General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2023)

[Krylian]

Looks like average white dude to me

 

White guys all look the same.

[Brownie19]

Wow, you guys are meatheads, players have been at camp since just after the New Year, they do get team feedback EOS to work on in the OS, everyone of them.

 

Did Kirk go home then for the birth of his child? Or has he been in Mexico all offseason? Has Orelvis been in Dunedin since just after New Years, working to improve his bat path? I mean I hope the answer is yes, but I doubt it is.

 

I think this started with the observation that the Dodgers sent players to Driveline, which suggests they don't have those types of facilities - which I thought was odd. Do the Jays? If so, seems odd the Jays do and the Dodgers don't (seeing how advanced the Dodgers are).

[Brownie19]

Full piece...

 

[John_Havok]

Did Kirk go home then for the birth of his child? Or has he been in Mexico all offseason? Has Orelvis been in Dunedin since just after New Years, working to improve his bat path? I mean I hope the answer is yes, but I doubt it is.

 

I think this started with the observation that the Dodgers sent players to Driveline, which suggests they don't have those types of facilities - which I thought was odd. Do the Jays? If so, seems odd the Jays do and the Dodgers don't (seeing how advanced the Dodgers are).

 

https://www.dunedingov.com/Home/Components/FacilityDirectory/FacilityDirectory/127/#:~:text=Sitting%20on%20a%2065%2Dacre,Blue%20Jays%20play%20their%20games.

 

A state-of-the-art facility unlike any other! Sitting on a 65-acre site, the new Player Development Complex (PDC) is the training facility of the Toronto Blue Jays Major and Minor League operations. The 115,000 square-foot building is located at 3031 Garrison Road, Dunedin, approximately 10 minutes away from TD Ballpark where the Blue Jays play their games.

 

Player Development Complex Features

· 6 Fields (5 brand new) · Sports Science Labs

· 2 Half Fields · Hydrotherapy Room (hot/cold tubs, pool)

· Covered Practice Field · Training Room

· 20 Gang Mounds · Clubhouse (lockers, equipment & laundry rooms)

· 12 Covered Batting Cages · Kitchen & Dining Areas

· Speed Hill · Workrooms, Conference & Meeting Rooms

·Observation Tower · Media Room

· Weight Room · Barber Shop & Nutrition Stations

· Movement Studio · Player Lounge & Family Room

 

 

Sports Science Labs would be my guess as to what they have that might be comparable to Driveline.

 

If anyone has a subsciprtion to the Athletic, here's an older article that might get a bit more indepth as to what the labs have in them https://theathletic.com/2411431/2021/02/25/blue-jays-player-development-complex-photos/

 

f*** it, I forgot I had just signed up for the Athletic a week ago....lol

 

Here's all they would sya about the labs "There are also three sports science labs located within — for applied research, movement and pitching — but, since they include proprietary information, the Blue Jays understandably did not give us a look at those."

[Stangstag]

I find it funny that people are surprised spring games start "already". Next week is March. What did you expect? Maybe it's because Southern Ontario has had three months of November that people's seasonal clocks aren't set right.

 

Yup this. Just had a big snow/ice storm yesterday. Had to clean ice off my car this morning.

[John_Havok]

Yup this. Just had a big snow/ice storm yesterday. Had to clean ice off my car this morning.

 

minus f***ing 30 C in Lethbridge overnight last night... but will up to +1 tomorrow.

[wilko]

minus f***ing 30 C in Lethbridge overnight last night... but will up to +1 tomorrow.

 

Was -38 overnight/this morning. It's saying it should warm up a bit over the weekend too.

[Spanky99]

Did Kirk go home then for the birth of his child? Or has he been in Mexico all offseason? Has Orelvis been in Dunedin since just after New Years, working to improve his bat path? I mean I hope the answer is yes, but I doubt it is.

 

I think this started with the observation that the Dodgers sent players to Driveline, which suggests they don't have those types of facilities - which I thought was odd. Do the Jays? If so, seems odd the Jays do and the Dodgers don't (seeing how advanced the Dodgers are).

 

What do you think the entire Player Development Complex was about Brownie??? Toronto has put copious amounts of money and resources so they don't need to go to Driveline. Players are signing here under slot to get this technology? Where have you been, dude?

[Dick_Pole]

That's why your houses cost only $800,000 instead of $1.5 million.

[Spanky99]

That's why your houses cost only $800,000 instead of $1.5 million.

 

Wat? lol

[Dick_Pole]

Referring to the -30 comments.

[G-Snarls]

Full piece...

 

Fapworthy indeed!!!

[G-Snarls]

minus f***ing 30 C in Lethbridge overnight last night... but will up to +1 tomorrow.

 

Red Deer -42

[John_Havok]

That's why your houses cost only $800,000 instead of $1.5 million.

 

If youre in the market you can absolutely buy my 300,000k house for 800,000k.

[Dick_Pole]

If youre in the market you can absolutely buy my 300,000k house for 800,000k.

 

Sell it to the Feds to house some border crossers. If they can last a real Canadian winter with no complaints, they deserve to be here. Conversely, if they leave, maybe whatever they were running away from wasn't too bad.

[jerb]

[TheHurl]

If so - trade his ass. And if the Jays aren't raising these concerns and asking him to go to Driveline or the equivalent to fix it - then fire those in charge of that message.

 

How many hours do you think are required to do analysis (especially on professionals where there is already 1000's of hours of video)? This is what Spring Training is for. It is why Dunedin has data driven analysis on site. The next part is taking the data and making material changes. For every driveline success stories, I am sure there are 10 which did not use the data to make the needed changes. Some probably ignored and believed in it.

 

It is also possible that Betts is going because he hates the conditioning part of early spring training. Something that we don't want Vlad to miss.

 

In the end, everything before opening day is optional for the player (including spring training). We have no idea if Vlad is open to any swing or approach changes, or if they have asked him.

 

Jays have 2 more years to decide if Vlad is a legit 160 wRC+ guy or 130 wRC+ guy. Both are helpful to the team

[TheHurl]

White guys all look the same.

 

Exactly...ugly. it is why KK does not identify as white.

[Brownie19]

How many hours do you think are required to do analysis (especially on professionals where there is already 1000's of hours of video)? This is what Spring Training is for. It is why Dunedin has data driven analysis on site. The next part is taking the data and making material changes. For every driveline success stories, I am sure there are 10 which did not use the data to make the needed changes. Some probably ignored and believed in it.

 

It is also possible that Betts is going because he hates the conditioning part of early spring training. Something that we don't want Vlad to miss.

 

In the end, everything before opening day is optional for the player (including spring training). We have no idea if Vlad is open to any swing or approach changes, or if they have asked him.

 

Jays have 2 more years to decide if Vlad is a legit 160 wRC+ guy or 130 wRC+ guy. Both are helpful to the team

 

If you wait until spring training to analyze and make adjustments - it's going to already be too late IMO...

[Brownie19]

What do you think the entire Player Development Complex was about Brownie??? Toronto has put copious amounts of money and resources so they don't need to go to Driveline. Players are signing here under slot to get this technology? Where have you been, dude?

 

Yes - I'm aware. I'm just baffled that every team hasn't invested in these types of facilities - especially the Dodgers. I still find it bizarre that guys like Orelvis (and Vlad to be honest) don't spend all winter in the Dunedin area - working in the facility to make them better players. Kirk's still in Mexico and I suspect hasn't set foot in the facility since last spring.

 

I'm going to let this go. I guess it is what it is. Teams just have to hope players get the right training, coaching and advice all offseason.

[Terminator]

Sorry - I'm stuck on this a bit.

 

Let's take Robbie Ray as an example. After the 2019 season - what happened? I assume they have exit interviews with each player and I think we'd assume in that meeting, they identify that control held Ray back this year. So he comes back in Spring 2020 with a drastically different/shorter arm path. Do we think the team suggested that's what he should try? Or did Ray and the people he trains with or whomever he met with that offseason simply decided a shorter arm path would improve his command? If it's the latter, does Ray call the Diamondbacks and explain his plan? Or does he just wing it? I mean the results were awful - so does the team just accept they have little to no control over what a player does in the offseason and accept that? or are they pissed that he did this? Maybe in this case, both Ray and the team were on board with the change and who was going to work with Ray to implement it.

 

And if all parties agreed to the changes - does this mean when the Jays do an exit interview and talk with Vlad about his launch angle and leading the league in double plays and how far he fell off last year - we think Vlad says piss on you guys - I don't care. I'm going back to the DR this offseason to eat Grandma's cooking, flip the odd tire and taking BP in the sandlot from one of my 17 brothers and that's going to prepare me for the 2023 season? If so - trade his ass. And if the Jays aren't raising these concerns and asking him to go to Driveline or the equivalent to fix it - then fire those in charge of that message.

 

LOL who do you think these players are? They aren't soldiers conscripted into the military. They are people who work for the organization.

 

It's a long grueling season and some of them need a mental break (or franky to see their kids and family) which can be better served in their home countries which they haven't been to in the 7.5 months they are working. They aren't robots.

 

On top of it there's plenty of stuff they can do down in the Dominican Republic anyway (or Arizona or Vegas or Mexico or wherever else they are from). These guys have been playing baseball wherever they are from for the first 18 years of their lives and many of them have turned in to stars so I think the DR is well equipped enough to help them train. It's not going to kill them to go home and train there. Plenty of the greatest players of all time have done it.

 

They don't have to give their lives up and live some scientific baseball experiment where they live in a baseball lab and baseball scientists run tests on them 24/7. Lol give me a break pal!

[Brownie19]

LOL who do you think these players are? They aren't soldiers conscripted into the military. They are people who work for the organization.

 

It's a long grueling season and some of them need a mental break (or franky to see their kids and family) which can be better served in their home countries which they haven't been to in the 7.5 months they are working. They aren't robots.

 

On top of it there's plenty of stuff they can do down in the Dominican Republic anyway (or Arizona or Vegas or Mexico or wherever else they are from). These guys have been playing baseball wherever they are from for the first 18 years of their lives and many of them have turned in to stars so I think the DR is well equipped enough to help them train. It's not going to kill them to go home and train there. Plenty of the greatest players of all time have done it.

 

They don't have to give their lives up and live some scientific baseball experiment where they live in a baseball lab and baseball scientists run tests on them 24/7. Lol give me a break pal!

 

And some of the best players of all time sat around and did f*** all during the offseason. They didn't work out at all (see Kruk, John). But at some point, players realized that if they worked out during the offseason, they could get better than their peers and now that's the norm. Players don't show up to camp 20 lbs overweight and use Spring Training to lose a few lbs. Why do you think we now have stables of pitchers who can throw 95+?

 

Times change and I believe these labs are currently what is producing the very best results for the average player. Sure there are still naturally gifted players who can f*** around on the sandlot and be stars, but if you took 100 player and put them in the sandlot and then took the same 100 players and put them in the lab - I surely expect the lab will produce more great baseball players. Accordingly, I think we'll continue to see more and more players gravitate to these labs to fine tune and improve their games. The players that don't will eventually fall behind and will be replaced by those who are. There's too much money in baseball for people to not take advantage of the resources that are producing the best results. I mean we have players saying they only want to be drafted by the Jays because of these facilities...

 

Do you play golf? Remember when 'lessons' used to be from the pro on the driving range? Sure they produced some results, for some. These days the best way to improve your game is to get into a facility that videos and analyses your swing. It shows you spin rates, axes, contact point, etc. Lessons in that environment are producing SIGNFICANTLY better results and the pro who's telling you to keep you head down on the range. You can see the video and track the results in real time. It's no different in a baseball lab.

 

I understand the need for rest - they can go do that for a few months for sure - but I certainly see more and more labs being created and players routinely using them to train in the offseason. Adapt or die Grady.

[wilko]

And some of the best players of all time sat around and did f*** all during the offseason. They didn't work out at all (see Kruk, John). But at some point, players realized that if they worked out during the offseason, they could get better than their peers and now that's the norm. Players don't show up to camp 20 lbs overweight and use Spring Training to lose a few lbs. Why do you think we now have stables of pitchers who can throw 95+?

 

Times change and I believe these labs are currently what is producing the very best results for the average player. Sure there are still naturally gifted players who can f*** around on the sandlot and be stars, but if you took 100 player and put them in the sandlot and then took the same 100 players and put them in the lab - I surely expect the lab will produce more great baseball players. Accordingly, I think we'll continue to see more and more players gravitate to these labs to fine tune and improve their games. The players that don't will eventually fall behind and will be replaced by those who are. There's too much money in baseball for people to not take advantage of the resources that are producing the best results. I mean we have players saying they only want to be drafted by the Jays because of these facilities...

 

Do you play golf? Remember when 'lessons' used to be from the pro on the driving range? Sure they produced some results, for some. These days the best way to improve your game is to get into a facility that videos and analyses your swing. It shows you spin rates, axes, contact point, etc. Lessons in that environment are producing SIGNFICANTLY better results and the pro who's telling you to keep you head down on the range. You can see the video and track the results in real time. It's no different in a baseball lab.

 

I understand the need for rest - they can go do that for a few months for sure - but I certainly see more and more labs being created and players routinely using them to train in the offseason. Adapt or die Grady.

 

http://t1.gstatic.com/licensed-image?q=tbn:ANd9GcQl2wDD8pm4ouEsenWR0fo9fT4MV2_wwHk2JTRH73T3SyMzY5P1iMfGbTgEfhjlKhnWTJ2RfshtNdDnLpI

[Terminator]

Why do you assume that they are all "f***ing around in a sandlot" just because they go home in the offseason to train? lol

 

Also, it takes two to tango. If you are an organization that compels its players to become lab rats that might not work out as well as you think. Each player is different and will have different training needs.

[Terminator]

I understand the need for rest - they can go do that for a few months for sure - but I certainly see more and more labs being created and players routinely using them to train in the offseason.

 

Ok well then you agree with me. The season including Spring Training is about 7.5 months. Even you Mr. Robot Baseball thinks they should get a few months off. Well there's only 4.5 months left in a year so a few months of rest basically eats that up by the time they get to ST.

[Spanky99]

Sell it to the Feds to house some border crossers. If they can last a real Canadian winter with no complaints, they deserve to be here. Conversely, if they leave, maybe whatever they were running away from wasn't too bad.

 

lmao

[John_Havok]

Why do you assume that they are all "f***ing around in a sandlot" just because they go home in the offseason to train? lol

 

Also, it takes two to tango. If you are an organization that compels its players to become lab rats that might not work out as well as you think. Each player is different and will have different training needs.

 

Im actually in agreemnt with Brownie. The more people the Jays can hire to get ahead of the curve in their labs, the better. Get the Blue Jays to the forefront of the analytics/Driveline type of thing and it can only help in player and draft signings. Tiedemann right now is Exhibit A in the brochure.

[Spanky99]

How many hours do you think are required to do analysis (especially on professionals where there is already 1000's of hours of video)? This is what Spring Training is for. It is why Dunedin has data driven analysis on site. The next part is taking the data and making material changes. For every driveline success stories, I am sure there are 10 which did not use the data to make the needed changes. Some probably ignored and believed in it.

 

It is also possible that Betts is going because he hates the conditioning part of early spring training. Something that we don't want Vlad to miss.

 

In the end, everything before opening day is optional for the player (including spring training). We have no idea if Vlad is open to any swing or approach changes, or if they have asked him.

 

Jays have 2 more years to decide if Vlad is a legit 160 wRC+ guy or 130 wRC+ guy. Both are helpful to the team

 

Vlad thinks it's swing selection, not worried about LA, thinks it'll come on do process. Everything he does in statcast is elite.

[Terminator]

Im actually in agreemnt with Brownie. The more people the Jays can hire to get ahead of the curve in their labs, the better. Get the Blue Jays to the forefront of the analytics/Driveline type of thing and it can only help in player and draft signings. Tiedemann right now is Exhibit A in the brochure.

 

I agree with that as well. But that's not what Brownie is saying. He also adds that he thinks all Domincans go home and eat like crap and "f*** around on the sandlot." lol

[John_Havok]

I agree with that as well. But that's not what Brownie is saying. He also adds that he thinks all Domincans go home and eat like crap and "f*** around on the sandlot." lol

 

nah, not all dominicans. Just Vlad. All Domincans would be stereotyping based on race, Brownie don't play dat