The Jose Bautista Thread

[burlingtonbandit]

So is any other source even hinting at this being true?

 

That same source said something along the lines of Edwin at 3/63 by the Indians and Passan reported no team has offered 3/60 for Edwin so I think that tells you what you need to know.

[Brownie19]

No idea. Someone should report him.

 

It must be a 'Murica thing.

[Brownie19]

This is the most misleading thread title I've ever read BTW.

[burlingtonbandit]

So you're telling me in 2010, when his DEF value was -12.8 and in 2015 when his DEF value was -18.9 that he was better than he was last year when his DEF value was -12.4?

 

I'm telling you to scroll down and actually look at his defensive numbers and not the column beside WAR.

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

Not me!! I would love to have him back. He will bounce back huge. This guy is our swagger

 

Swaggerville is overrated and dead, King can confirm this! Winterpeg Knows.

[Governator]

This is the most misleading thread title I've ever read BTW.

 

 

It was from the rumour this morning: http://www.bluejaysmessageboard.com/threads/7066-Rumoured-3-Year-50MM-Deal-In-Place-Between-Jose-Bautista-and-Toronto-Blue-Jays?p=1096032&viewfull=1#post1096032

 

 

I've changed it.

[Brownie19]

I'm telling you to scroll down and actually look at his defensive numbers and not the column beside WAR.

 

That doesn't answer my question.

 

However, the advanced stats suggest he also sucked defensively in 2010 and 2011

 

http://i.imgur.com/NhARAQK.jpg

[Governator]

That doesn't answer my question.

 

However, the advanced stats suggest he also sucked defensively in 2010 and 2011

 

http://i.imgur.com/NhARAQK.jpg

 

 

What does it matter? He accumulated 14.5 WAR...

[Brownie19]

What does it matter? He accumulated 14.5 WAR...

 

Gov - that was the whole point. Jose's phenomenal offense in 2010 and 2011 masked his poor defense...

 

 

F - nevermind - I'll move on.

[intrigid]

So I guess we can safely declare this rumor dead? It doesn't take all day to announce a signing.

[HERPDERP]

we trusted you ang!

[Terminator]

Gov - that was the whole point. Jose's phenomenal offense in 2010 and 2011 masked his poor defense...

 

 

F - nevermind - I'll move on.

 

We are all trying to tell you this but you aren't understanding it. It's ok, I didn't get it until yesterday either so maybe I can help explain.

 

But just ignore that stupid "DEF" column next to a player's WAR. They put these positional factors in there that make that number worthless. For example, Mitch Moreland is one of the better 1B in the game, and if you scroll down and look at DRS and UZR/150 like we are all telling you to do you will see that. But if you look at his Def column he looks like has always sucked because his Def # is always negative. They downgrade his Def # because he plays 1B and they've done it to the point that even the best 1B get negative numbers.

 

It's better to look at DRS and UZR/150. In 2010, Jose was worth -1 run in the OF according to DRS so he was basically average. In 2011, he was -4 runs, so slighty below average. In '12 and '13 he was actually plus 6 both years. Last year he was -8. That's pretty bad, especially in what ended up not being a full season. It's probably still playable if he hits but it's bad.

 

The point is, Jose Bautista hasn't really been a bad defensive player. Never a great one, but he's only been bad since he was old. So you're theory that no one cared about his defense in 2010 and 2011 when he could hit is just wrong on its face because he wasn't bad at defense then.

 

NOW QUIT LOOKING AT THE DEF COLUMN IN FANGRAPHS

[UWHabs]

We are all trying to tell you this but you aren't understanding it. It's ok, I didn't get it until yesterday either so maybe I can help explain.

 

But just ignore that stupid "DEF" column next to a player's WAR. They put these positional factors in there that make that number worthless. For example, Mitch Moreland is one of the better 1B in the game, and if you scroll down and look at DRS and UZR/150 like we are all telling you to do you will see that. But if you look at his Def column he looks like has always sucked because his Def # is always negative. They downgrade his Def # because he plays 1B and they've done it to the point that even the best 1B get negative numbers.

 

It's better to look at DRS and UZR/150. In 2010, Jose was worth -1 run in the OF according to DRS so he was basically average. In 2011, he was -4 runs, so slighty below average. In '12 and '13 he was actually plus 6 both years. Last year he was -8. That's pretty bad, especially in what ended up not being a full season. It's probably still playable if he hits but it's bad.

 

The point is, Jose Bautista hasn't really been a bad defensive player. Never a great one, but he's only been bad since he was old. So you're theory that no one cared about his defense in 2010 and 2011 when he could hit is just wrong on its face because he wasn't bad at defense then.

 

NOW QUIT LOOKING AT THE DEF COLUMN IN FANGRAPHS

 

The key point is that he's been a bad defensive player in both 2015 and 2016, and he's not going to get better. He was bad in 2010-2011 as well, but as mentioned, nobody cared when he could hit the snot out of the ball. He turned it around and was above average 2012-2014, but since then, he's been really bad. And he's not going to get any better. He still should be good enough offensively that we can live with it, but it definitely costs him value overall.

[TwistedLogic]

Duquette actually admitted telling Bautista's agent that they aren't interested because the fans hate him, lmao.

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/duquette-orioles-fans-hate-bautista/

 

Blair: "The story is out there that the Orioles told Jose's people, 'We're not interested in signing you because our fans hate you.'"

 

Duquette: *laughing* "I told the agent, I said 'We're not interested. Our fans do not like your player.'"

 

Blair: You said that, really?!

 

Wilner: You said that?!

 

Duquette: "I told the agent that, yeah."

 

Wilner: "Wow!"

 

Blair: "Okay. Marks for honesty."

 

Wilner: "Yeah we appreciate the forthrightness, I actually wasn't expect that answer."

 

Duquette: *laughing* "The agent told you that, huh?"

 

Blair: "Well, the agent told somebody that because it was all over twitter."

 

Duquette: "Our fans do not like Jose Bautista. And rightly so, right? I mean, he's one of the rivals in our division... Now that may change if the market comes down a little..." *laughing*

 

Blair: "I was gonna say, there's a price tag in hatred. It's like anything else."

 

Duquette: *laughing* "We could always reconsider. He's got a qualifying offer also out there. I think that has some impact with clubs when they take a look at putting their team together. You know, you have to give up that first round draft pick. And this is the last year where you can get that first round pick. After that of course, the compensation is dilluted, so you're not going to have as attractive a complement when a player who has a qualifying offer signs with another club."

 

The Orioles are such a f***ing moronic organization. Why would you burn bridges with any free agent, let alone a good one that is actively negotiating with one of your division rivals?

[burlingtonbandit]

We wanted to hire this man Duquette.

 

Rogers one of the worst owners in baseball. Just be thankful they lucked themselves into Shapiro.

[Krylian]

Duquette actually admitted telling Bautista's agent that they aren't interested because the fans hate him, lmao.

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/duquette-orioles-fans-hate-bautista/

 

 

 

The Orioles are such a f***ing moronic organization. Why would you burn bridges with any free agent, let alone a good one that is actively negotiating with one of your division rivals?

 

Reminds of when JPR said Adam Dunn doesn't like baseball.

[baseballsss]

Duquette: *laughing* "We could always reconsider. He's got a qualifying offer also out there. I think that has some impact with clubs when they take a look at putting their team together. You know, you have to give up that first round draft pick. And this is the last year where you can get that first round pick. After that of course, the compensation is dilluted, so you're not going to have as attractive a complement when a player who has a qualifying offer signs with another club."

 

 

Wait he said it was the last year that you can get that pick? What's he talking about?

[Krylian]

Duquette: *laughing* "We could always reconsider. He's got a qualifying offer also out there. I think that has some impact with clubs when they take a look at putting their team together. You know, you have to give up that first round draft pick. And this is the last year where you can get that first round pick. After that of course, the compensation is dilluted, so you're not going to have as attractive a complement when a player who has a qualifying offer signs with another club."

 

 

Wait he said it was the last year that you can get that pick? What's he talking about?

 

He's taking about the new collective agreement that's been discussed at length here.

[baseballsss]

He's taking about the new collective agreement that's been discussed at length here.

 

I'm well aware they are talking about the CBA but a few days ago I was told that we won't be getting the teams actual pick but a pick in the supplemental round and that team would just lose their pick.

 

DD is saying that we would get the orioles pick assuming JB signs with them?

[Spanky99]

I knew his arm was never the same since the injury... but hadn't realized it was that bad.

 

 

English...

 

Roosevelt Comarazamy ‏@fanquinco 50m50 minutes ago

Jose Bautista's arm has lost its old power with a speed of 84.4 mph according Statcast is among the worst in MLB

[ChrisS]

I'm well aware they are talking about the CBA but a few days ago I was told that we won't be getting the teams actual pick but a pick in the supplemental round and that team would just lose their pick.

 

DD is saying that we would get the orioles pick assuming JB signs with them?

 

We would still get the pick this year but no first round picks are attached to a qualifying offer with the new CBA (2017 onwards)

[Spanky99]

I'm well aware they are talking about the CBA but a few days ago I was told that we won't be getting the teams actual pick but a pick in the supplemental round and that team would just lose their pick.

 

DD is saying that we would get the orioles pick assuming JB signs with them?

 

Baltimore loses their 1st round pick and we gain a 1st round supplement compensatory pick. That's what he's talking about.

[Governator]

lol

 

Bowden: Bautista will go back to Toronto with his "tail between his legs"

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/video/bowden-bautista-will-go-back-to-toronto-with-his-tail-between-his-legs~1011273

[fatcowxlive]

I knew his arm was never the same since the injury... but hadn't realized it was that bad.

 

 

English...

 

Roosevelt Comarazamy ‏@fanquinco 50m50 minutes ago

Jose Bautista's arm has lost its old power with a speed of 84.4 mph according Statcast is among the worst in MLB

 

holy f***. Thats so sad and crazy

[glory]

Rogers one of the worst owners in baseball. Just be thankful they lucked themselves into Shapiro.

 

From my recollection, Rogers asked a Yankees executive for advise on who to hire, and the Yankees guy gave the names of Duquette and Kenny Williams. Then Rogers tampered when trying to talk to both of them. In other words, the Yankees guy suggested two terrible names, Rogers took it seriously, and illegally tried to make a deal with them.

 

Lucked into Shapiro would be understatement. It was a gift from the Heavens.

[Governator]

holy f***. Thats so sad and crazy

 

Can't be surprising he throws 60% of the balls gimped.

[bones10]

lol

 

Bowden: Bautista will go back to Toronto with his "tail between his legs"

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/video/bowden-bautista-will-go-back-to-toronto-with-his-tail-between-his-legs~1011273

 

Bautista really shot himself in the foot over the last two years, I wonder if retirement is on his mind.

[Spanky99]

Bautista really shot himself in the foot over the last two years, I wonder if retirement is on his mind.

 

lol... C'mon man...

[Orgfiller]

Bautista really shot himself in the foot over the last two years, I wonder if retirement is on his mind.

 

Why would he retire? He could get comfortably above $15M for next season, and more if he bounces back strong.

[Jonn]

I knew his arm was never the same since the injury... but hadn't realized it was that bad.

 

 

English...

 

Roosevelt Comarazamy ‏@fanquinco 50m50 minutes ago

Jose Bautista's arm has lost its old power with a speed of 84.4 mph according Statcast is among the worst in MLB

 

Sportsnet literally had a commercial about his arm last spring saying he was working on his velocity in the off-season lol. Honestly though I feel bad for Jose.