General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2022)

[John_Havok]

So let me get this straight, Shapiro was upset with AA at trading prospects in 2015 for a short term run but now people are talking about mortgaging our farm system for 2/3 year rental?

 

The whole philosophy from Shapiro was "sustainable winning." Any trade for Soto is the opposite of that. Funny how people's perceptions change when it's their ass on the line loll.

 

We're better off keeping our farm system and just spending money in free agency than going down this road. Now if we can keep Soto then it's a totally different situation.

 

First, getting a player for 2.5 years is not a rental. rentals are guys you pick up at the deadline who are pending Free agents at the end of that season.

 

Adding Soto (depending on the give) could easily fall within the framework of building a sustainable winner since you have this years international signing period (or draft... isnt that deadline coming up for the PA and the league to announce if theyve reached an agreement on that??), and 2 more drafts, trade dealines, free agent signings, trades etc to build your system back up.

 

Then of course you have the next 2.5 years to talk extension.

[John_Havok]

Even dumbtoyo had better lineups. f***ing sad.

 

I'd love to see the metrics that support Tapia hitting leadoff against.... anyone.

[Solaxys]

I'd love to see the metrics that support Tapia hitting leadoff against.... anyone.

 

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/splits-leaderboards?splitArr=2&splitArrPitch=&position=B&autoPt=true&splitTeams=true&statType=player&statgroup=2&startDate=2022-06-01&endDate=2022-07-21&players=&filter=&groupBy=season&wxTemperature=&wxPressure=&wxAirDensity=&wxElevation=&wxWindSpeed=&sort=16,1&pg=0

 

Tapia is 40th in wRC+ in MLB against RHP since June 1st, and 4th in Toronto lineup (behind Gurriel, Kirk, Teoscar)

 

5th in OBP for the Blue Jays (behind Gurriel, Kirk, Biggio, Teo)

[Stangstag]

lmao... Tapia leading off. George is made of glass.

 

 

What the f is up with Springer now? Did he break his hand diving into the shallow end of a pool or something?

 

Wasn’t he ok before the break?? And he had a few days to heal up. I don’t get it

[Spanky99]

Even dumbtoyo had better lineups. f***ing sad.

 

Yeah, Tapia should be batting 9th, just have Lourdes or Espy lead off.

[Spanky99]

What the f is up with Springer now? Did he break his hand diving into the shallow end of a pool or something?

 

Wasn’t he ok before the break?? And he had a few days to heal up. I don’t get it

 

He didn't go to the AS game to rest his arm/elbow. It has to be that.

[Stangstag]

He didn't go to the AS game to rest his arm/elbow. It has to be that.

 

Right but I don’t understand how 4 days of rest made it worse? He was playing on Sunday

[Stangstag]

Oh wait he was off Sunday, Saturday was his last game

[max silver]

I'd love to see the metrics that support Tapia hitting leadoff against.... anyone.

 

It almost pains me to say it, but based on Tapia's play over the last few months he's actually not a terrible choice for leadoff on a short term basis. He looks to have turned his season around in mid May, around May 12th or so. Since then he has produced a 127 WRC+ with an OBP of .347. The only regulars who have better OBP during this timeframe are Gurriel (.400) and Kirk (.416). It appears as though the club is attempting to run a set batting order where the primary bats remain in the same relative positions in the lineup with minimal shuffling. I'm not necessarily convinced the current lineup couldn't benefit from further tweaking though.

[Spanky99]

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/splits-leaderboards?splitArr=2&splitArrPitch=&position=B&autoPt=true&splitTeams=true&statType=player&statgroup=2&startDate=2022-06-01&endDate=2022-07-21&players=&filter=&groupBy=season&wxTemperature=&wxPressure=&wxAirDensity=&wxElevation=&wxWindSpeed=&sort=16,1&pg=0

 

Tapia is 40th in wRC+ in MLB against RHP since June 1st, and 4th in Toronto lineup (behind Gurriel, Kirk, Teoscar)

 

5th in OBP for the Blue Jays (behind Gurriel, Kirk, Biggio, Teo)

 

Still shouldn't be leading off, swap Lourdes or something.

[Solaxys]

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/splits-leaderboards?splitArr=2&splitArrPitch=&position=B&autoPt=false&splitTeams=true&statType=player&statgroup=2&startDate=2022-06-01&endDate=2022-07-21&players=19238,14350,19612,19997,19611,13066,22581,16535,19252,12856&filter=&groupBy=season&wxTemperature=&wxPressure=&wxAirDensity=&wxElevation=&wxWindSpeed=&sort=10,1&pg=0

 

Filtered to just include Jays. Tapia lead-off, statistically, makes sense.

[Solaxys]

Still shouldn't be leading off, swap Lourdes or something.

 

Then people would whine why Tapia is hitting 6th.

 

He has been one of our hotter hitters over the last month and a half.

[Spanky99]

Right but I don’t understand how 4 days of rest made it worse? He was playing on Sunday

 

And they have a day off this coming Monday.¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Solaxys]

Y'all are worrying about Tapia at the plate (when that's w.e), I am more concerned about him playing CF at Fenway lol

[Spanky99]

Then people would whine why Tapia is hitting 6th.

 

He has been one of our hotter hitters over the last month and a half.

 

I know he's been good lately, my point stands.

[max silver]

Right but I don’t understand how 4 days of rest made it worse? He was playing on Sunday

 

I can only guess that Springer has been undergoing some sort of intensive treatment on his elbow during the All Star break that requires a bit of time to settle down before returning to play. Keeping Springer out of the lineup and maximizing rest/healing time could potentially be a worthwhile short term sacrifice in order to improve his health for the second half of the season.

[Stangstag]

I can only guess that Springer has been undergoing some sort of intensive treatment on his elbow during the All Star break that requires a bit of time to settle down before returning to play. Keeping Springer out of the lineup and maximizing rest/healing time could potentially be a worthwhile short term sacrifice in order to improve his health for the second half of the season.

 

Hmmm yeah maybe a cortisone shot or something too

[keggy]

Y'all are worrying about Tapia at the plate (when that's w.e), I am more concerned about him playing CF at Fenway lol

 

Tapia hits like Kevin Pillar and fields like Ezekiel Carrera.

[Spanky99]

I can only guess that Springer has been undergoing some sort of intensive treatment on his elbow during the All Star break that requires a bit of time to settle down before returning to play. Keeping Springer out of the lineup and maximizing rest/healing time could potentially be a worthwhile short term sacrifice in order to improve his health for the second half of the season.

 

Hmmm yeah maybe a cortisone shot or something too

 

[John_Havok]

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/splits-leaderboards?splitArr=2&splitArrPitch=&position=B&autoPt=true&splitTeams=true&statType=player&statgroup=2&startDate=2022-06-01&endDate=2022-07-21&players=&filter=&groupBy=season&wxTemperature=&wxPressure=&wxAirDensity=&wxElevation=&wxWindSpeed=&sort=16,1&pg=0

 

Tapia is 40th in wRC+ in MLB against RHP since June 1st, and 4th in Toronto lineup (behind Gurriel, Kirk, Teoscar)

 

5th in OBP for the Blue Jays (behind Gurriel, Kirk, Biggio, Teo)

 

so what youre saying is Biggio should be hitting leadoff and Tapia should be glued to the bench and not playing CF where's hes garbage defensively?

 

Tapia has 151 wrc+ over that interval against RHP, Biggio's is 150.

[Solaxys]

so what youre saying is Biggio should be hitting leadoff and Tapia should be glued to the bench and not playing CF where's hes garbage defensively?

 

Ya not sure why Biggio is sitting.

 

---

 

ALSO. Guess who's back? Doug Eddings is part of the umpiring crew!

[Laika]

Hmmm yeah maybe a cortisone shot or something too

 

Yeah probably

[Spanky99]

Ya not sure why Biggio is sitting.

 

---

 

ALSO. Guess who's back? Doug Eddings is part of the umpiring crew!

 

GDT man, don't f*** the mojo.

[glory]

Tapia playing is clearly an organizational thing. Unfortunately we can't blame Charlie for this. If you asked me a month ago I would have said there is no chance he's tendered a contract after this season, but now I think there's a good chance he will. Unless this is their weird way of showcasing him for a trade. You don't play a guy this much in a season you want to compete if you don't value him.

[John_Havok]

Tapia playing is clearly an organizational thing. Unfortunately we can't blame Charlie for this. If you asked me a month ago I would have said there is no chance he's tendered a contract after this season, but now I think there's a good chance he will. Unless this is their weird way of showcasing him for a trade. You don't play a guy this much in a season you want to compete if you don't value him.

 

I mean, i get that Zimmer's bat has been worse than total crap, but there's no denying that him in the field, especially in Fenway would not be 1000 times better than Tapia. I'd stick Zim in CF, hit him 9th and take the L from his spot on offense rather than watching the ineviteble clusterf*** of Tapia in CF at the worst possible moment.

 

Or, put Teo in CF, Biggio in Left, Gurriel in RF - better offensive floor, better defense (though still not great admittedly).

[gruber92]

Tapia playing is clearly an organizational thing. Unfortunately we can't blame Charlie for this. If you asked me a month ago I would have said there is no chance he's tendered a contract after this season, but now I think there's a good chance he will. Unless this is their weird way of showcasing him for a trade. You don't play a guy this much in a season you want to compete if you don't value him.

 

Atkins doing what he can to spread his wings over the Grichuk trade. It's 100% Atkins.

[max silver]

Atkins doing what he can to spread his wings over the Grichuk trade. It's 100% Atkins.

 

This trade is looking more and more like a win over time. After a horrid start of the season Tapia has worked his way up from a -0.8 FWAR towards the end of May up to a -0.2 FWAR presently. He has produced a 138 WRC+/0.6 FWAR over his last 38 games. He is looking more and more like a useful 4th outfielder as the season goes on. He is a poor defender in center field and the club would likely be much better off using Teoscar out there instead, but given how Grichuk is down to a 77 WRC+ and having the worst season of his career it's easy to see moving on from him was a necessity. The fact that Pinto was added is just icing on the cake as he's up to a 121 WRC+ in A ball. He was heating up as the season progressed but looks to have missed a good chunk of time in July.

[InsideThePark]

So let me get this straight, Shapiro was upset with AA at trading prospects in 2015 for a short term run but now people are talking about mortgaging our farm system for 2/3 year rental?

 

The whole philosophy from Shapiro was "sustainable winning." Any trade for Soto is the opposite of that. Funny how people's perceptions change when it's their ass on the line loll.

 

We're better off keeping our farm system and just spending money in free agency than going down this road. Now if we can keep Soto then it's a totally different situation.

 

If they trade for Soto they'll probably be trading a bunch of 6 and 7 year rentals to Washington so I wouldn't be too worried about it.

[Ehjays]

 

Blue Jays, Vinny Nittoli Agree To Minor League Deal

By Anthony Franco | July 22, 2022 at 10:19pm CDT

 

The Blue Jays are signing reliever Vinny Nittoli to a minor league contract, reports Robert Murray of FanSided (Twitter link). The 31-year-old recently opted out of a similar arrangement with the division-rival Yankees.

 

A former 25h-round pick, Nittoli has spent the bulk of his career in the Mariners organization. He reached the big leagues with Seattle last year, getting the briefest cup of coffee with one inning of relief in his only appearance. The M’s outrighted him off their 40-man roster and later released him, and he caught on with the Twins for the stretch run. That agreement with Minnesota didn’t result in a big league look, and Nittoli returned to the open market as a minor league free agent, where he caught on with New York.

 

Assigned to Triple-A Scranton/Wilkes-Barre for the entirety of the 2022 campaign, the right-hander worked 36 2/3 innings across 22 appearances. He posted a 3.44 ERA, punching out a strong 29.9% of batters faced against a fine 8.8% walk rate. He’ll add some non-roster depth behind a Toronto relief corps that ranks 21st in MLB with a 4.11 ERA.

[Solaxys]