Brownie19

I wouldn't conclude that at all. Vlad's always done his own thing. When he struggles, the Jays fly in his relatives to work with him because those are the only people he "trusts". This has been on-going for years, which was quite frustrating when he was a 118 wRC+ ground ball hitter who was pushing his hands forward. I actually think there's a possibility that Vlad finally gave up on using that approach and is finally listening to the professional hitting coaches on the team... Castro Bros did a good breakdown of the adjustments he's made - Castro Bros (@castro_bros) • Instagram reel WWW.INSTAGRAM.COM 3,903 likes, 45 comments - castro_bros on July 6, 2024: "He is in better situation with the hands now 🫡🔥 #softball #softballlife #softballdrills #softballstrong #fastpitch #softballlove #softballsisters #miami #florida #fastpitchsoftball #fastpitchlife #baseballmom #baseballlife #baseballisback #baseballseason #baseballboys #baseballplays #baseballlove #baseballfan #hitting #hittingdrills #hittingpost #hittingcoach #hittingmechanics #hittingbombs #hittinggoals #hittinginstructor #texasbaseball #californiabaseball".

Maybe it's the angle, but it looks like the balls come out of his hand weird. He lands quite open too.

I would agree with this. Even Dave Stewart would look at this O's roster and think "we should move Mullins and Mountcastle - they suck and are getting expensive. We should try and get a couple lottery tickets for them now instead of non-tendering them this offseason". Does the FO deserve credit for being in the position where they can afford to move these guys now? Yes - yes, they do. Their drafting and development has been amazing lately.

I'm just saying there are legit arguments that he isn't the guy to build around or give that money to. Even teams with big payrolls will feel the pain of an underachieving anchor. We paid Springer $25M because he was a 6 WAR star player and he was a great fit to add amongst our young nucleus. I think the hope was he would give us a couple of seasons at 5-6 WAR, a couple of seasons at 3-4 WAR and a couple of seasons at 1-2 WAR. He came with intangibles and a ton of playoff success. He was a perfect fit for this young team IMO. Unfortunately, he's aged a little faster than expected. To be clear - I really don't know what the right answer is. I'm just presenting the alternative view on it. Vlad's age is a huge factor as well. If the team thinks he's a 150+ wRC+ hitter over the next 5-6 seasons, then I think he's worth signing - even though I think some of those years will be wasted as we re-tool and aren't contenders. If he's a 130 wRC+ bat, I think I'd definitely entertain what you could get for him.

I think the concern is that he shouldn't be the face of the franchise. Is Pete Alonso the face of the Mets and some must keep superstar? I don't think he is - Lindor is, because he's a legit star. 3 WAR players aren't worth long term deals (say 10 years $250M, which is what I expect it will take to keep him). It's just a bad investment for the long term success of the team. Of course if Vlad is a 150-170 wRC+ hitter, then he's a legit star, no matter how bad his defense and base running is - and maybe he is! That's the challenge right now. I agree this could be a PR nightmare and have some short term impacts on the team, but there's also risk that he's an anchor on the franchise, when we should be trying to find a true "face of the franchise" guy to build around. Has connorp come on to remind us that big time bats (even if they come with other major liabilities like defense and baserunning) are worth FAR more than their WAR suggests? Isn't he always telling us how Schwarber, Teo, Castellanos, etc. got PAID as free agents over guys who get value from defense and base running because hitting is more important in the playoffs and therefore valued more? Maybe we should be viewing Vlad as a 5-6 WAR player instead of a 3 WAR player? Maybe he's right?

You've forgotten to factor in Vlad's IQ, which is like -4

To be fair - the Nats/Harper situation is a good example. However - winning the WS the year Harper left greatly accelerated any mourning period the fanbase may have had. That won't be happening in Toronto. I'm with Stangstag on this one. I think most of the fan base is casual and doesn't realize how pedestrian Vlad actually is as a player. Most kids who are into baseball and follow the Jays love Vlad. I think we're in for some gloomy years and trading Vlad, then rolling out some 70-80 win teams is going to have a major impact on the gate, tv ratings, etc. Of course I think long term, it may be the right thing to move on from Vlad. If we had some young hot shot prospect or new face of the team in the wings who could step right in - that would be ideal, but we don't. I ultimately think they keep Vlad - whether that's right or wrong. I do hope he settles in as a 150 wRC+ type hitter over the next 5-6 seasons. The talent is obviously there and I can live with the s***** defense, base running and antics if he hits like that. Hopefully some maturity helps him be more consistent.

They both suck. They aren't blocking anyone. The O's just want to get some value for them as they no longer need them and they have "some" value. Likely moved for a few lottery tickets.

Mullins and Mountcastle suck. That's why they want to trade them.

seriously though - wouldn't this lineup get it done? Springer - RF - 105 wRC+ Bo - SS - 120 wRC+ Vlad - 1st - 140 wRC+ Teo - LF - 130 wRC+ JDM - DH - 130 wRC+ Horwitz/Schneider - 2nd - 115 wRC+ Varsho - CF - 95 wRC+ IKF - 3rd - 95 wRC+ Kirk - C - 90 wRC+ Bench - Clement, Horwitz/Schneider, Barger (or Leo) & FA Catcher With a little luck (maybe Springer's figured something out, maybe Kirk returns to a 115 wRC+ hitter, maybe someone breaks out), that's a really good offense that didn't sacrifice "that" much defense. My apologies for adding the dig in.

Just sign Teo to play LF and Pederson or JDM for our DH. Wasn't out season sewered because Atkins signed KK and Turner instead of them? Sign a replacement for Kikucci and Garcia and boom, we're contenders!

I think I agree with this. I think I'd cash in on Vlad now. That would be extremely unpopular with fans and likely Ownership, but short and long term, that's probably the best thing to do. It's encouraging to see how he's hit the last few months, but I'm not convinced he'll ever be that 150-160 wRC+ star player we hoped for. Interesting to see how they handle this. Wouldn't look great to trade him right after he's been so vocal about wanting to play in Toronto....but sometimes you have to make those hard decisions.

Bo also stopped hitting in August 2023....not after some theoretical "team wide" hitting philosophy that 100% of the players were told to buy into this year. And this team wide hitting philosophy seems so far fetched that I can't buy it. Every hitter has strengths and weaknesses. No single philosophy would ever work for all players and there's no evidence that players have made any type of drastic changes this season. I already previously disproved that (based on claims they were told to hit the ball to all fields, cut down swings, etc.).

Jomboy Media (@jomboymedia) • Instagram reel WWW.INSTAGRAM.COM 30K likes, 275 comments - jomboymedia on July 22, 2024: "Blue Jays manager John Schneider was counting the umpire’s mistakes #baseball #mlb #sports #manager #umpire #bluejays #diamondbacks". Jomboy breakdown of the s***** check swing calls v. Arizona where Bassitt and Schneider got ejected by that donkey.

Yes - I think that could be true. Either way - I don't believe the rhetoric that the Jays MUST trade him immediately because he wants out and he's going to cause all kinds of issues in the clubhouse. The Jays should trade him when they believe they'll get the most value in return. End of story.

I'm sorry - CD told me "Bo is a smart and media savvy individual. He grew up with a dad in MLB" and that I was naive to think "Bo said something like that off the cuff." You think he's playing like s*** on purpose to force a trade? I just don't buy that. When was the last time we saw a ML player do this? If he is, then he's really f***ing stupid, which should make any team looking to sign him as a FA pause. He also started playing like s*** last August. I think it's just as likely that he's extremely frustrated with his own performance, which is leading to the poor body language. From call accounts, Bo is a very hard working player who likely expects a lot out of himself. This is the longest stretch of his life where he's been s***** at baseball and it's likely been very difficult on him mentally. Remember how defeated Kikucci looked in his first year in Toronto? Did that mean he wanted to be traded too? Or was he just pissed at his s***** performance? As for interviews and stuff - maybe there is something there, maybe he's just frustrated at himself, or maybe he is frustrated with the direction of the team. In these interviews he's said that if he was able to choose what team he plays for, one of the biggest factors would be the opportunity to win. Could he have phrased that differently? Sure, but I suspect most MLB players dream of winning the World Series and most would prefer to be on teams that are winning. This isn't some earth shattering revelation. I understand why some fans may read into that, but I also don't think that means it's guaranteed that he wants to be traded right now and is doing anything to force a trade. Even if he doesn't really see himself in Toronto long term, I think it would be moronic of him to stop working hard, stop being professional, stop caring/trying as he leads up to his FA year.

Do players actually bother responding to all the reports published about them? Had Bo been asked about this story in any recent interviews? You think Mr. Professional, Bo Bichette is going to want to be viewed as a whiny little bitch who pouts, complains and forces a trade as soon as things go sour - right before he's about to hit free agency? That just seems like a moronic thing to do.

That's true, but it seems highly doubtful that anyone is going to pay the added value to get Bo for this playoff run when they have no idea when he'll be healed or any indication he'll be able to stay healthy and/or perform as he's capable. I'm pretty convinced that we want to keep Bo or next year. He'll have all the incentive in the world to ball out and have a great season as he approaches free agency. Provided he still can and does play like the all-star he's been in the past, I have to think his value will be higher at this time next year than it is right now. There is a possibility teams will 100% believe in his talent and will pay full pop this offseason - or not.

You're not going to win this argument. BR doesn't have much credibility.

This is a really bad take.

Why would Bo do this 1 year before free agency? That's a terrible look for a guy looking to land a mega deal after next year. Jays have no reason to trade him now. They know he'll DEFINITELY give a f*** next year when he has to prove this year was just a blip in the radar.

Ah - sorry. I thought you were suggesting it was some aggressive move or something. You're just saying the Dodgers are good, which is true. Can he stay healthy though? That org is on a pretty awful run for that right now.

Dodgers whiffed on a few FA signings this year. Happens to even the best.

Why do you say that? The Dodgers, who's pitching is all essentially dead, called up a 25 year old starter from AAA? Seems rather normal to me.

I suspect the #'s suggested that Showalter got lucky. Call that balls of steel, but that probably backfires more than it works....even though he can save face afterwards by saying "if we're going to lose, it won't be Bonds who beats us" and most would just nod their head and agree.