General 2017 Blue Jays Discussion Thread

[G-Snarls]

We did face him for 4 innings back in May. 4H, 3ER, 1BB, 5K

 

Thanks

 

I wasn't tuned in that week

[Ogi]

Austin Bibens-Dirkx

 

Who is he

 

Why is his name so odd

 

Is he any good

 

He seems to have spent forever in the minors

 

This whole time I thought dirkx was a typo...

[Candy Maldonado]

His name is the first thing most people notice. “Bibens-Dirkx. "I’m the only one that has it,” he informs me. “It’s kind of a thrown together, Mom’s maiden name, Step-Dad’s last name, so I am… one of a kind,” he laughs.

[G-Snarls]

I presume the last part is pronounced the same as "Dirks"??

[G-Snarls]

Osuna is just absolute filth this year. 49% O-Swing is so far ahead of anyone else. 2nd in Swstr% to Kimbrel. He has 5 f***ing pitches. I guess we just ride the wave for as long as we can but man, if this guy isn't one of the best SP prospects in baseball. Honestly, he might be the best SP prospect. He is 22 years old with almost 200 big league innings and playoff experience. Plus, plus, plus make up.

 

Osuna is an absolute beast and I love him

[THANOS]

Osuna is just absolute filth this year. 49% O-Swing is so far ahead of anyone else. 2nd in Swstr% to Kimbrel. He has 5 f***ing pitches. I guess we just ride the wave for as long as we can but man, if this guy isn't one of the best SP prospects in baseball. Honestly, he might be the best SP prospect. He is 22 years old with almost 200 big league innings and playoff experience. Plus, plus, plus make up.

 

So you're suggesting they roll him into the rotation still?

 

Say they do that, what's the innings limit for 2018?

 

80, 90, 100, etc?

[glory]

Osuna is never going to start again. Time to let go of that dream.

[G-Snarls]

Osuna is never going to start again. Time to let go of that dream.

 

Agreed

 

Will never happen now

 

He's killing it in his current role

 

He'd have a serious innings limit if they stretched him out

 

He likes closing

 

Gibby likes him right where he is

[G-Snarls]

Not saying he might not be a good starter

 

Nor that they maybe should have tried

 

Nor that we couldn't use him next near if we lose Liriano and Estrada

 

But it's not happening

[Terminator]

I think I'd prefer to give up a bit more for Howie Kendrick. Whoever we acquire to fill 2B stands a good chance of being bumped to the bench if Travis returns later in the year, but in that event Kendrick becomes an option for LF as well.

 

Kendrick wouldn't be a bad option for that reason but I think Eduardo Nunez might be an even better option. He's a FA at the end of the year so I'd imagine that the Giants would move him.

[Terminator]

Not saying he might not be a good starter

 

Nor that they maybe should have tried

 

Nor that we couldn't use him next near if we lose Liriano and Estrada

 

But it's not happening

 

I used to think that but I'm starting to hear more buzz about him becoming a starter. He's not a typical closer in that he relies on one outstanding breaking ball and a good fastball. He's got numerous pitches that would help him transition to becoming a starter. I bet the FO is at least discussing it.

[burlingtonbandit]

Just be happy he is one of the best relievers in the game. No point in screwing around with him when he only has 3 years left of control after this year anyway. His value as a reliever might be just as high anyway.

[G-Snarls]

Just be happy he is one of the best relievers in the game. No point in screwing around with him when he only has 3 years left of control after this year anyway. His value as a reliever might be just as high anyway.

 

1.8 WAR as a closer last year for $550,000

[Terminator]

Just be happy he is one of the best relievers in the game. No point in screwing around with him when he only has 3 years left of control after this year anyway. His value as a reliever might be just as high anyway.

 

Yeah the control is the kicker for me, otherwise I'd make a starting pitcher. At this point he's got 3 years left. Year 1 as a starter and he'd be on an innings limit and he probably wouldn't provide that much value over being a reliever that year. That really only leaves 2 years of him being a starter. His injury risk is increased with him becoming a starter for those two years as well.

 

If he'd sign an extension I'd consider making him a starter again.

[G-Snarls]

Osuna never pitched more than 42 innings in any season in the minors (he did have TJS of course) or more than 74 in the majors

[metafour]

Osuna is a serious injury risk.

 

This isn't brought up often because most relevant pitchers don't have TJ surgery at such a young age; but the estimated life-span of a TJ repaired elbow is ~10 years before the risk of needing a second procedure dramatically increases. Because Osuna was only 18 when he had his TJ surgery, this means that he could blow his elbow out again in his ~late 20's, if not sooner.

 

The whole "he has lots of pitches" thing doesn't really matter if he completely falls apart physically while trying to pitch drastically increased innings, which he has NEVER done BTW.

[metafour]

I generally agree with leaving him in the pen but at this point he might actually be the best SP prospect in baseball. Could he even be generational? I think there comes a point where you you have to re-evaluate exactly what you have here. He adds a plus pitch every year and it looks like he's toying with hitters in low leverage situations this year.

 

Would anyone take Reyes or Kopech or Glasnow (barf) over him as a SP? Maybe Reyes.

 

Again, this has nothing to do with how many pitches he has and everything to do with whether he can even physically pitch a starter's workload. Why is this in question?

 

-Blew his elbow out at 18 throwing what was essentially kiddie-level innings (~40).

-Never pitched anything near a starter's workload, or even close to it....ie: his body now has 4-5 years of adapting to a reliever's workload.

-Questions arose over his mechanics potentially pushing him into the bullpen even before we rushed him up as a reliever, this also correlates with the fact that he couldn't even stay healthy back when we were babying him with that ~3 IP split-starter workload that we had Sanchez and Syndergaard on as well.

[LGBJ29]

I generally agree with leaving him in the pen but at this point he might actually be the best SP prospect in baseball. Could he even be generational? I think there comes a point where you you have to re-evaluate exactly what you have here. He adds a plus pitch every year and it looks like he's toying with hitters in low leverage situations this year.

 

Would anyone take Reyes or Kopech or Glasnow (barf) over him as a SP? Maybe Reyes.

 

You cant really give him that label when he hasnt started a game in years. His arm really seems like a ticking time bomb. Already one TJS and we started to see issues in the WC game after 74 IP last season

[glory]

Yeah, Osuna's arm would explode with a starter's workload. Just enjoy him for this year and another 3 years (assuming they don't trade him).

[Brownie19]

what kind of package could we get for him?

[Pendleton]

what kind of package could we get for him?

 

Assuming the Nats would be a prime suitor, they'd have to start with one of their highly intriguing bats (Robles or Soto) and add from there. I'm pretty confident Osuna would land us a top prospect and more if he was made available.

[Maine Jays]

Assuming the Nats would be a prime suitor, they'd have to start with one of their highly intriguing bats (Robles or Soto) and add from there. I'm pretty confident Osuna would land us a top prospect and more if he was made available.

 

Robles? Get Rizzo on the phone. Now.

[Angrioter]

Robles? Get Rizzo on the phone. Now.

 

Best OF prospect 2017 - Victor Robles

[G-Snarls]

Robles? Get Rizzo on the phone. Now.

 

He won't trade him

 

Need him to replace Harper in 2 years

[G-Snarls]

f*** though

 

Robles

Guerrero Jr

Tellez

 

Nice cheap core for 2019 and beyond

 

JS

[Brownie19]

Robles & Joe Ross

 

Make it happen!

[G-Snarls]

Robles & Joe Ross

 

Make it happen!

 

Then trade Donaldson for a package including another blue Chip prospect

 

Keep Stroman and Sanchez

[G-Snarls]

Best OF prospect 2017 - Victor Robles

 

Yeah Benitendi has graduated now yes?

[THANOS]

f*** though

 

Robles

Guerrero Jr

Tellez

 

Nice cheap core for 2019 and beyond

 

JS

 

You forgot Bo Bichette

[Spanky99]

Some very intriguing quotes from Ross Atkins... read the article for context, a good piece by Davidi.

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/blue-jays-still-position-earn-good-grade-big-test-looming/

 

“No question, I think we’ll have a pretty good idea in two weeks of where things stand,” general manager Ross Atkins said in an interview before the game. “That might not be the case, but it feels as though some things are going to crystalize in the coming weeks, and certainly beyond that stretch, we’ll have a real good feel for how strong this team is.”

 

“The way we’ve been thinking about it is because of how we played at the start of the season, we had to play exceptionally well in May to crawl out of it, but we really can’t be a .500 team moving forward, we have to be better than that, and we’ve been slightly below a .500 team in June,” said Atkins. “That’s not going to be good enough, so as we look to areas or opportunities to where we could improve, it’s really a collective.

 

“There are times when our offence is going to pick us up, and there are going to be times where the bullpen picks us up and times where the starting pitching is the reason we win,” he continued. “But for us to be a championship team, we’re going to need all three of those things to be clicking.”

 

As for Biagini...

 

“It could be as simple as he goes to the bullpen, but we have to think about the fact that he is starting depth, not only for this year, but for the years to come and what’s best for his career, which ultimately translates into what’s best for this organization,” said Atkins. “I hope we have that problem, that we have six healthy starters pitching well.”