Blue Jays seeking replacement for Beeston

[Caper]

Why not just give AA the job. Bring back the apple guy to be the GM.

[Boxcar]

I was wondering why Olney was pushing the high compensation issue so hard. Thanks for making the connection.

 

Could also be because he's a huge moron, though. Lol @ the thought of anyone paying him to write about baseball.

[TwistedLogic]

Also... "Kubatko hears that the Orioles are pushing for more substantial compensation as a trade-off for not filing tampering charges against the Blue Jays", how is that not illegal? Isn't that essentially blackmail?

 

I was wondering why Olney was pushing the high compensation issue so hard. Thanks for making the connection.

 

I don't think I hate anyone in baseball more than I hate Buster f***ing Olney. His existence genuinely irritates me.

Edited January 22, 2015 by TwistedLogic

[Boxcar]

Sounds like it.

[Pulk_Pull]

The only conclusion that I can make of this entire mess.... is that there is a crapload of horrible national MLB reporters that have NO CLUE what is actually going on.

[StroShow]

Isn't that also a plea bargain? Give us something we want and the stuff you did wrong will magically disappear.

 

or...just like contract negotiation....Hi, I want $8M a year for 10 years. No...we'll give you $7M a year for 10, but we'll throw in a no trade clause. Done.

 

A plea bargain doesn't erase what you did.

[baubau]

Also... "Kubatko hears that the Orioles are pushing for more substantial compensation as a trade-off for not filing tampering charges against the Blue Jays", how is that not illegal? Isn't that essentially blackmail?

 

Even if they do go for tampering, the league would have to step in and prove this. If they do find evidence of tampering, what is the worst that happens? I feel like they are point towards a issue which may not have a large consequence. Would the O's also want to alienate the MLB by pushing a tampering case, on top of their MASN dispute, and future employees whom try to seek jobs there? Obviously being president, as much as it is a made-up title, is a promotion and most GMs will take it. Would most candidates go to a team that has been in such a gong show on this? I am not sure whom looks worse, the O's or Jays in this.

 

I don't think I hate anymore in baseball more than I hate Buster f***ing Olney. His existence genuinely irritates me.

 

Considering the amount of s*** he pulls out his ass, the dude must impress his doctors whenever he gets his colon check.

[StroShow]

But I don't think you can't get charged for it again. And if the Jays tampered, they tampered...but Angelos can't come back in 5 years, Hoffman in hand, and say, ya, we'd like to file tampering charges for DD now too.

 

I wouldn't even know how it would work in this situation. Let's say a plea bargain would forfeit Hoffman. Is that actually lighter than fighting the tampering charges? If they were found guilty, how much could they realistically owe?

[Ehjays]

Shi Davidi : He says send Navarro for DD

 

I'd be ok with that.

 

Latest article:

 

A player like Dioner Navarro, as Sportsnet colleague Jeff Blair suggested earlier this week, makes some sense. Totally ludicrous would be another story making the rounds – a package of Jeff Hoffman and Max Pentecost, both first-round draft picks in 2014 that cost the team nearly $6 million total in signing bonuses

[Ehjays]

Here is the full article:

 

SHI DAVIDI

JANUARY 21, 2015, 1:18 PM

TORONTO – A tipping point in the Dan Duquette saga may be approaching, and while some deft manoeuvring is still required, leverage may be shifting to the Toronto Blue Jays in their pursuit of the Baltimore Orioles executive.

 

To be sure, Major League Baseball is running out of patience with the ongoing mess and the damaging perception that’s been left to linger. One industry source tells Sportsnet baseball officials are nudging the Orioles to either strike a deal for Duquette or shut down the matter entirely.

 

Time is ticking down on this.

 

Realistically, despite the firm lines in the sand drawn by Orioles managing partner Peter G. Angelos, retaining Duquette when he wants to leave would be counterproductive, and he only needs to look to the Blue Jays’ experience with John Farrell for proof.

 

After the 2011 season, the Blue Jays rebuffed an approach from the Red Sox for their then manager by demanding Clay Buchholz as compensation, winning the day and setting the stage for Bobby Valentine to gong show Boston’s 2012 season.

 

But bigger picture, retaining Farrell – who wanted to return to Boston – was a mistake, and his desire to leave eroded the organization’s faith in him and led to mistrust of him among players in the clubhouse during a difficult campaign.

 

Shortly after the season ended, the sides settled on Mike Aviles as compensation for Farrell, with 40-man filler David Carpenter sent to the Red Sox to complete the transaction – probably the place where they should have landed a year earlier.

 

Can the Orioles really believe they’ll avoid similar toxicity if they retain Duquette, who is under contract through the 2018 season but wants the Blue Jays job as president and CEO the way Farrell wanted to manage the Red Sox?

 

Forcing someone to stay in a relationship when their heart is elsewhere is no recipe for success. Neither is retaining someone strictly on principle (or spite), especially when not everyone is on the same page.

 

One path to a deal may be by helping the Orioles save some face by offering a player or prospect marginally better than the token bodies established as precedent for such transactions.

 

A player like Dioner Navarro, as Sportsnet colleague Jeff Blair suggested earlier this week, makes some sense. Totally ludicrous would be another story making the rounds – a package of Jeff Hoffman and Max Pentecost, both first-round draft picks in 2014 that cost the team nearly $6 million total in signing bonuses.

 

Edward Rogers, the deputy chairman of team owner Rogers Communications Inc., is handling the negotiations, based on comments made by Angelos to the Baltimore Sun, and given that he’s listed as the club’s control person with Major League Baseball, it makes sense that he’s driving the bus.

 

Now is the time to give the Orioles an opening, but not break the bank, because they have far more to lose here than the Blue Jays.

 

While it would be ideal to have a president and CEO in place to make a mid-season call, if needed, on GM Alex Anthopoulos (who is in the final year of his deal), the team still has Paul Beeston (the franchise icon currently trapped in no man’s land) in place if all else fails, with an appealing job that many in the industry will still covet.

 

That’s a much better situation than the Orioles will be in if everything falls apart for all the reasons above, and should provide enough incentive to get a deal done.

[Ehjays]

He;s saying he is hearing BOTH Hoffman And Pentecost ......this is getting outta hand!!!

[Brownie19]

Jeff Blair is a utter buffoon. I'm OK with moving Navarro - but why would Baltimore want him?

[Brownie19]

I will literally denounce my allegiance to the Jays if they deal Hoffman - or anyone significant to get DD, who has absolutely no experience in the role. This story is completely out of hand.

[Sammy225]

Jeff Blair is a utter buffoon. I'm OK with moving Navarro - but why would Baltimore want him?

 

Wieters may not be able to catch much this season coming off a serious arm injury they may DH him more this season to keep his bat in the lineup and that would create a hole at Catcher. Not sure what Wieters status is at the moment.

[abola2121]

1. Replace Beeston with AA

2. Replace AA with LaCava

3. Replace LaCava with Tinnish

 

There. Over and done. No need to throw away top prospects.

[Orioles]

He;s saying he is hearing BOTH Hoffman And Pentecost ......this is getting outta hand!!!

 

Who said this?

[Brownie19]

Why not just give AA the job. Bring back the apple guy to be the GM.

 

Make Tinnish GM.

[Brownie19]

Wieters may not be able to catch much this season coming off a serious arm injury they may DH him more this season to keep his bat in the lineup and that would create a hole at Catcher. Not sure what Wieters status is at the moment.

 

For all he'll be needed, Caleb Joseph will be fine in that role. At least he knows how to frame a pitch.

[Brownie19]

Tinnish would be GM over LaCava.

 

Ya? Kind of hope you're right.

[Laika]

AA doesn't really have the resume to be a team president.

[burlingtonbandit]

AA doesn't really have the resume to be a team president.

 

Neither does DD, really...

[glory]

Notice how idiots like Olney and Bowden are chiming in, but not a peep from Rosenthal? There is a reason for that.

 

Wait until Kenny says something, then we will know a bit more. The only thing Toronto media knows how to do is Retweet other journalists.

[Laika]

Neither does DD, really...

 

Sure he does. He has almost as much experience working in baseball as AA has years on the Earth. He's been the GM of a Canadian team and two other teams in the AL East. Before that he was a director of player development, and in the middle he dabbled in amateur athletics and owned and operated a sports academy in Mass. and was owner/president of some summer collegiate team.

 

He's more basebally than most Presidents, but teams vary widely on top end organization. Some teams have a pure business dude in the President role, others have a former GM and a true baseball guy. Others split the role - the Cubs have a President of Baseball Ops (Theo) and President of Business Ops.

 

With the Blue Jays, it makes sense to have a guy with a ton of GM experience in different organizations in the President role. They don't really need a pure "business" guy because there are already countless suits above the team in the ownership group.

[43211234]

How the f*** does Olney have over a million twitter followers? - twice what Kenny Ken has.

 

 

I couldn't agree more with njh in that this is feeling like the Dickey situation.

 

Time to preemptively start an angry mob to hunt down Eddie Rogers. Sign below to sign up:

 

Angry mob:

43211234

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

Did not DD himself say he wants the Job expressing it openly to the media and is it not his boss who said he will not let him out of his contract.... Tampering vs blackmail which is the greater offense? This plus holding a employee hostage, not like contracts are never broken... Flip side can't DD just quit and claim mental abuse by his employer and walk away clean and free! Tampering bye bye my ass! So he has a clause like most that says he can leave for a promotion is that not a standard clause for most coaches and gm types?

[glory]

Sure he does. He has almost as much experience working in baseball as AA has years on the Earth. He's been the GM of a Canadian team and two other teams in the AL East. Before that he was a director of player development, and in the middle he dabbled in amateur athletics and owned and operated a sports academy in Mass. and was owner/president of some summer collegiate team.

 

He's more basebally than most Presidents, but teams vary widely on top end organization. Some teams have a pure business dude in the President role, others have a former GM and a true baseball guy. Others split the role - the Cubs have a President of Baseball Ops (Theo) and President of Business Ops.

 

With the Blue Jays, it makes sense to have a guy with a ton of GM experience in different organizations in the President role. They don't really need a pure "business" guy because there are already countless suits above the team in the ownership group.

 

Agreed. I actually think Duquette would be a good fit for the Jays simply because he is a baseball guy, and one with a track record. When you are run by a corporation, having a baseball guy in the president spot is far more appealing. Beeston is not a baseball guy and is stuck in the 80's. Duquette knows how to build a good team and farm system.

 

He's still not worth giving up a prospect for, though. He's just an executive.

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

How the f*** does Olney have over a million twitter followers? - twice what Kenny Ken has.

 

 

I couldn't agree more with njh in that this is feeling like the Dickey situation.

 

Time to preemptively start an angry mob to hunt down Eddie Rogers. Sign below to sign up:

 

Angry mob:

43211234

 

Now there's the ticket! Dickey,Thole for DD heck even throw in Navarro if needed! 3 major leaguers and 2 starters from last year! No f***ing Rookies for you. Take it or leave it! Even Mlb would call this fair!

Then sign shields, lol

[Pulk_Pull]

I am not sure whom looks worse, the O's or Jays in this.

 

Both teams look a bit immature about how they have handled this. That being said, what the Jays are doing is not abnormal. Who knows if their 'timing' around the Winter Meetings was simply when the media picked up the scent, or if that was when they started the talks. If that was when they reached out, then I would say the Jays pursuit started in poor taste.

 

Either way, the way Angelos has approach this is both childish and not aligned with league best practices. What's coming to light is the realization that the O's org is not an ideal place to try and advance your career. It appears that when you sign onto the O's, you are signing onto Angelos' way of life; which is far from optimal for most baseball professionals who want some form of flexibility in their career.

[Pulk_Pull]

Agreed. I actually think Duquette would be a good fit for the Jays simply because he is a baseball guy, and one with a track record. When you are run by a corporation, having a baseball guy in the president spot is far more appealing. Beeston is not a baseball guy and is stuck in the 80's. Duquette knows how to build a good team and farm system.

 

Dan's greatest work as O's GM isn't the player moves he made, but the systems he set up to help the Orioles create a decent pipeline for MLB talent. Hence the VP of Baseball Ops title. This is where I think he can help the Jays as Beeston is clueless to how this stuff works in 2015 and AA should be focused elsewhere.

[burlingtonbandit]

Dan's greatest work as O's GM isn't the player moves he made, but the systems he set up to help the Orioles create a decent pipeline for MLB talent. Hence the VP of Baseball Ops title. This is where I think he can help the Jays as Beeston is clueless to how this stuff works in 2015 and AA should be focused elsewhere.

 

Systems? If you are talking about Farm systems the Blue Jays have had a better one than the Orioles in AA's tenure.