What should we do with Aaron Sanchez next year?

[THANOS]

Foreign substances on the baseball will do that for you. I have serious doubts that coaching had much to do with it. Guys like Verlander are set in their ways and haven't changed much.

 

I doubt they could get away with that. Someone would have figured it out by now.

[Sorrow]

I think with Sanchez it really depends on if he can throw the curve 25-30% of the time every game while not developing a blister. If he cannot shove him in the bullpen and call it a day.

[Brownie19]

Foreign substances on the baseball will do that for you. I have serious doubts that coaching had much to do with it. Guys like Verlander are set in their ways and haven't changed much.

 

What a stupid thing to say.

[Brownie19]

This is a great question. I think there's a very strong chance that 2016 was an outliner and he'll never come close to replicating that type of success ever again (which is what his minor league #'s + his 2015, 2017 and 2018 results suggest). That said, I like that he's developed the change up. If he could ever make the necessary adjustments to improve his control/command, I think he could be a very successful starter with his current repertoire (provided he is able to throw the curve as much as he wants to).

 

If you were strongly convinced that he'd be a shutdown reliever - then I'd probably elect to go that route, but I personally am not convinced he would be.

 

Unfortunately - I think there's a strong possibility that Sanchez will fail in whatever role he's put in next year and Shatkins will take a lot of unnecessary heat next year because of it. This reminds me all too much of Biagini - and like Biagini, all of this is built on what was probably a fluky outliner 2016 season.

[Grant77]

What a stupid thing to say.

 

There have already been several instances to show that it may be true. They're obviously not against shady dealings, having stolen most of their advanced techniques from St. Louis.

[Grant77]

Regarding Sanchez, it should also be noted that ZIPS projects him for a 4.09 ERA. That's pretty much the calibre of starter that everyone will want to sign this offseason.

[BTS]

Regarding Sanchez, it should also be noted that ZIPS projects him for a 4.09 ERA. That's pretty much the calibre of starter that everyone will want to sign this offseason.

 

Really, I'd rather try him in relief than have him pitching at a league average level as a starter, because a) I don't trust him to stay on the field as a starter, and if he's a high end reliever he'll have more trade value than he would as a 2-win starter with a history of durability issues.

[Grant77]

Really, I'd rather try him in relief than have him pitching at a league average level as a starter, because a) I don't trust him to stay on the field as a starter, and if he's a high end reliever he'll have more trade value than he would as a 2-win starter with a history of durability issues.

 

If we're intent on trading him then I agree that this is the right course to take. However, I think the purpose of a rebuilding year is to take a look at talent and see if we have a piece for the next winning team. Sanchez has a better chance of being a contributor in 2020 and beyond than whatever we could get in a trade in my opinion. The 2016 stuff is still there so I'd like to give the team one more offseason to solve his issues with blisters.

[BTS]

If we're intent on trading him then I agree that this is the right course to take. However, I think the purpose of a rebuilding year is to take a look at talent and see if we have a piece for the next winning team. Sanchez has a better chance of being a contributor in 2020 and beyond than whatever we could get in a trade in my opinion. The 2016 stuff is still there so I'd like to give the team one more offseason to solve his issues with blisters.

 

I guess that's where our difference in perspective comes from: I have a hard time conceiving of a situation in which I'd find it attractive to bring him back on a free agent deal, especially if he has a great 2020.

[Grant77]

I guess that's where our difference in perspective comes from: I have a hard time conceiving of a situation in which I'd find it attractive to bring him back on a free agent deal, especially if he has a great 2020.

 

If we somehow find ourselves with a homegrown ace in his prime then I'd happily pony up some cash. That's a good problem to have in my opinion.

[Spanky99]

I think with Sanchez it really depends on if he can throw the curve 25-30% of the time every game while not developing a blister. If he cannot shove him in the bullpen and call it a day.

 

Pretty much, you can't have him pitching scared, he needs to pitch with the repertoire he had in '16 and let it fly. If he gets injured so be it, put him in the pen when he gets back, same goes for Stroman.

[Terminator]

He's a Scott Boras client too. If he somehow returns to 2016 form he's going to cost a ton to retain.

[Dick_Pole]

Really, I'd rather try him in relief than have him pitching at a league average level as a starter, because a) I don't trust him to stay on the field as a starter, and if he's a high end reliever he'll have more trade value than he would as a 2-win starter with a history of durability issues.

 

The Jays are about $40M/year worth of FA spending strictly on starting pitching away from making Sanchez to the pen a reality in 2019. He's the third best pitcher on this team and I'm afraid to even admit who the two guys ahead of him are. Let's wait until next March before clamouring for this move which you're advocating for.

[Maico450]

I have thought Sanchez belonged in the pen on several occasions over the last 2 years, usually after he gets put on the DL.

But then he comes out and dazzles every now and then. You wonder, how can this blister problem keep occurring?

Jays go 40 years, and up till now, Al Leiter was the only blister problem. Now both Stro and Sanchez are reoccurring.

 

You can blame the balls, and the pitches, but every other Starting pitcher is dealing with the same balls and pitches.

You also have to wonder why the blisters did not occur earlier in his career?

It really makes sense to turn him into a setup guy, they do have value, even though Boras will flip out if the Jays make Sanchez a reliever. Who cares?

[Abomination]

I have thought Sanchez belonged in the pen on several occasions over the last 2 years, usually after he gets put on the DL.

But then he comes out and dazzles every now and then. You wonder, how can this blister problem keep occurring?

Jays go 40 years, and up till now, Al Leiter was the only blister problem. Now both Stro and Sanchez are reoccurring.

 

You can blame the balls, and the pitches, but every other Starting pitcher is dealing with the same balls and pitches.

You also have to wonder why the blisters did not occur earlier in his career?

It really makes sense to turn him into a setup guy, they do have value, even though Boras will flip out if the Jays make Sanchez a reliever. Who cares?

 

There's a lot of players having blister problems right now. In fact, Cobb just left the game with one as we speak. Maybe it's the balls, maybe it's some of the new grips, who knows.

 

I'm pretty sure minor league balls are different from the major league ones.

[glory]

Yeah the Jays don't have nearly enough Sp depth to talk about Sanchez going to the pen. He only has two years of control left. Start him, maybe he does well for half the season and then trade him. But right now, him and Stroman along with Borucki are the only MLB capable Sp's on the team.

[Maico450]

There's a lot of players having blister problems right now. In fact, Cobb just left the game with one as we speak. Maybe it's the balls, maybe it's some of the new grips, who knows.

 

I'm pretty sure minor league balls are different from the major league ones.

 

125 ML pitchers have thrown more innings than Stroman this year. 137 pitchers have thrown more innings than Sanchez this year.

Most starting pitchers are not having the kinds of problems our guys have had with blister problems. 62 SP have thrown over 150 innings already. Dunno?

[Laika]

125 ML pitchers have thrown more innings than Stroman this year. 137 pitchers have thrown more innings than Sanchez this year.

Most starting pitchers are not having the kinds of problems our guys have had with blister problems. 62 SP have thrown over 150 innings already. Dunno?

 

That's not the correct way to look at it.

 

Blister issues are definitely more prevalent. Look at Cueto - goes his whole career almost without getting hurt and then all of a sudden recently has chronic blister issues (before his elbow fell apart).

The rate seems to have doubled.

 

[Maico450]

I agree that blisters are more common today than years ago. The issue is, what do you do about it?

Al Leiter solved his problem by soaking his finger in pickle brine. I believe that Sanchez and Stro have tried this.

Personally I always found that doing a lot of hard work with your hands, toughened up the skin. I would have expected that they would have tried this also? Carry a brick around?

[Spanky99]

That's not the correct way to look at it.

 

Blister issues are definitely more prevalent. Look at Cueto - goes his whole career almost without getting hurt and then all of a sudden recently has chronic blister issues (before his elbow fell apart).

The rate seems to have doubled.

 

 

Holy s***!

[Boxcar]

Holy s***!

 

They didn't change the ball, though. No siree.

[tercet]

Probably give him another chance at a starter, but don't expect much.

 

Moving him to the bullpen probably won't magically fix his command/control problems.

[Jimcanuck]

Release him back into the forest imo

 

lol

[John_Havok]

Much better pitch mix tonight from Sanchez

 

http://www.brooksbaseball.net/pfxVB/pfx.php?month=9&day=12&year=2018&game=gid_2018_09_12_tormlb_bosmlb_1%2F&pitchSel=592717&prevGame=gid_2018_09_12_tormlb_bosmlb_1%2F&prevDate=912&league=mlb

[Grant77]

Much better pitch mix tonight from Sanchez

 

http://www.brooksbaseball.net/pfxVB/pfx.php?month=9&day=12&year=2018&game=gid_2018_09_12_tormlb_bosmlb_1%2F&pitchSel=592717&prevGame=gid_2018_09_12_tormlb_bosmlb_1%2F&prevDate=912&league=mlb

 

He's still every bit the pitcher that we saw in 2016 if he has the confidence and health to mix in that curveball on a regular basis.

[Spanky99]

He's still every bit the pitcher that we saw in 2016 if he has the confidence and health to mix in that curveball on a regular basis.

 

Agree, it's all he needs to do.

[John_Havok]

He's still every bit the pitcher that we saw in 2016 if he has the confidence and health to mix in that curveball on a regular basis.

 

Not just the curve though, gotta keep throwing more 4 seams than 2 seams. Small sample size of course, but look at the swing/whiff rates on every pitch other than the 2 seam last night? 0 whiffs on the 2 seam, we'll above average whiff rates on the other 3. This follows the same ype of results from his previous start against Tampa when his 4 seam and curve were also used more.

 

Contrast that with his early season pitch mix and it's like night and day.

[THANOS]

Not just the curve though, gotta keep throwing more 4 seams than 2 seams. Small sample size of course, but look at the swing/whiff rates on every pitch other than the 2 seam last night? 0 whiffs on the 2 seam, we'll above average whiff rates on the other 3. This follows the same ype of results from his previous start against Tampa when his 4 seam and curve were also used more.

 

Contrast that with his early season pitch mix and it's like night and day.

 

Good point. It's interesting how many of our starters have pitch mix issues. I wonder where the blame would fall for that? The pitching coach, management, people in between?

 

All I know, is it feels like Stroman has had an awful pitch mix since he moved up from AAA and seemed to lose all whiff ability overnight, and there's something not right with that.

[Brownie19]

Good point. It's interesting how many of our starters have pitch mix issues. I wonder where the blame would fall for that? The pitching coach, management, people in between?

 

All I know, is it feels like Stroman has had an awful pitch mix since he moved up from AAA and seemed to lose all whiff ability overnight, and there's something not right with that.

 

I blame Doc. All our young pitchers grew up watching the master and think they can replicate his success with the sinker. They can't (and it's a different era) - throw the 4 seamer while hitters are still trying to lift the baseball.