The Blue Jays sever all ties with Roberto Alomar after sexual misconduct review

[Boxcar]

BJMB has decided to remove King's name from all board fantasy titles. He is allowed to continue playing however cause no one likes the next options

 

When his name is etched off the league of despair trophy and I see it with my own eyes, I'll believe that this board actually cares about predators.

[King]

For the record, I am for vaccinating everyone with everything, even if I don't know what it is. Just stick the needle in my arm. King says HE'S being smeared? I'm being falsely accused.

 

Also, "exchanging" text messages is very interesting wording. I have always been minding my own business when this retard comes charging in, randomly texting me about some ********, assuming my positions on things, probably to feel better about himself, his bald head and tiny penis. It's never a "hey, how are you?" Even though that itself would be weird. It's always something like "lulz do u beet wimminz?!" I'm tired of this harrassment. I should have never joined that stupid BJMB WhatsApp as I'd never give this idiot my number otherwise.

 

I'm tired of watching this guy come and white knight for everyone and everything while he acts like Harvey Weinstein in the shadows. It's always the people who yell the loudest. Confession by projection, as they say.

That's not true. We had one conversation via text message in September about Willy Adames. I never said anything of the sort about you beating women.

[mellowgold]

Vlad Jr. will probably go into the Hall of Fame as a Yankee.

 

I just puked a little.

[Jimcanuck]

I'm with Team King.

[5ToolPhenom]

It's not just the Jays, it's MLb as a whole who did an investigation already....

 

Still, I find it hard to cast any opinion when there's been no details released at all. We live in a hyper-sensitive climate in 2021 where people can be canceled for even the smallest of infractions. Not to make any excuses for the guy, but it's not hard to imagine that boundaries could get blurred the odd time when you're a famous and rich athlete who routinely has women throwing themselves at you. It is freaking Roberto Alomar after all, the guy's basically a god in Toronto lol

[Laika]

Hard if not irresponsible to have a strong opinion on this.

 

On one hand, the third party law firm investigation and the strong reactions of MLB and Toronto make you think there must be a lot to the allegations and they must be bad.

 

On the other hand, we have seen institutions overreact to minor or benign things in these situations. The "external law firm" investigation may have been a joke, or a conclusion first process. Toronto may be overreacting as a PR move because Shapiro and Atkins got dragged a bit about doing nothing in the Mickey Callaway fiasco back in Cleveland.

 

We really know nothing.

 

I don't know what to make of the fact that the accuser does not want to advance a civil claim or criminal complaint.

 

I feel like he probably did do something very bad that would warrant all this, but we just don't know and we can't rule out the possibility of this punishment not fitting the crime.

 

If he did commit some egregious sexual misconduct offense than I absolutely support removing his name from the Level of Excellence. I don't see a strong argument for leaving him up there in that case. Any extreme hypothetical proves this position. If Dave Steib confessed to being a serial rapist would you just leave him up there because of uhhhh history? No, lol.

[Jimcanuck]

Level of Excellence is a marketing thing as I mentioned. No organization, Rogers/Jays or otherwise, is going to use a person that commits a sexual transgression in their marketing. Not in 2021.

 

This was an out of court settlement in the interests of all parties. No one wants a court shitshow. No doubt there was $$ to the complainant as part of the settlement and confidentiality agreement to protect identities. All we will get is rumours.

 

Also, this would have been handled by Rogers legal. Shatkins would have had nothing to do with it.

[King]

Any extreme hypothetical proves this position. If Dave Steib confessed to being a serial rapist would you just leave him up there because of uhhhh history? No, lol.

Your argument is a logical fallacy known as reductio ad absurdum. There's not much point in responding to it.

 

-Grant77

[Ryu In My House]

There was already an investigation completed by an external law firm. How the f*** could this be premature?

 

Mike Wilner said that that there was a lengthy investigation that resulted in a definitive result. MLB would not have done this unless there was a clear trail.

[Grant77]

Your argument is a logical fallacy known as reductio ad absurdum. There's not much point in responding to it.

 

-Grant77

 

That's correct actually. Pretending that something is the most extreme scenario in order to indict someone where there are zero details is illogical and wrong, but logic has never been a strong point for either of you

[Laika]

Your argument is a logical fallacy known as reductio ad absurdum. There's not much point in responding to it.

 

-Grant77

 

That's correct actually.

 

Lmao

[Laika]

Level of Excellence is a marketing thing as I mentioned. No organization, Rogers/Jays or otherwise, is going to use a person that commits a sexual transgression in their marketing. Not in 2021.

 

This was an out of court settlement in the interests of all parties. No one wants a court shitshow. No doubt there was $$ to the complainant as part of the settlement and confidentiality agreement to protect identities. All we will get is rumours.

 

Also, this would have been handled by Rogers legal. Shatkins would have had nothing to do with it.

 

Lots wrong in here. Holy s***, Jim.

 

For starters, there was absolutely no settlement here. This person did not advance any claim. There was nothing to settle. They brought the allegations to MLB to get Alomar punished professionally.

[King]

That's correct actually. Pretending that something is the most extreme scenario in order to indict someone where there are zero details is illogical and wrong, but logic has never been a strong point for either of you

 

Answer the question. Forget about Alomar for a second. Your other post clearly states you believe a player should not be taken off the level of excellence for something they did after their playing career.

 

So if Dave Steib confessed to being a serial rapist would you leave him up? A simple yes or no will suffice.

[Jimcanuck]

Lots wrong in here. Holy s***, Jim.

 

For starters, there was absolutely no settlement here. This person did not advance any claim. There was nothing to settle. They brought the allegations to MLB to get Alomar punished professionally.

 

That's your opinion, I have mine. We don't have any of the details.

[Laika]

That's correct actually. Pretending that something is the most extreme scenario in order to indict someone where there are zero details is illogical and wrong, but logic has never been a strong point for either of you

 

You have this exactly backwards, actually.

 

Reductio ad absurdum is a way if destroying bad positions by showing the extreme example.

 

If you say "no player should be removed from the level of excellence for something that happens after their playing career" your position is quite flimsy and easily reduced through an extreme example.

 

Maybe you should go back to school? You seem to be getting stupid as you age.

 

Right now nobody can judge if removing Alomar was appropriate because we don't know what he did, but you have already taken a position on this. So you get squashed like a bug. Have a nice weekend.

[Laika]

That's your opinion, I have mine. We don't have any of the details.

 

The person's lawyer said they are not pursuing a civil claim. Alomar's statement said he invited them to pursue a claim in an arena where he can defend himself. This is not a matter of opinion. You're just making stuff up and living in some weird fantasy? Not sure what the point is.

[Jimcanuck]

The person's lawyer said they are not pursuing a civil claim. Alomar's statement said he invited them to pursue a claim in an arena where he can defend himself. This is not a matter of opinion. You're just making stuff up and living in some weird fantasy? Not sure what the point is.

 

Filing a civil claim is not necessary for parties to come to a settlement. By parties I mean the Jays, MLB, and the complainant.

[Stangstag]

Hard if not irresponsible to have a strong opinion on this.

 

On one hand, the third party law firm investigation and the strong reactions of MLB and Toronto make you think there must be a lot to the allegations and they must be bad.

 

On the other hand, we have seen institutions overreact to minor or benign things in these situations. The "external law firm" investigation may have been a joke, or a conclusion first process. Toronto may be overreacting as a PR move because Shapiro and Atkins got dragged a bit about doing nothing in the Mickey Callaway fiasco back in Cleveland.

 

We really know nothing.

 

I don't know what to make of the fact that the accuser does not want to advance a civil claim or criminal complaint.

 

I feel like he probably did do something very bad that would warrant all this, but we just don't know and we can't rule out the possibility of this punishment not fitting the crime.

 

If he did commit some egregious sexual misconduct offense than I absolutely support removing his name from the Level of Excellence. I don't see a strong argument for leaving him up there in that case. Any extreme hypothetical proves this position. If Dave Steib confessed to being a serial rapist would you just leave him up there because of uhhhh history? No, lol.

 

This post should really be the end of the thread. Summed up perfectly and there’s nothing more to discuss without knowing the details, which we may never know.

[Laika]

Filing a civil claim is not necessary for parties to come to a settlement. By parties I mean the Jays, MLB, and the complainant.

 

Okay, thought you meant Alomar and her. I guess it's possible there was some sort of agreement between her and the league. I mean they are likely at least paying her legal fees

[TheHurl]

Still, I find it hard to cast any opinion when there's been no details released at all. We live in a hyper-sensitive climate in 2021 where people can be canceled for even the smallest of infractions. Not to make any excuses for the guy, but it's not hard to imagine that boundaries could get blurred the odd time when you're a famous and rich athlete who routinely has women throwing themselves at you. It is freaking Roberto Alomar after all, the guy's basically a god in Toronto lol

 

Exactly women threw themselves at this guy for 20 or so years and every indiscretion was covered up and allowed because he was that god. Suddenly the god in the city is more of a memory but still sees himself as this protected god. My opinions on Alomar have never changed. Amazing ball player...terrible human being. I have had this opinion these boards for years. This is probably the third time public incidents have come up for this debate to happen. At some point you just have to say it...once again Hurl was right

[Jimcanuck]

Okay, thought you meant Alomar and her. I guess it's possible there was some sort of agreement between her and the league. I mean they are likely at least paying her legal fees

 

Thanks. If there was an agreement, it would have included a release where the complainant agrees not to pursue the matter further, including by civil claim against Alomar. Jays and MLB would have insisted on this. The matter is finito.

[Laika]

Thanks. If there was an agreement, it would have included a release where the complainant agrees not to pursue the matter further, including by civil claim against Alomar. Jays and MLB would have insisted on this. The matter is finito.

 

Don't link assumptions to assumptions. You don't even know of there is any hush agreement so it's extra irresponsible to start assuming terms.

 

I actually find it very unlikely that a term like that would make it into any agreement between her and MLB. Her counsel would strongly advise her to not agree to waive any claims against Alomar; it would be an unpalatable term in an agreement between her and MLB. I'm not sure MLB would even ask for it. Very inappropriate. I'm not even sure a term like that would have legal effect since Alomar would not be a party to the agreement. Source: am a lawyer.

[Jays24]

Alomar may be canceled by the Jays and MLB but he'll never be canceled in my heart until I know the details lol.

 

Will be interesting how people who wear Alomar jerseys to the games will get treated. You gotta be looking for trouble to wear one. On that note, assuming all value of Alomar memorabilia has gone down the crapper lol.

[connorp]

This post should really be the end of the thread. Summed up perfectly and there’s nothing more to discuss without knowing the details, which we may never know.

 

Yeah nothing to sink our teeth into here. If we just knew it was something like he knowingly gave some chick herpes, or he used his “influence” to “pressure” her into a sexual relationship- we could go to town debating if it warrants firing and/or erasing..alas, details will seemingly never come to light. I think it’s something like that over straight assault but that’s pure conjecture

[AdamGreenwood]

It's stupid that we're all supposed to go along with this and cheer the Blue Jays decision when we don't know all the details. We have no idea what he is alleged to have done, and how credible any of it is.

[The Iceman]

Lets see if this turns into a Deshaun Watson type where tons of ladies come forward.

 

Dude owned the town when he played here. #1 celebrity/party dude

 

And what pi$$es me off is the Chapman's, Domingo German continuing their careers with NYY.

Herrera back for Philly.

 

But Alomar is fired, rip down the banner and lock him out.

 

My opinion is wait until the findings are public and let the Jays fans decide if this Hall of Fame player should have his banner pulled or not.

[Jimcanuck]

Lets see if this turns into a Deshaun Watson type where tons of ladies come forward.

 

Dude owned the town when he played here. #1 celebrity/party dude

 

And what pi$$es me off is the Chapman's, Domingo German continuing their careers with NYY.

Herrera back for Philly.

 

But Alomar is fired, rip down the banner and lock him out.

 

My opinion is wait until the findings are public and let the Jays fans decide if this Hall of Fame player should have his banner pulled or not.

 

It's a bit different when the matter is between two employees.

[Jays24]

It's a bit different when the matter is between two employees.

 

Shouldn't we as fans be more pissed at the Chapman's of the world than the Alomars for violating HR policies of a corporation that can be extremely sensitive to wanting to be progressive?

 

Somehow they get to keep playing but Alomar who is retired is being treated like dirt. Just weird and inconsistent approaches in society.

[Jimcanuck]

Shouldn't we as fans be more pissed at the Chapman's of the world than the Alomars for violating HR policies of a corporation that can be extremely sensitive to wanting to be progressive?

 

Somehow they get to keep playing but Alomar who is retired is being treated like dirt. Just weird and inconsistent approaches in society.

 

Do you know what Alomar did?

[BTS]

If Alomar feels like he didn't do anything to warrant this treatment, the logical course of action would be to tell his side of the story. If that doesn't happen, we should probably be comfortable assuming that the team isn't completely overacting over a trivial interaction between two employees.