Jays Acquiring Andres Gimenez

[The Cats Ass]

Gimenez isn't just defense, he also adds some SBs which casuals like. I predict he's a fan favourite by the end of next season. Great infield defense involves more diving and acrobatics(more flash) vs outfield which is more about jumps and routes(less flash), fans will eat this up. He's had back to back 30SB seasons; the last player to steal 30 bases for the Jays was Jose Reyes.

 

 

Only people complaining about this deal this time next year will be the same handful of people on here that complain that the sky is not the right shade of blue.

[Laika]

Gimenez isn't just defense, he also adds some SBs which casuals like. I predict he's a fan favourite by the end of next season. Great infield defense involves more diving and acrobatics(more flash) vs outfield which is more about jumps and routes(less flash), fans will eat this up. He's had back to back 30SB seasons; the last player to steal 30 bases for the Jays was Jose Reyes.

 

 

Only people complaining about this deal this time next year will be the same handful of people on here that complain that the sky is not the right shade of blue.

 

He's a younger IKF

 

Fans will not love him

[The Cats Ass]

He's a younger IKF

 

Fans will not love him

 

He'll be adored like O-Dog.

[G-Snarls]

Very tired of this being our biggest move this off season

[L54]

This is like trading for Jose Reyes on a much smaller scale

 

Trade young players for free agent contracts. It’s like they traded for Ha-Seong Kim when they could’ve just signed him

[G-Snarls]

This is like trading for Jose Reyes on a much smaller scale

 

Trade young players for free agent contracts. It’s like they traded for Ha-Seong Kim when they could’ve just signed him

 

Kinda feels like maybe no one wants to sign here atm

[Orgfiller]

This is like trading for Jose Reyes on a much smaller scale

 

Trade young players for free agent contracts. It’s like they traded for Ha-Seong Kim when they could’ve just signed him

 

Gimenez is a year younger than Horwitz.

[wilko]

Kinda feels like maybe no one wants to sign here atm

 

The Jays may need to go via the trade route.

[Dick_Pole]

As a top Atkins hater, I actually like this trade. Probably in the top 10% out of people here in terms of feelings about it. Wouldn't work if the Jays were operating like the Pirates. But they aren't operating like the Pirates. Ever since 2014 the Jays have shown a willingness to spend inefficiently in order to compete. Waving around the wallet includes taking on other teams' salary dumps that would be a clear win when money is not taken into consideration. Problem is that goes against the culture on this board that is dominated by advanced stats nerds and fellating of the Rays' FO.

[Laika]

Andres Gimenez projection = 3.1 fWAR

Contract:

 

2025 age 26 $10,571,429

2026 age 27 $15,571,428

2027 age 28 $23,571,429

2028 age 29 $23,571,428

2029 age 30 $23,571,429

2030 age 31 $23,000,000 *** 2.5M buyout

 

Call it a $20M AAV through age 30. Basically owed 5/$100M

 

here are the free agents with 3+ WAR projections:

 

Soto - age 26 signed for a billion dollars

Bregman - age 31 - 4.0 fWAR projection - unsigned

Burnes - age 30 - 3.9 fWAR projection - unsigned

Snell - age 32 - 3.6 fWAR projection - 5/$182M

Adames - age 29 - 3.5 fWAR projection - 7/$182M

Fried - age 31 - 3.4 fWAR projection - 8/$218M

Kikuchi - age 34 - 3.1 fWAR projection - $21M AAV for three years

Torres - age 28 - 3.0 fWAR projection - unsigned

 

I mean it's a good trade in light of the FA signings. It's a significantly younger player than Adames, on a much better deal, and they have similar comprehensive projections.

[L54]

Gimenez is a year younger than Horwitz.

 

Trade young players for FA contracts

 

Spencer Horwitz is a young player

 

Traded for a FA contract

[glory]

The Jays may need to go via the trade route.

 

It certainly appears that way. The last big FA (top 10 FA in the class) they signed was Gausman and that was 3 years ago when Vlad/Bo had 4 years of control left and the team was coming off 91 wins. Now the only carrot they can dangle at FA's is money, but big time FA's (ex. Burnes) will be able to get money anywhere so it probably isn't that big of a difference maker given the position the Jays are in. Trades, more specifically absorbing salary that another team wants to dump, might be their best way of getting a difference making talent.

[mphenhef]

The Jays may need to go via the trade route.

 

hard to trade for impact talent when the cupboard is pretty bare.

[The Cats Ass]

It certainly appears that way. The last big FA (top 10 FA in the class) they signed was Gausman and that was 3 years ago when Vlad/Bo had 4 years of control left and the team was coming off 91 wins. Now the only carrot they can dangle at FA's is money, but big time FA's (ex. Burnes) will be able to get money anywhere so it probably isn't that big of a difference maker given the position the Jays are in. Trades, more specifically absorbing salary that another team wants to dump, might be their best way of getting a difference making talent.

 

Chris Bassitt ranked in the top 10.

[burlingtonbandit]

Andres Gimenez projection = 3.1 fWAR

Contract:

 

2025 age 26 $10,571,429

2026 age 27 $15,571,428

2027 age 28 $23,571,429

2028 age 29 $23,571,428

2029 age 30 $23,571,429

2030 age 31 $23,000,000 *** 2.5M buyout

 

Call it a $20M AAV through age 30. Basically owed 5/$100M

 

here are the free agents with 3+ WAR projections:

 

Soto - age 26 signed for a billion dollars

Bregman - age 31 - 4.0 fWAR projection - unsigned

Burnes - age 30 - 3.9 fWAR projection - unsigned

Snell - age 32 - 3.6 fWAR projection - 5/$182M

Adames - age 29 - 3.5 fWAR projection - 7/$182M

Fried - age 31 - 3.4 fWAR projection - 8/$218M

Kikuchi - age 34 - 3.1 fWAR projection - $21M AAV for three years

Torres - age 28 - 3.0 fWAR projection - unsigned

 

I mean it's a good trade in light of the FA signings. It's a significantly younger player than Adames, on a much better deal, and they have similar comprehensive projections.

 

I’m curious to what Torres gets. It feels like he isn’t going to get a long term deal at a high AAV, so maybe he signs a 1 year prove it deal.

 

If he is willing to sign a short term deal, trading Bo and moving Giminez to SS might make sense.

[Terminator]

I’m curious to what Torres gets. It feels like he isn’t going to get a long term deal at a high AAV, so maybe he signs a 1 year prove it deal.

 

If he is willing to sign a short term deal, trading Bo and moving Giminez to SS might make sense.

 

We could sign Torres and move Gimenez to 3B for the upcoming year as well. Bo walks and then you move Gimenez to SS.

[max silver]

We could sign Torres and move Gimenez to 3B for the upcoming year as well. Bo walks and then you move Gimenez to SS.

 

I'm not convinced that the team wouldn't receive better combined production from a platoon of dudes like Wagner and Jiminez vs Torres. Torres has a rather generous 3 win steamer projection that somewhat relies on posting the best defensive season of his career and best baserunning numbers of the last 4 seasons on top of that.

[Stangstag]

I’m curious to what Torres gets. It feels like he isn’t going to get a long term deal at a high AAV, so maybe he signs a 1 year prove it deal.

 

If he is willing to sign a short term deal, trading Bo and moving Giminez to SS might make sense.

 

Im all for it IF the return for Bo is decent. If the offers for Bo suck I’d rather just ride him out.

[glory]

I’m curious to what Torres gets. It feels like he isn’t going to get a long term deal at a high AAV, so maybe he signs a 1 year prove it deal.

 

If he is willing to sign a short term deal, trading Bo and moving Giminez to SS might make sense.

 

Obviously Bo is a better player than Torres (assuming he's healthy) but if you can get decent value for Bo in a trade, move Gimenez to SS, and then sign Torres on a short term deal for 2B, then that would be a tidy retool type of move. Largely depends on what the return for Bichette would be.

[Jimcanuck]

We could sign Torres and move Gimenez to 3B for the upcoming year as well. Bo walks and then you move Gimenez to SS.

 

Giminez at 3b in this scenario is hilarious

[Terminator]

Giminez at 3b in this scenario is hilarious

 

So is your outdated avatar Jim

[L54]

So is your outdated avatar Jim

 

Rekt

[wilko]

So is your outdated avatar Jim

 

Damn.

 

Edited December 17, 2024 by wilko

[Orgfiller]

I think Gleyber Torres makes little sense now with the acquisition of Gimenez while Bo is still around. Assuming there's still interest given the expected price and potential upside, Gimenez to 3rd in a Torres signing would be the most inefficient scenario IMO. Bo and Torres up the middle would be woeful defense. If all those 3 guys existed in the field, the best course of action would be to slide Gimenez to SS and Bo to 3rd so that the former can cover for the deficiencies of the other two poor defenders around him. But that seems unlikely to happen unless the team is comfortable with changing Bo's position as he enters his FA walk year. Of course, a Bo trade could always be in the works, with Gimenez sliding to SS in his absence, in which case Torres becomes an appealing option once again.

[BatFlip]

So is your outdated avatar Jim

 

Boom

[Spanky99]

So is your outdated avatar Jim

 

T - Rekt... lmao

[OtisNixonFan]

Honestly I like it.. It's a buy-low on a guy who at worst is gonna be worth 2.5-3 with the glove/baserunning. He's locked in for 5 of his prime years. The cost was f*** all.

 

It's a solid get, especially considering that Horwitz's ABs are marked for Wagner. It's an even better move if we jettison Bo or make the assumption that we indeed will lose him for nothing.

 

In the context of no other moves(Jimi excluded) It's s***** that we haven't loaded up... that being said this isn't that bad so far. One of Santander/Teo and a Burnes signing/Pitching trade and we will all be very happy.

[Brownie19]

Honestly I like it.. It's a buy-low on a guy who at worst is gonna be worth 2.5-3 with the glove/baserunning. He's locked in for 5 of his prime years. The cost was f*** all.

 

It's a solid get, especially considering that Horwitz's ABs are marked for Wagner. It's an even better move if we jettison Bo or make the assumption that we indeed will lose him for nothing.

 

In the context of no other moves(Jimi excluded) It's s***** that we haven't loaded up... that being said this isn't that bad so far. One of Santander/Teo and a Burnes signing/Pitching trade and we will all be very happy.

 

Not surprising the Otis Nixon fan is in favor of adding a limp dick bat who can run You do raise some valid points.

[Laika]

I don't think people here understand how good he is on defense

[Brownie19]

I don't think people here understand how good he is on defense

 

I don't think fans care how good his defense is. They want offense.