Revere to the Nats in 3...2...1

[Abomination]

Question for the board:

 

If the Storen-Revere swap had been done earlier in the offseason, would you still do the Chavez-Hendriks move? I know some don't like that move anyway, but I'm interested to hear from the ones that do.

 

Having Hendriks would allow Sanchez and Osuna that much more leniency in stretching out in AAA. Big league SP depth would take a hit to start the season (or would it, with guys like Hernandez on MiL deals?).

 

Basically, would you still make the Hendriks trade today even if you liked it in November?

 

With the stuff Sanchez and Osuna have, I don't think it makes much sense to stretch them out in AAA regardless. If you want to manage their innings at the big league level, then one starts for half the year and the other relieves, then they swap or something. Assuming you make the playoffs, you can move them both back into the pen for October.

[RealAccountant]

Sanchez was horrible starting. Why have people forgotten that. A secondary pitch is not going to change his lack of control.

 

I'd see if Osuna can make the transaction back though

[THANOS]

100-120 innings from Osuna in the pen, then a starter in 2017.

 

http://www.bluejaysplus.com/the-hidden-benefit-of-acquiring-drew-storen/

 

If they could guarantee him that many innings, I would be game for this. That way he stays in our BP but will be ready to start in 2017.

[KingKat]

Question for the board:

 

If the Storen-Revere swap had been done earlier in the offseason, would you still do the Chavez-Hendriks move? I know some don't like that move anyway, but I'm interested to hear from the ones that do.

 

Having Hendriks would allow Sanchez and Osuna that much more leniency in stretching out in AAA. Big league SP depth would take a hit to start the season (or would it, with guys like Hernandez on MiL deals?).

 

Basically, would you still make the Hendriks trade today even if you liked it in November?

 

This makes me like the Chavez deal more not less. I like Hendriks but I like Storen more and he was obtained without increasing the overall payroll and though it's true that Revere could have been useful, the SP depth Chavez provides is probably more useful. I'm happy with the end result.

[Brownie19]

This makes me like the Chavez deal more not less. I like Hendriks but I like Storen more and he was obtained without increasing the overall payroll and though it's true that Revere could have been useful, the SP depth Chavez provides is probably more useful. I'm happy with the end result.

 

You can look at it this way....who's more valuable to the current team....Revere in LF (with Pompey/Saunders on the bench), or Chavez providing SP depth...

 

I'd rather have the SP depth personally. Storen replaces Hendrix

[Governator]

Storen replaces Hendrix

 

http://assets.rollingstone.com/assets/images/story/jimi-hendrixs-early-recordings-as-a-sideman-to-get-proper-release-20140717/20140717-jimihendrix-x306-1405632285.jpg

[intentional wok]

Excuse me while I kiss this guy.

[nmrch]

Question for the board:

 

If the Storen-Revere swap had been done earlier in the offseason, would you still do the Chavez-Hendriks move? I know some don't like that move anyway, but I'm interested to hear from the ones that do.

 

Having Hendriks would allow Sanchez and Osuna that much more leniency in stretching out in AAA. Big league SP depth would take a hit to start the season (or would it, with guys like Hernandez on MiL deals?).

 

Basically, would you still make the Hendriks trade today even if you liked it in November?

 

Hendricks is a better asset to have then Chavez, i hated that deal the day it was made and still do.

 

Just watch what Beane will get for Hendricks in a year or two(with 30 saves or holds under his belt), i would be shocked if he doesn't get two times as what we got for him.

[TilsonBritoFan]

I have no words

 

I truly wish you had no words. This place would be better for it.

[Ehjays]

I truly wish you had no words. This place would be better for it.

 

Oh yes, that was beautiful!!

[Spanky99]

100-120 innings from Osuna in the pen, then a starter in 2017.

 

http://www.bluejaysplus.com/the-hidden-benefit-of-acquiring-drew-storen/

 

I was hoping they were going to do this last season, but he was put into the closer role, and the rest is history.

[Spanky99]

I have no words

 

Everything he said was correct? There might be "some" decline, which he noted.

[HERPDERP]

100-120 innings so you want a lot of 2 inning appearances or a ton of 1 inning appearances? That's a lot of mileage for a guy only, what, 2-3 years removed from TJ?

[Spanky99]

100-120 innings so you want a lot of 2 inning appearances or a ton of 1 inning appearances? That's a lot of mileage for a guy only, what, 2-3 years removed from TJ?

 

No it isn't.

[burlingtonbandit]

Pretty sure the Jays got rid of the whole "inning limits" and evaluating a workload by that. Instead they are going to look at the player's individual health throughout the season and if he needs a break whether it be a skipped start or a few days off in the pen they will do that.

 

Personally, I think this is the way to go. Blanket statements like this player shouldn't increase his innings pitched by "x" amount doesn't make much sense when there is so much better information you can evaluate a player's health by.

[THANOS]

100-120 innings so you want a lot of 2 inning appearances or a ton of 1 inning appearances? That's a lot of mileage for a guy only, what, 2-3 years removed from TJ?

 

It's a reasonable jump, nothing too crazy. He threw 77 innings last season, including the post-season, so a jump of 20-40 innings isn't all that bad.

[THANOS]

Pretty sure the Jays got rid of the whole "inning limits" and evaluating a workload by that. Instead they are going to look at the player's individual health throughout the season and if he needs a break whether it be a skipped start or a few days off in the pen they will do that.

 

Personally, I think this is the way to go. Blanket statements like this player shouldn't increase his innings pitched by "x" amount doesn't make much sense when there is so much better information you can evaluate a player's health by.

 

Yeah, you're right, but that was under Alex, who knows how Shapiro and Atkins feel about it.

[Cyris]

No it isn't.

 

It's a reasonable jump, nothing too crazy. He threw 77 innings last season, including the post-season, so a jump of 20-40 innings isn't all that bad.

 

Dellin Betances led all relievers with 84 innings pitched last season.

 

100 - 120 innings in relief is way too much for any pitcher before even considering he is a young player with a past TJ surgery.

 

Its an idiotic idea.

[Jonn]

Dellin Betances led all relievers with 84 innings pitched last season.

 

100 - 120 innings in relief is way too much for any pitcher before even considering he is a young player with a past TJ surgery.

 

Its an idiotic idea.

 

He wouldn't be used like Betances though. That's what he's suggesting. Betances was used whenever the hell Giradi got scared than some. Osuna's outings would be more controlled.

[Spanky99]

People are just thinking themselves into the ground in regards to Osuna when the solution is so f***ing simple. The guy is not a young Mariano Rivera. He had a good year as a reliever. He had a 3.00 FIP. Steamer projects him for a 3.44 FIP, ZIPS projects 3.22.

 

In the 2nd half last year his FIP was 3.84. Osuna was great but he's not so irreplaceable that we have to sacrifice his future to keep him in the pen.

 

A guy like Blanton had better numbers last year and projects to have better numbers this year. All you do is sign Blanton and let him set up with Cecil. You let Osuna start regularly in AA or AAA. He gets his innings like every other SP prospect would get their innings. And when he comes back up in July you have a top 5 bullpen, a stretched out Osuna for next year and you win the World Series!

 

Would be ideal.

[Spanky99]

Dellin Betances led all relievers with 84 innings pitched last season.

 

100 - 120 innings in relief is way too much for any pitcher before even considering he is a young player with a past TJ surgery.

 

Its an idiotic idea.

 

It's not so much about innings, than appearances, hardly idiotic.

[THANOS]

People are just thinking themselves into the ground in regards to Osuna when the solution is so f***ing simple. The guy is not a young Mariano Rivera. He had a good year as a reliever. He had a 3.00 FIP. Steamer projects him for a 3.44 FIP, ZIPS projects 3.22.

 

In the 2nd half last year his FIP was 3.84. Osuna was great but he's not so irreplaceable that we have to sacrifice his future to keep him in the pen.

 

A guy like Blanton had better numbers last year and projects to have better numbers this year. All you do is sign Blanton and let him set up with Cecil. You let Osuna start regularly in AA or AAA. He gets his innings like every other SP prospect would get their innings. And when he comes back up in July you have a top 5 bullpen, a stretched out Osuna for next year and you win the World Series!

 

I would love this, and it makes perfect sense. If they want to save money as well, they could go after Carter Capps to take that role. I'm not sure what it would take, but it might not be as crazy an ask as one would expect, given he has never been used as a closer.

 

That said, I have my doubts that Osuna will be used the logical way we hope for, because of "win now" mode.

[burlingtonbandit]

Yeah, you're right, but that was under Alex, who knows how Shapiro and Atkins feel about it.

 

Based on everything I've seen/read about them it leads me to believe they would evaluate it the same way. They are in favour of every player having an individual strength/conditioning program for each player so chances are they would evaluate health in the same way.

 

It makes no sense to have an arbitrary innings limit for all pitchers.

[THANOS]

Based on everything I've seen/read about them it leads me to believe they would evaluate it the same way. They are in favour of every player having an individual strength/conditioning program for each player so chances are they would evaluate health in the same way.

 

It makes no sense to have an arbitrary innings limit for all pitchers.

 

I agree with you, hopefully you're right. Stroman and Sanchez, doing those crazy, two-per-day, workouts, 5 times a week this off-season, tells me that they could potentially be just as durable as a pitcher who threw 180 IP this past season.

[Abomination]

I agree with you, hopefully you're right. Stroman and Sanchez, doing those crazy, two-per-day, workouts, 5 times a week this off-season, tells me that they could potentially be just as durable as a pitcher who threw 180 IP this past season.

 

Hopefully they don't overdo it and pull a League.

[KingKat]

Hopefully they don't overdo it and pull a League.

 

Just realized that I hadn't thought about Brandon League in a LONG time.

[GD]

I agree with you, hopefully you're right. Stroman and Sanchez, doing those crazy, two-per-day, workouts, 5 times a week this off-season, tells me that they could potentially be just as durable as a pitcher who threw 180 IP this past season.

 

i might say the opposite is true

[burlingtonbandit]

i might say the opposite is true

 

They're using catapult and other data fitting devices to make sure they aren't being overworked if that is what you are thinking.

[crazy47larry]

Hendricks is a better asset to have then Chavez, i hated that deal the day it was made and still do.

 

Just watch what Beane will get for Hendricks in a year or two(with 30 saves or holds under his belt), i would be shocked if he doesn't get two times as what we got for him.

 

i wouldnt be shocked if the trade blows up in billy beane's face like every other deal he does nowadays. off the top of my head the only move i can think of that didnt absolutely suck balls was the one where he got billy burns.

[Grant77]

i wouldnt be shocked if the trade blows up in billy beane's face like every other deal he does nowadays. off the top of my head the only move i can think of that didnt absolutely suck balls was the one where he got billy burns.

 

He did pretty well in the 2 Zobrist deals if you ask me.