got his matchups damn near every single time! Cash was playing Montoyo like a fiddle.

 

9th Inning, Tie Game

-Montoyo has Romano in and Lowe homers and then puts 2 runners on. Montoyo goes to Shun Yamaguchi to face KK. At this point in the year Romano has looked like a stud but was struggling so I get the hook. But once again the Jays pitchers are continuously on the wrong end of the matchup. Not really complaining here but Yamaguchi has not looked good and he uses him in a big spot. Meh.

 

Bottom 9, Down 1

-NOW Montoyo pinch hits. So he's aware that pinch hitting for Drury with Shaw is a good idea, he just has no idea when to do it. Anderson is one of the best relievers in baseball. Shaw and the rest of the Jays didn't stand a chance at this point. Game over.

 

Game 2

Top 5, Jays up 5-3

-Shoemaker gets tossed. We only have three innings to go and a 2 run lead. We've got roughly 5 pitchers available. Kay and Cole who are decent, Font and Waguespack who are bad and Gaviglio who is trash. Who does Montoyo go to? He picks one of the bad ones in Waguespack.

-He probably picked him because it was the bottom of the order and he wanted Kay to pitch to the top of the order. Well guess what Waguespack stinks so Kay has to pitch to the top of the order anyway, and this time with inherited baserunners. Kay gets out of it but the Rays chip away as one of Wagespack's baserunners scores.

 

Top 7 (the final inning), Jays up 1

-Whoever was calling the shots at this point (since Montoyo was tossed) takes Alford out of the game in the 9th inning and uses Gurriel as a defensive replacement? Lol that's the exact opposite of how you are supposed to use Anthony Alford.

-If that wasn't bad enough, the Jays leave Tellez in the game and Drury at SS. Why not leave Alford in the game, sub Espinal in at SS and move Drury to 1B? Instead, the Jays go with one of the worst defensive teams that they could possibly field to protect a 1 run lead.

-What happens? Meadows hits a 78 mph ground ball past a diving Tellez. According to statcast that ball had an xBA of .370. Yeah that's pretty high but it still means that 73% of the time a ball hit like that is going to be an out. Tellez, one of the worst defensive players in baseball, couldn't come up with the play.

-The rally is on and Teoscar f***s up, allowing them to tie the game. They lost two very close games and they allowed unearned runs in both.

 

Anyway, that ended up a lot longer than I thought it would so thanks for reading. There were just that many boneheaded moves made by Montoyo and whoever replaced him after he got tossed. Hopefully this is the final year we have to see this guy managing he's garbage.

[BTS]

I'm hoping it comes out that Alford was hurt or something, because if he wasn't whoever chose to replace him defensively with Gurriel needs to be fired. Ross Atkins should have called Montoyo to his office after the game and demanded an explanation, but he probably didn't.

[Terminator]

Montoyo has no clue on how to use these s*** bench players we have. I get that the team isn't necessarily deep but they all have skills that can be used to at least try and increase their effectiveness.

 

Fisher- Time to find out what we've got with him. Instead Montoyo rarely played him before he got hurt.

Tellez- Pretty decent hitter against righties and that's literally all he does well. He should be used like how the Rays use Choi. The Jays won't even sub him out defensively though.

Panik- He's fine as a sparingly used 25/26th man but he's become a de facto everyday player with Montoyo shifting the lineup around to get him more playing time, even before the injuries.

Espinal- With Bo out he's obviously our best defensive SS. Not used as a defensive replacement though.

Alford- He's a very good option to be both a defensive replacement and pinch runner. Instead he gets taken out of the game at the end.

Brandon Drury- Over the past 3 years he's been the worst player in baseball other than Chris Davis. Not playing him would be best.

[Abomination]

Tellez- Pretty decent hitter against righties and that's literally all he does well. He should be used like how the Rays use Choi. The Jays won't even sub him out defensively though.

 

Rowdy actually hits lefties and righties about the same.

[TheHurl]

The Jays are currently drafting 5th and are 2 games behind drafting 2nd.