John Gibbons Thread (+ Venting)

[glory]

No one is blaming the loss in Gibbons, but when you use your worst reliever in a 4-2 game and then bring in two of your better ones when the game is out of hand, then it's worth criticizing. That's just a bad use of the bullpen.

 

Probability in baseball is actually a thing.

[Governator]

No one is blaming the loss in Gibbons, but when you use your worst reliever in a 4-2 game and then bring in two of your better ones when the game is out of hand, then it's worth criticizing. That's just a bad use of the bullpen.

 

Probability in baseball is actually a thing.

 

There were ppl wanting Schultz as the setup man 2 months ago. He's not a terrible pitcher and we had 5 innings to throw again in a game we are losing. If Schultz threw a shutdown inning no one would say anything.

[intentional wok]

There were ppl wanting Schultz as the setup man 2 months ago. He's not a terrible pitcher and we had 5 innings to throw again in a game we are losing. If Schultz threw a shutdown inning no one would say anything.

 

To be honest I still would have. I'm glad Aaron Sanchez is successful and the team is doing well with him as 8th Inning Guy, but I'm still skeptical of why he deserves the job over some of the other talent in the pen. I'm not comfortable that a failed rookie-starter is the best option in tight games than Mark Lowe, who is apparently relegated to holding fairly sizable deficits late in the game.

 

This is not to say that I think Gibby is throwing games away because I can't tell you what didn't happen. I do think he isn't putting all of his guys in the positions to have the most success, though.

[gruber92]

Don't they have a 7-man pen?

 

I think many of you are overreacting and pinning this loss on Gibbons is a bit much. You can't expect our bp to shutdown 5 innings/game back to back and if they did, then OK it's a tie game.

 

FYI we got 2 runs late in the game without getting a hit, we were lucky the score wasn't worse. The team played awful.

 

That's not the point, forget about what the offence did or didn't do after the score was 4-2. You guys preach mathematical probabilities here all the time but in this case it doesn't apply? It would be different if the pen was spent, but it wasn't, with a day off the next day to boot. Also, what's wrong with expecting to keep the Phillies offence in check with a Hendricks / Lowe combo taking us to the latter innings? Do you have Schultz up higher than those two on the depth chart? If so, then I understand why you feel Gibby did nothing wrong.

[glory]

There were ppl wanting Schultz as the setup man 2 months ago. He's not a terrible pitcher and we had 5 innings to throw again in a game we are losing. If Schultz threw a shutdown inning no one would say anything.

 

Schultz's ERA is deceiving. He's not good. The fact that Gibbons was using him as the set-up man was more an indictment of how stupid Gibbons is, not how good Schultz was doing.

 

Gibbons hasn't been able to tell the difference between good players and bad players all season. You guys can brush it off as no big deal, but it is a big deal. It has cost the team many games. They'll have close to a 100 win pythag and will be lucky to win 88 in reality. He's been a very bad manager, which isn't his fault since we knew that about him in 2008.

[CHRIS]

I think blaming last night on Gibbons decision to use Schultz is a bit nitpicky.

 

I think the problem with this series is that we got two clunkers from out starting pitchers, and out bats just couldn't seem to get it together last night.

[gruber92]

I think blaming last night on Gibbons decision to use Schultz is a bit nitpicky.

 

I think the problem with this series is that we got two clunkers from out starting pitchers, and out bats just couldn't seem to get it together last night.

That's baseball, you're not going to get good starts and big offensive numbers every time. It's the manager's job to navigate through these situations with the best chance of a victorious outcome. Gibby did not comply by using Schultz over Hendriks.

[Governator]

Schultz's ERA is deceiving. He's not good. The fact that Gibbons was using him as the set-up man was more an indictment of how stupid Gibbons is, not how good Schultz was doing.

 

Gibbons hasn't been able to tell the difference between good players and bad players all season. You guys can brush it off as no big deal, but it is a big deal. It has cost the team many games. They'll have close to a 100 win pythag and will be lucky to win 88 in reality. He's been a very bad manager, which isn't his fault since we knew that about him in 2008.

 

 

Depending how you define 'good', Schultz is at least league average. I'm not saying it was the right move, but I think you are being overcritical.

 

Basing where they should be in the standings from our run differential and suggesting Gibbons will have cost the team many of those games is rubbish.

[glory]

Depending how you define 'good', Schultz is at least league average. I'm not saying it was the right move, but I think you are being overcritical.

 

Basing where they should be in the standings from our run differential and suggesting Gibbons will have cost the team many of those games is rubbish.

 

I'm not saying the team should have the same record as their expected total. I'm saying he has cost the team games with his decision making enough to where bad luck is on par with incompetence.

[CHRIS]

That's baseball, you're not going to get good starts and big offensive numbers every time. It's the manager's job to navigate through these situations with the best chance of a victorious outcome. Gibby did not comply by using Schultz over Hendriks.

 

Sure, I get that, and I don't disagree that Hendriks should have received the first call, especially since he came in later and was thus available. Still, it was an all-around lousy effort. I'm not denying that Gibbons management didn't play a part in the loss, but to pin the blame on him I think is a bit much.

[Governator]

I'm not saying the team should have the same record as their expected total. I'm saying he has cost the team games with his decision making enough to where bad luck is on par with incompetence.

 

You brought up the 100 win expected total for what reason then?

 

Yes he's made questionable decisions throughout the season but to suggest it has cost the team many games is just wrong. If a pitcher gives up multiple home runs in an inning against one of the worst slugging teams in the majors that's on him. There are a lot more to blame on this loss than a mere footnote on Gibbons BP choice. It was the 5th inning while down 4-1 with 2 outs nobody on for Revere & Pennington, I'm pretty sure he didn't expect them to scratch across a run when he chose to warm up Schultz.

[glory]

You brought up the 100 win expected total for what reason then?

 

Yes he's made questionable decisions throughout the season but to suggest it has cost the team many games is just wrong. If a pitcher gives up multiple home runs in an inning against one of the worst slugging teams in the majors that's on him. There are a lot more to blame on this loss than a mere footnote on Gibbons BP choice. It was the 5th inning while down 4-1 with 2 outs nobody on for Revere & Pennington, I'm pretty sure he didn't expect them to scratch across a run when he chose to warm up Schultz.

 

Run differential shows that they are grossly underachieving. Doesn't mean they should have the same record as their run difference indicates.

 

When you use inferior talent in place of superior talent, that will cost you games. He's done that all season, especially with the bullpen. That's not debatable. His 2nd best reliever this season is now a mop up guy. One of his other good relievers is barely used (Lowe). All while Schultz, Tepera, Castro, Loup, etc, have gotten turns as high leverage relievers at points in the season. I mean, come on.

[Trouba95]

I reckon if Hendriks is brought in first after we had made it 4-2, the game would've been tied eventually. Another lousy managing night from Mr. Gibby

[Governator]

Lets not blame our veteran starters who each lasted 4 innings in back-to-back games (giving up a combined 16 hits & 9 runs), lets ignore our top four going 2 for 16, ignore Bautista's error, lets pretend only our top 5 BP arms can put up zeros every night 5 innings per game, lets not blame Schultz who gave up 2 home runs against the f***ing Phillies, lets ignore the fact that our last 2 runs were lucky enough to come in without even getting a hit. The team f***ing sucked last night and was never in a position to win this game. Blame the manager though.

[jaysfan2014]

Lets not blame our veteran starters who each lasted 4 innings in back-to-back games (giving up a combined 16 hits & 9 runs), lets ignore our top four going 2 for 16, ignore Bautista's error, lets pretend only our top 5 BP arms can put up zeros every night 5 innings per game, lets not blame Schultz who gave up 2 home runs against the f***ing Phillies, lets ignore the fact that our last 2 runs were lucky enough to come in without even getting a hit. The team f***ing sucked last night and was never in a position to win this game. Blame the manager though.

 

Well, the Phillies offense is actually quite good post All-Star break, 3rd in MLB with a .274 average, as they've given ABs to younger players like Franco, Hernandez, Galvis, Ruf, Rupp, Herrera, Asche and surprisingly, Andres Blanco. The pitching outside of Nola and Morgan on the other hand, just reeks.

[frizzer1]

I don't have a problem with Schultz coming in at all....but I do have a problem with martin batting 5th....right now he's an automatic out....and the whole lineup drives me nuts.

Middle of the order RBI guy leading off.... ..base stealer with similar numbers to reyes, batting 9th and no stolen bases as a result....looks like somebody just threw stuff against a wall..

[Brownie19]

Middle of the order RBI guy leading off.... ..base stealer with similar numbers to reyes, batting 9th and no stolen bases as a result....looks like somebody just threw stuff against a wall..

 

Step away from the hot tub time machine man - nothing wrong with Tulo at leadoff. An "RBI guy" haha.

[Belliss101]

I don't have a problem with Schultz coming in at all....but I do have a problem with martin batting 5th....right now he's an automatic out....and the whole lineup drives me nuts.

Middle of the order RBI guy leading off.... ..base stealer with similar numbers to reyes, batting 9th and no stolen bases as a result....looks like somebody just threw stuff against a wall..

 

You want Revere leading off????

[IronLadle]

Step away from the hot tub time machine man - nothing wrong with Tulo at leadoff. An "RBI guy" haha.

 

Nothing wrong with leading off with Revere

[frizzer1]

You want Revere leading off????

 

Both he and Tulo have struggled since they came over but yes, I would have him leading off, at least until Travis comes back..

[BigCecil]

Crickets

[Nafro]

Crickets

 

Lol, a question concerning John Gibbons now is..."How many votes will he get for manager of the year?" I've heard talk for him and Jeff Bannister, though my choice would be AJ Hinch.

[Maahfaace]

Lol, a question concerning John Gibbons now is..."How many votes will he get for manager of the year?" I've heard talk for him and Jeff Bannister, though my choice would be AJ Hinch.

 

Re sign him to a 30 year deal

[Nafro]

Re sign him to a 30 year deal

 

Wow went straight to ridiculous, I'm sensing sarcasm. I'm pretty content with the way things are. He has next year already guaranteed. I also believe,there is a certain date that a year is added if he's still manager, so it's never a lame duck situation.

 

I think John Gibbons is okay, he's not terrible, he's not the best manager ever. The player's seem to like him, and they are having some success. He seems able to make in game/in season adjustments alright. The point of the crickets comment, I think,was that the month of August made it really, really difficult to keep this thread going, without seeming borderline retarded.

[BigCecil]

Amazing when we add better D, more offense, better pen arms and an ace he becomes a much better Mgr.

 

Gibby is ok. Even keeled. Makes some questionable decisions but we can do a lot worse.

Edited August 30, 2015 by BigCecil

[IronLadle]

Still one of the worst in baseball for me

[CrackerJack]

Still one of the worst in baseball for me

 

who's on your list of great managers in baseball?

(besides Bochy, Maddon, Hurdle who many would be quick to name)

[FFantasy]

who's on your list of great managers in baseball?

(besides Bochy, Maddon, Hurdle who many would be quick to name)

 

So glad you didn't say La Russa

[Virgil_Hiltz]

Amazing when we add better D, more offense, better pen arms and an ace he becomes a much better Mgr.

 

and hopefully AA will keep note of this in the future!

[Frenchsoup]

who's on your list of great managers in baseball?

(besides Bochy, Maddon, Hurdle who many would be quick to name)

 

Girardi, Showalter, Scioscia.