Offseason Roster Thread 2016-17

[Abomination]

Cecil just made 3.8M for an up and down season

 

I'd offer

 

2017 4.5M

2018 5.5M

2019 5.5M option with a 1M buyout

 

I'd expect he'll get 3/20 from someone. Anything below that would be a steal imo.

[G-Snarls]

I'd expect he'll get 3/20 from someone. Anything below that would be a steal imo.

 

I suppose, you might have to guarantee that 3rd year or bump up the year 2 salary

[burlingtonbandit]

Cecil just made 3.8M for an up and down season

 

I'd offer

 

2017 4.5M

2018 5.5M

2019 5.5M option with a 1M buyout

 

I'd be surprised if he got below 3/22

[Stangstag]

I'd expect he'll get 3/20 from someone. Anything below that would be a steal imo.

 

I'd probably do it.

[Brownie19]

I'd love Dyson, but I think KC probably understands how valuable he is. A big part of their team identity is great defensive outfielders supporting mediocre flyball pitchers, so it's hard to see them moving Dyson unless the return is very big.

 

Disagree. If they understood how valuable he was - they'd start him more. Even in a part time role he was their most valuable player last year, yet over the past couple of years, they've been running the likes of Paulo Orlando and Alex Rios out there over him.

[baubau]

I did not realize how incredibly bad of a season Cutch had. Wow... what happened?

[G-Snarls]

I did not realize how incredibly bad of a season Cutch had. Wow... what happened?

 

Buy low candidate

 

LMAO

 

(JK)

[G-Snarls]

I did not realize how incredibly bad of a season Cutch had. Wow... what happened?

 

http://www.todaysknuckleball.com/nl/pittsburgh-pirates/infographic-whats-wrong-andrew-mccutchen/

[Abomination]

Charlie Morton could possibly be interesting as a reliever. Ground ball pitcher, wipeout curve, and the fastball should play up in relief.

[baubau]

Buy low candidate

 

LMAO

 

(JK)

 

Sure, why not... if the Jays are getting prospects back similar to the Lariano trade (squeeze them like hell for Meadows!) and not giving up anything of note from the roster (Pompey?). Thanks for that article too, G-S!

[burlingtonbandit]

Sure, why not... if the Jays are getting prospects back similar to the Lariano trade (squeeze them like hell for Meadows!) and not giving up anything of note from the roster (Pompey?). Thanks for that article too, G-S!

 

Wait let me get this straight.. did you just say the Blue Jays should trade for Cutch if they include Meadows and give up Pompey in return?

[baubau]

Wait let me get this straight.. did you just say the Blue Jays should trade for Cutch if they include Meadows and give up Pompey in return?

 

Yes. I am entering BBB level. You jelly?

 

P.S. You also take me too seriously.

[G-Snarls]

Wait let me get this straight.. did you just say the Blue Jays should trade for Cutch if they include Meadows and give up Pompey in return?

 

Pirates aren't gonna dump Cutch the way they did Liriano obviously

 

FTR don't think Bau was serious

[burlingtonbandit]

Yes. I am entering BBB level. You jelly?

 

P.S. You also take me too seriously.

 

lol I know

[Terminator]

The more I think about this the more I'm gravitating toward Ian Desmond. Can provide average CF defense and I would presume good defense in LF or RF where his primary position would be for us. On top of it he can come in and be a 2-4 WAR player at SS or 2B. That could come up big considering that we have injury prone players at both spots. He's never played 3B but you'd have to think that he could do it as well. As we move forward in year 2 or 3 of the contract he could move to several different positions (or even at the trade deadline of year 1) if needed as the roster evolves.

[G-Snarls]

The more I think about this the more I'm gravitating toward Ian Desmond. Can provide average CF defense and I would presume good defense in LF or RF where his primary position would be for us. On top of it he can come in and be a 2-4 WAR player at SS or 2B. That could come up big considering that we have injury prone players at both spots. He's never played 3B but you'd have to think that he could do it as well. As we move forward in year 2 or 3 of the contract he could move to several different positions (or even at the trade deadline of year 1) if needed as the roster evolves.

 

Yes yes yes

[KingKat]

The more I think about this the more I'm gravitating toward Ian Desmond. Can provide average CF defense and I would presume good defense in LF or RF where his primary position would be for us. On top of it he can come in and be a 2-4 WAR player at SS or 2B. That could come up big considering that we have injury prone players at both spots. He's never played 3B but you'd have to think that he could do it as well. As we move forward in year 2 or 3 of the contract he could move to several different positions (or even at the trade deadline of year 1) if needed as the roster evolves.

 

He's only a year removed from a sub 300 wOBA season and from what we saw in the ALDS, he's every bit the negative outfielder his stat say he is. Huge pass for me.

[Terminator]

He's only a year removed from a sub 300 wOBA season and from what we saw in the ALDS, he's every bit the negative outfielder his stat say he is. Huge pass for me.

 

Good points, not sure I entirely agree with your comments on his defense though. Negative in CF but he's not an albatross. His limited time in LF had him marked as a tremendous fielder, for what little that's worth. My guess is his defensive numbers would play up in a corner.

 

And yeah, I'm not in love with his bat either but he rebounded from that bad year. You say "huge pass" but what contract numbers are you hugely passing at? I'd be very interested in a 3 year deal.

[KingKat]

Good points, not sure I entirely agree with your comments on his defense though. Negative in CF but he's not an albatross. His limited time in LF had him marked as a tremendous fielder, for what little that's worth. My guess is his defensive numbers would play up in a corner.

 

And yeah, I'm not in love with his bat either but he rebounded from that bad year. You say "huge pass" but what contract numbers are you hugely passing at? I'd be very interested in a 3 year deal.

 

He's kind of in an uncanny valley for me. Not nearly as attractive as say Fowler but probably more expensive than Pagan or Beltran. Just not a guy I would target. That being said, the Jays aren't anyone's first choice either. If Desmond is kicking around and the Jays still have holes to fill than fine but I suspect some short term options will get locked up before the Jays resort to that.

[Bobthe4th]

He's kind of in an uncanny valley for me. Not nearly as attractive as say Fowler but probably more expensive than Pagan or Beltran. Just not a guy I would target. That being said, the Jays aren't anyone's first choice either. If Desmond is kicking around and the Jays still have holes to fill than fine but I suspect some short term options will get locked up before the Jays resort to that.

 

I wouldn't want to rely on Desmond being a first choice outfielder, and if we're talking about him as a super utility player to cover multiple positions I'd rather use Barney for that and spend the money saved on a first choice decent OF / 1B.

[Terminator]

I wouldn't want to rely on Desmond being a first choice outfielder, and if we're talking about him as a super utility player to cover multiple positions I'd rather use Barney for that and spend the money saved on a first choice decent OF / 1B.

 

Desmond was worth 3.3 WAR and has been worth 18.5 WAR in the past 5 seasons. If you can find a "first choice decent OF/1B" that good I'd be all ears. I think you guys are underestimating him some.

[Abomination]

Moss isn't going to be qualified. He's not a first choice, but he'd be a very good backup plan.

[Brownie19]

Desmond was worth 3.3 WAR and has been worth 18.5 WAR in the past 5 seasons. If you can find a "first choice decent OF/1B" that good I'd be all ears. I think you guys are underestimating him some.

 

A lot of his value comes from his base running and defense and he's 31 now. His average wRC+ over the past 3 years is 99 and his batting style (aggressive, low walks, high strikeouts) suggest his already average bat may not age well (that's my guess - no #'s to back up that theory).

 

In theory - he checks a lot of boxes and I think having someone in the Zobrist versatility role, who adds team speed would be a massive bonus for this team; however, I have strong reservations about giving him anything more than a 2 or 3 year deal. I know what you're saying, but there's a reason he only got a 1 year $8M contract last year, which included a position change.

[Terminator]

A lot of his value comes from his base running and defense and he's 31 now. His average wRC+ over the past 3 years is 99 and his batting style (aggressive, low walks, high strikeouts) suggest his already average bat may not age well (that's my guess - no #'s to back up that theory).

 

In theory - he checks a lot of boxes and I think having someone in the Zobrist versatility role, who adds team speed would be a massive bonus for this team; however, I have strong reservations about giving him anything more than a 2 or 3 year deal. I know what you're saying, but there's a reason he only got a 1 year $8M contract last year, which included a position change.

 

Yeah I agree with all that. You've explained the other side of the coin very well. I'd give him a 3 year deal though. 31-32-33 year old seasons. I'd honestly give him more than what people here would be comfortable giving him though. I'd go 3 for 45 or perhaps even more. I think there's a good chance he provides surplus value on a contract like that.

[Bobthe4th]

Desmond was worth 3.3 WAR and has been worth 18.5 WAR in the past 5 seasons. If you can find a "first choice decent OF/1B" that good I'd be all ears. I think you guys are underestimating him some.

 

As a SS sure, but we don't need one, we need 1B/OF/DH. Not a fan of Desmond as an OF.

 

It'd take a fairly hefty contract to secure him, money I'd prefer is spent elsewhere (my preference is resign Edwin).

[Terminator]

As a SS sure, but we don't need one, we need 1B/OF/DH. Not a fan of Desmond as an OF.

 

It'd take a fairly hefty contract to secure him, money I'd prefer is spent elsewhere (my preference is resign Edwin).

 

He was an OF last year and put up 3.3 WAR.

[Bobthe4th]

Yeah I agree with all that. You've explained the other side of the coin very well. I'd give him a 3 year deal though. 31-32-33 year old seasons. I'd honestly give him more than what people here would be comfortable giving him though. I'd go 3 for 45 or perhaps even more. I think there's a good chance he provides surplus value on a contract like that.

 

While I disagree and think there are better fits for our needs, it changes completely if we get him for cheaper than that though - but you'd expect him to get at least 3/45 on the open market.

[bendera3]

Yeah I agree with all that. You've explained the other side of the coin very well. I'd give him a 3 year deal though. 31-32-33 year old seasons. I'd honestly give him more than what people here would be comfortable giving him though. I'd go 3 for 45 or perhaps even more. I think there's a good chance he provides surplus value on a contract like that.

 

With the ability to play all 3 outfield positions plus SS and most likely the rest of the infield I think we could get decent value from him.

[Bobthe4th]

He was an OF last year and put up 3.3 WAR.

 

And if he'd played in his best position he would have been higher - he was poor in the field. My point is that for the money we'd have to shell out, we should be looking to sign someone who would be playing in their best position to maximise the investment.

 

That doesn't mean to say we should sign a terrible player just because they're a true OF of course.

[Sammy225]

I could see him as a Ben Zobrist type... If Tulo goes down he can step in. He can play OF/SS and i can imagine with him being a pretty good athlete could cover most of the IF spots except catcher...... I think he could be a valuable guy but I do think he will get paid well this off season.