Offseason Roster Thread 2016-17

[BTS]

Maybe Tulo could recruit him to sign with Toronto.

 

That would be awesome. On the surface, the team seems to have a lot to offer him:

 

- he knows Tulo pretty well

- DH should extend his career

- we have no 1B, so he could easily start there a couple times a week if he wants

- good lineup featuring JD

- consecutive ALCS appearances

[Terminator]

It turns out that the Cubs should have just walked away. The player option is a no-win deal for the team. If the player's value meets or exceeds his pay, he opts out, and if it doesn't, he stays. Guaranteed contracts already put all the risk on the team, and player opt outs eliminate a large amount of the potential reward.

 

I agree with what you are saying but the Cubs probably would have still done the deal they just would have paid him more and would be on the line for more guaranteed money IMO. Giving him player options shaves a few million of you would have to assume. If he would have had two good years and then opted out and then he sucked it would have worked out fantastic for them.

[Pendleton]

Dexter Fowler RF + Matt Holiday DH would be great replacements for Joey Bats and Edwin.

 

If we can adequately replace those two while adding draft picks in the process, it could turn out to be a major win.

[metafour]

Yeah of course, I don't expect the Shapiro management to be paying players on past performances but for future performances. Whatever they come up with as "fair", taking into account projecting his future seasons based upon this season. Thats how it should be explained to Bautista, "This deal is based on what we think you can do based on the last couple of years, but if you bounce back next year then you can opt-out and we can renegotiate new deal/hit the open market". Worked for Cespedes

 

Nobody is paying 37 year old Jose Bautista a long term contract. It worked for Cespedes because he wasn't 36+ years old. David Ortiz, Adrian Beltre...these guys have all been playing on 1-2 years deals. Its not like Bautista is going to opt out and then get 4 years from someone.

[z3r0s]

I don't see player options as dumb by definition. You just need to know what you are getting yourself into.

 

The Cespedes deal is a good example.

 

Cespedes had the options too;

a) sign a 1 year deal somewhere for max money

sign a 1 year deal with some protection against injury (3 year deal with a player option). This is essentially what he did with the Mets.

c) sign a multi-year deal that would likely come at a lower AVV.

 

I assume he could get the most cash with option A. He selected option B because it offered him some value in the security of an option.

The Mets didn't sign that deal under the impression it was a 3 year deal. It was a 1 year deal with some risk attached to it (in the form of a diminished player at X dollars)

[Jonn]

How exactly does one utilize Matt Holliday improperly? He has near identical splits against both LHP and RHP. Just don't ever let him play the outfield and limit his time on the field altogether and he can be a great piece as long as he remains relatively healthy, which has been a problem for him for a couple of years now.

 

Have to keep in mind he can't run at all. They said they wanted to address team speed. We could probably get a good year out of his bat. His avg exit velocity was 95.26 which is well above average. Just not sure they will go in that direction.

[jays4life19]

If we can adequately replace those two while adding draft picks in the process, it could turn out to be a major win.

 

Yeah, although it would only be one net draft pick as Fowler is going to get a QO from the Cubs.

[Jonn]

Dexter Fowler RF + Matt Holiday DH would be great replacements for Joey Bats and Edwin.

 

They aren't going to sign Fowler. Draft pick compensation attached to him. I see no reason why the Cubs wouldn't try to resign him and he will definitely pick a team willing to play him in CF. I would prefer to see him in a corner.

[jays_fever]

Maybe Tulo could recruit him to sign with Toronto.

 

That would be awesome. On the surface, the team seems to have a lot to offer him:

 

- he knows Tulo pretty well

- DH should extend his career

- we have no 1B, so he could easily start there a couple times a week if he wants

- good lineup featuring JD

- consecutive ALCS appearances

 

Plus Toronto is a f***ing awesome place to live in the SUMMER.

[jays4life19]

They aren't going to sign Fowler. Draft pick compensation attached to him. I see no reason why the Cubs wouldn't try to resign him and he will definitely pick a team willing to play him in CF. I would prefer to see him in a corner.

 

I don't really see why he would need to play CF. He's not a great defender at CF, and it's his last shot at a big contract. After taking a pillow contract with the Cubs I think he looks to cash in on a multi year deal.

 

With us getting two picks from Edwin + Jose we can afford to lose 1 to get a guy like Fowler.

[Jonn]

I don't really see why he would need to play CF. He's not a great defender at CF, and it's his last shot at a big contract. After taking a pillow contract with the Cubs I think he looks to cash in on a multi year deal.

 

With us getting two picks from Edwin + Jose we can afford to lose 1 to get a guy like Fowler.

 

No he isn't a great CF but he wants to play CF. If the money is equal and it probably will be. Teams will allow him to play CF his preference. Once again Cubs want to bring him back and hes at the top of the OF market. We would need to overpay. Doesn't seem likely. He's a nice player but other options exist that make more sense.

[polar bear]

I wonder, why hasn't anyone talked about the possibility of offering Bautista a Cespedes-type deal. Not the same $$ amounts, but a 3 (maybe 4) year deal with an opt out after the first year. If he rebounds and wants to test the FA market then he can do so after the first year. Only if he's back as a 1B/DH, I think the injuries really messed him up at the plate.

 

I don't think too many people want him back,spent force Id say.Let him walk,we could do a lot

with $17.mil.

[jays4life19]

No he isn't a great CF but he wants to play CF. If the money is equal and it probably will be. Teams will allow him to play CF his preference. Once again Cubs want to bring him back and hes at the top of the OF market. We would need to overpay. Doesn't seem likely. He's a nice player but other options exist that make more sense.

 

Has he actually said that or are you just talking out of your ass? I can see why wanting to play CF on a one year contract would have it's appeal to increase your value. He's going to get 4 years though, so it's pretty much his last significant deal. I don't see why playing RF or CF would move the needle much. He will take the most money.

[fatcowxlive]

It turns out that the Cubs should have just walked away. The player option is a no-win deal for the team. If the player's value meets or exceeds his pay, he opts out, and if it doesn't, he stays. Guaranteed contracts already put all the risk on the team, and player opt outs eliminate a large amount of the potential reward.

 

I get that completely, but lets say there's a 3 year deal that Shapiro thinks is good for both teams (I don't think there is, but for the sake of argument lets say there is), and the player you are approaching has an ego and thinks that he can improve himself next year, wouldn't the 3 year + year one opt-out look like either: Bautista accepted the QO (one year deal) or he signed a 3 year deal with the team (if he doesn't opt out).

 

That's IF of course, Shapiro wants Bautista for that long. I personally think that Shapiro won't offer more than a QO (if that)

[Jonn]

Has he actually said that or are you just talking out of your ass? I can see why wanting to play CF on a one year contract would have it's appeal to increase your value. He's going to get 4 years though, so it's pretty much his last significant deal. I don't see why playing RF or CF would move the needle much. He will take the most money.

 

No I'm not talking out my ass both he and his agent said his preference is to remain in CF. That went into his decision to sign with Baltimore than change his mind. He took a chance on himself but he also got to play with a better team and CF for the best team in Baseball.

 

I agree I think he will take the most money as well. I doubt the Blue Jays will offer him the most money. He might get upwards to 4 years 90M.

[BTS]

I get that completely, but lets say there's a 3 year deal that Shapiro thinks is good for both teams (I don't think there is, but for the sake of argument lets say there is), and the player you are approaching has an ego and thinks that he can improve himself next year, wouldn't the 3 year + year one opt-out look like either: Bautista accepted the QO (one year deal) or he signed a 3 year deal with the team (if he doesn't opt out).

 

That's IF of course, Shapiro wants Bautista for that long. I personally think that Shapiro won't offer more than a QO (if that)

 

Both of those (Bautista accepts QO, or Bautista signs straight 3-year deal) are just far preferable to the team than Bautista signing a 3-year deal with an opt-out after year one. I have no problem with the team walking away from the latter deal to help cement the idea that the Blue Jays don't mess around with player options, so if you're talking to them don't even bother.

[fatcowxlive]

Both of those (Bautista accepts QO, or Bautista signs straight 3-year deal) are just far preferable to the team than Bautista signing a 3-year deal with an opt-out after year one. I have no problem with the team walking away from the latter deal to help cement the idea that the Blue Jays don't mess around with player options, so if you're talking to them don't even bother.

 

Ah I see, well said

[glory]

Isn't Donaldson friends with Reddick?

 

Get Reddick to play RF, Holliday to DH, enjoy the two picks from JB/EE.

[Terminator]

I wonder if there is any chance that Bautista would take the QO.

[Governator]

I wonder if there is any chance that Bautista would take the QO.

 

I really think he's walking but I'm fine either way.

[glory]

I wonder if there is any chance that Bautista would take the QO.

 

With his ego, no.

 

I could see him coming back if his market is dry, but not by accepting the QO.

[RealAccountant]

Cecil was worth 3 wins the past 3 years. He missed time due to injury this year but was back looking very good the past couple months. I'm not sure you would look at just this year? Cecil will average more than a win a year the next 3

 

So basically best case scenario he lives up to his contract

 

Everything else and it's a bad deal

[Daniel Labude]

Isn't Donaldson friends with Reddick?

 

Get Reddick to play RF, Holliday to DH, enjoy the two picks from JB/EE.

 

1B?

[Spanky99]

1B?

 

Yup, he'd play 1st.

[intentional wok]

Someone justify Holliday to me. Was he mostly just hurt last year? Because the overall numbers look like age has its big foot in his front door. He'll be 37 entering play next year.

[BTS]

Someone justify Holliday to me. Was he mostly just hurt last year? Because the overall numbers look like age has its big foot in his front door.

 

His walk rate dropped, but his K-rate didn't increase. No decline at all in PD stats (O-swing, Z-contact, O-contact, swinging strike % were all fine). 4th-highest hard-hit % of career. FB% above his career average. 5th highest average exit velocity in baseball.

 

His BABIP was 80 points below his career average, and 45 points below his previous career low, and everything in his contact profile suggests that this was just bad luck. And he still had a 109 wRC+.

 

Hitting in a hitters park, and staying healthy by playing DH, it's not unreasonable at all to think he could pop 25+ homers and put up a 125 wRC+.

[Spanky99]

Some Shi Davidi content on the winter...

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/blue-jays-winter-primer-what-comes-next-after-a-solid-run/

[BTS]

God do I ever want them to sign Holliday.

[THANOS]

I read the Thames article on Fangraphs. Don't know what to expect out of him, but on a cheap one year deal, and in a platoon with someone, he might be an interesting target. Just don't let him play the outfield.

 

Pearce fits this roster like a glove. He fills more than one need (positional flexibility, hits LHP). Needs to happen.

 

Re-sign:

- Edwin

- Cecil

- Benoit

 

Sign:

- Reddick

- Thames

- Pearce

- buy low relievers

 

Off-season complete.

[Terminator]

God do I ever want them to sign Holliday.

 

You've sold me on Holliday. How much better is he than simply resigning Bautista though? I guess it all depends on cost and the potential to get a draft pick from losing Bautista.