Around Baseball 2020

[Laika]

Ray had a couple seasons of solid backend SP and then this last season he was literally one of the worst SP in baseball. He’s got some potential but I think that’s reflected in the 1/8. What would you expect for him in a normal market?

 

It's a chicken and egg question because in a normal market we aren't coming off a shortened season and Ray gets 33 starts to right the ship.

 

"solid backend SP" seems unfair though. Ray was pretty good for most of 2015 through 2019. As much fWAR (more or less) as guys like Stroman, Odorizzi, Porcello, Happ, Roark. Cy Young votes one year. Just turned 29 years old. He might choose to sign a one year deal in a normal market, coming off a full bad year, given his age but I think a lot of teams would want him in such a scenario.

 

Jesus, didn't the Angels pay Matt Harvey's corpse like $11M two years ago? After being just horrendous for a couple of years. Ray hasn't even really lost his stuff, he just lost the zone for a small number of starts and the mechanical issues are kind of apparent.

[connorp]

I was taking 2018-2020 for Ray, if you stretch it more it looks better. Actually Harvey seems to be a really good comp, in the 3 years prior to FA they were at 2.9 and 2.5 WAR over about 2 seasons of IP.

I wouldn’t call Harvey a corpse as his velo, while down, wasn’t overly alarming at 94 prior to FA. He clearly lost his feel for pitching but he was a lottery ticket like Ray. Bigger name, not sure if that meant anything though

But either way, if Ray signed for 1/10 say, it’s not much difference in terms of what he’d get normally

We’ll find out more about the market soon I guess

[BTS]

Michael Taylor somehow got a guaranteed 1.75M

[Spanky__99]

Michael Taylor somehow got a guaranteed 1.75M

 

With 1 million in incentives, wow.

[Laika]

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2020/11/mlb-announces-draft-league-prospects-2021.html

 

hmmmmmmm

 

high school and college draft prospects playing against each other in a league organized by MLB which straddles the MLB draft?

 

cool?

[Spanky__99]

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2020/11/mlb-announces-draft-league-prospects-2021.html

 

hmmmmmmm

 

high school and college draft prospects playing against each other in a league organized by MLB which straddles the MLB draft?

 

cool?

 

This is exciting...

 

 

I'll certainly get a sub for that.

[wilko]

Michael Taylor somehow got a guaranteed 1.75M

 

[connorp]

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2020/11/mlb-announces-draft-league-prospects-2021.html

 

hmmmmmmm

 

high school and college draft prospects playing against each other in a league organized by MLB which straddles the MLB draft?

 

cool?

 

Mostly cool but you immediately think of the people with a really high draft stock coming in. A 1st round SP could blow his arm or something and so on.. or even if you’re a Top 10 pick why risk playing and chance playing out of it in sss.. you’d have to think there’d be some opt outs but also lots of opp for people to move up the ladder

[Spanky__99]

Mostly cool but you immediately think of the people with a really high draft stock coming in. A 1st round SP could blow his arm or something and so on.. you’d have to think there’d be some opt outs but also lots of opp for people to move up the ladder

 

What do you mean, it's a showcase league? If someone's arm was going to blow, it would regardless. Who the f*** would opt out if eligible, lol?

[connorp]

What do you mean, it's a showcase league? If someone's arm was going to blow, it would regardless. Who the f*** would opt out if eligible, lol?

 

It would be after the high school/college season, no?

If you looked like a Top 10 pick what would be the benefit of playing?

Think like an agent

[connorp]

What if you’re Riley Green off the cuff and you’re Top 5 pick but then you hit .220 in limited ABs in the Showcase league and you tumble (losing millions)

[connorp]

Oh I didnt read it through lol

But I guess half the games would come pre-draft?

[Orgfiller]

Mostly cool but you immediately think of the people with a really high draft stock coming in. A 1st round SP could blow his arm or something and so on.. or even if you’re a Top 10 pick why risk playing and chance playing out of it in sss.. you’d have to think there’d be some opt outs but also lots of opp for people to move up the ladder

 

...as opposed to them to them blowing chunks or getting injured at the college/prep level?

[connorp]

...as opposed to them to them blowing chunks or getting injured at the college/prep level?

 

If they came off a bad season in hs or college, they would have every incentive to play. Don’t see your point

[Laika]

Mostly cool but you immediately think of the people with a really high draft stock coming in. A 1st round SP could blow his arm or something and so on.. or even if you’re a Top 10 pick why risk playing and chance playing out of it in sss.. you’d have to think there’d be some opt outs but also lots of opp for people to move up the ladder

 

Already some discussion about this. I think the league would rightly expect some players to opt out after getting drafted - their orgs might tell them not to play anymore.

 

"Jackson alludes to the fact that the league expects some players to pull out of the league after being drafted, noting that “after the draft, we’ll be able to take some kids — some of the seniors and some other guys looking to get those free-agent opportunities and put them in that mix.”

 

But it is an MLB organized league so is it much different than these kids going to short season, or whatever, after the draft?

 

And pre-draft, you really would not expect pitchers who have just had a full college season to come in and throw but you might instead see mid-round arms looking to make an impression, guys who were dealing with nagging stuff all season and did not throw a lot during their college / high school seasons, etc.

 

I dunno, more data can't hurt. This is probably just replacing lesser showcase type things that some of the players do anyway so who knows how much more baseball it would even be for them.

 

It would be cool though to see a bunch of first and second rounders immediately after they have been drafted, in a league that's broadcast through MLB.tv (or whatever) with good camera angles and some of the newfangled tracking stuff.

 

One issue historically with MiLB and the promotion of MLB is how remote and mysterious and inaccessible baseball is when it is further away from the big leagues. You can't watch instructs, you can't really watch most minor league teams (at least not on good camera angles). Maybe part of what MLB is trying to do with the MiLB reforms and this is to elevate the minor leagues just a little bit - decrease the sheer number of teams but create a more concentrated and watchable product from the time players enter the system. This type of league, with heavy investment, could really promote that end.

 

Imagine if a few weeks after the 2020 draft we could have tuned in to watch Austin Martin dig in against Nick Bitsko (RIP) in HD?

[connorp]

Yeah no doubt there will be a great opp for guys looking to improve their draft stock. For teams it’s definitely a win as more data is good like you said

[Brownie19]

Does anyone know what the TV audience is for college baseball in the US v. college basketball/football? I suspect it's rather s***** (much like hockey). Why is that? You'd think that improving the exposure and interest at the college level would help grow the sport a lot.

[glory]

I like that concept of the draft league. The MLB draft doesn't have the same juice as other leagues (NBA/NFL) due to 1) prospects not being known and 2) how far away they are from actually reaching the Majors, but this at least tries to help solve #1. Put the games on the MLB Network, MLB.tv, YouTube, etc. Couldn't hurt.

[Spanky__99]

Faaaaaaack... I didn't know Bitsko was hurt, godammit. I hope it's a minor ailment. *crosses fingers*

[Spanky__99]

Does anyone know what the TV audience is for college baseball in the US v. college basketball/football? I suspect it's rather s***** (much like hockey). Why is that? You'd think that improving the exposure and interest at the college level would help grow the sport a lot.

 

It's turrible. Those guys don't walk on to the peak professional stage like the NBA and NFL, plus sports betting.

[connorp]

Does anyone know what the TV audience is for college baseball in the US v. college basketball/football? I suspect it's rather s***** (much like hockey). Why is that? You'd think that improving the exposure and interest at the college level would help grow the sport a lot.

 

I think we covered this a bit recently talking about blacks/inner city participation in baseball. I know my take was the biggest reason for the skewed numbers vs other sports is the difference in the college recruiting and interest level.

 

Not sure how baseball would become “more cool”. Basketball and football are way more “casual friendly”, especially at the college level. Pace of play, crazy environments and all that. I don’t really see how the tide gets reversed no matter what kind of money baseball tossed at the problem

[Spanky__99]

Just sharing the last day of the offer...

 

[Laika]

I think we covered this a bit recently talking about blacks/inner city participation in baseball. I know my take was the biggest reason for the skewed numbers vs other sports is the difference in the college recruiting and interest level.

 

Not sure how baseball would become “more cool”. Basketball and football are way more “casual friendly”, especially at the college level. Pace of play, crazy environments and all that. I don’t really see how the tide gets reversed no matter what kind of money baseball tossed at the problem

 

Baseball probably needs to embrace what it is.

 

Bat flips and show-boating and bling make the game marginally more entertaining for the younger crowd, but all that does is add some flair in place of the previously entertaining grit that now outlawed takeout slides and now severely frowned upon brawls / plunkings.

 

Baseball is a good sport for people who are on their phones and laptops. Heck, even hardcore old fans keep score on paper, in other words they look away from the game regularly because there are huge pauses in the action. Somehow MLB needs to leverage modern technology to embrace what baseball is. It's a game with a very drawn out and punctuated display of athleticism, with very rare snippets of peak athleticism... it's made for people who like suspense and/or monotony, it's made for people who can't pay attention, it's made for nerds who like to do math outside of the games, and it's made for people who like to multi-task during the games.

 

I don't actually know what the answer is but it certainly is not trying to compete directly with basketball or football by being as cool as those sports. Just no chance.

[L54]

Football/Basketball clearly dominate because they can provide an atmosphere that baseball can't. Faster pace, loud music, closed stadiums, lots of beer. This environment will drag the 18 year old freshman or the 24 year old super senior out because it's a part of the university experience.

 

College baseball - nine innings, sit in your seat, no break in the action, it's probably cold or raining in like 50% of the country.

 

Baseball isn't going to have a revolution and needs to embrace itself like Laika said.

[Grant77]

Just sharing the last day of the offer...

 

 

I don't know what they are talking about. Colon won 21 games, while Santana only won 16...

[Spanky__99]

I don't know what they are talking about. Colon won 21 games, while Santana only won 16...

 

IDC... but W's? I was sharing the Athletic deal, it's normally 10 American a month.

[Spanky__99]

Mark Buehrle is trending on FG, I checked why, and writers are talking about him for the HOF, that's silly. He had a very good career, and has done some great things, but...

[Abomination]

Mark Buehrle is trending on FG, I checked why, and writers are talking about him for the HOF, that's silly. He had a very good career, and has done some great things, but...

 

He's 81st all-time in WAR for pitchers. He probably shouldn't make it in, but it seems reasonable for him to get consideration.

[Spanky__99]

He's 81st all-time in WAR for pitchers. He probably shouldn't make it in, but it seems reasonable for him to get consideration.

 

Longevity shouldn't get you in... I hear CC shouldn't be in on the MLB Network and I think he should be in. Hard to say, but I'm a hard no, on MB.

[Abomination]

Longevity shouldn't get you in... I hear CC shouldn't be in on the MLB Network and I think he should be in. Hard to say, but I'm a hard no, on MB.

 

I'm a no too. I just think it's wrong to completely dismiss him without some discussion. He's earned the debate.