World Baseball Classic thread

[L54]

It wasn't so much kids were better, more that they had more versatility.

So much of Youth baseball is pitching, and you need a bunch of them due to pitch counts and not able to pitch back to back days. A real juggling act. Owen did not pitch at all.

So even though owen was the best hitter, he wasn't as valuable as a kid that would pitch a lot or play a premium defensive position.

 

https://www.prepbaseballreport.com/profiles/ON/RJ-Mayor-7180649253-7246138095

https://gogriffs.com/sports/baseball/roster/aaron-duffy/7626

https://www.prepbaseballreport.com/profiles/ON/Jackson-Smith-2537084169

https://www.iowalakesathletics.com/sports/bsb/2021-22/bios/torresan_matt_e129

https://upstatespartans.com/sports/baseball/roster/ben-roberts/4895#:~:text=33%20Ben%20Roberts&text=2022%20(FRESHMAN)%3A%20Appeared%20in,250%20opponent's%20batting%20average%20%E2%80%A6

https://www.prepbaseballreport.com/profiles/ON/Eric-Martyn-7453602819 - Best player...stayed a little too small

 

For sure. Two way guys are way more valuable to a team and you need virtually everyone to be able to throw innings in some capacity to get through a provincial weekend or any tournament.

[WryNGinger]

Interesting that Manoah turned down a team USA invite. I am glad he did.

[jaysblue]

I think the WBC benefits hitters more than pitchers before the season.

 

Tough to schedule a WBC. Not sure there is a perfect time during the calendar year. Sucks you won't ever have the best of the very best compete but that's the reality.

[G-Snarls]

Interesting that Manoah turned down a team USA invite. I am glad he did.

 

No Cole

No Scherzer

No deGrom

No Manoah

No Burnes

No Strider

No Fried

No McClanahan

 

The list goes on...

[Grant77]

No Cole

No Scherzer

No deGrom

No Manoah

No Burnes

No Strider

No Fried

No McClanahan

 

The list goes on...

 

It's just as bad for Canada. Almost all of our best pitchers are no-shows.

[G-Snarls]

It's just as bad for Canada. Almost all of our best pitchers are no-shows.

 

They just have so many more to pick from than we do

[Grant77]

They just have so many more pick from than we do

 

If MLB wants the WBC to succeed then they need to find a way to get these pitchers to attend. People want to see Guerrero Jr. vs Verlander or Scherzer on the big stage.

[G-Snarls]

If MLB wants the WBC to succeed then they need to find a way to get these pitchers to attend. People want to see Guerrero Jr. vs Verlander or Scherzer on the big stage.

 

I hope we get to see that in the World Series this year

[G-Snarls]

Uptake of North American position players has definitely been faster than among North American pitchers

 

Very different from Japan/Korea

[John_Havok]

Uptake of North American position players has definitely been faster than among North American pitchers

 

Very different from Japan/Korea

 

I think it’s just the timing of the event and the less than routine schedule a starter might be experiencing at the WBC vs what they get at ST. Relievers I don’t think it matters as much but the starters get ramped up in a very specific way and I think a lot of them don’t feel like they get that perfect routine at the wbc.

 

Especially this season when they know they’ll need to get used to a pitch clock and limited disengagements and pretty much an entirely different on field flow of the game.

[Grant77]

I think it’s just the timing of the event and the less than routine schedule a starter might be experiencing at the WBC vs what they get at ST. Relievers I don’t think it matters as much but the starters get ramped up in a very specific way and I think a lot of them don’t feel like they get that perfect routine at the wbc.

 

Especially this season when they know they’ll need to get used to a pitch clock and limited disengagements and pretty much an entirely different on field flow of the game.

 

I've seen suggestions that they have the WBC at the end of the season, much like hockey's World Cup, which gets far better participation. What do you think of that?

[Orgfiller]

I've seen suggestions that they have the WBC at the end of the season, much like hockey's World Cup, which gets far better participation. What do you think of that?

 

I think this would be even worse for pitcher participation. Innings limits would play a huge factor, teams would be very strict about workloads for everyone. The nice thing about the WBC during Spring Training is those guys would need to do the work anyway, a tournament following the season would mean additional workload on these guys.

[Spanky99]

I think this would be even worse for pitcher participation. Innings limits would play a huge factor, teams would be very strict about workloads for everyone. The nice thing about the WBC during Spring Training is those guys would need to do the work anyway, a tournament following the season would mean additional workload on these guys.

 

Yeah, that's the last thing pitchers want to do after the full season grind. It's set up is the best now for participation, and lots of teams have pitchers on the no go list. It is what it is.

[Jimcanuck]

I have minimal interest in this exhibition. I doubt I will watch any of it.

[Spanky99]

I have minimal interest in this exhibition. I doubt I will watch any of it.

 

Thanks for sharing.

[Jimcanuck]

Thanks for sharing.

 

Welcome, mate. Have a great day!

[jaysblue]

I thought at the end of the season wouldn't be a bad idea as well, but I'm sure some players/pitchers after 162 game grind probably don't want to participate. Also, you would still have a month that includes the Postseason, so some arms anyways wouldn't be pitching for a month and then all of a sudden start again.

 

Not sure there is a perfect/ideal time for this tournament. Obviously as a fan, you want to see the best and in a big matchup you want to see an arm like Verlander battle Ohtani, and not just for three innings.

 

The WBC games have become bullpen games pretty much anyways. Starters only pitch 2-3 innings and on a strict pitch count.

 

It's still entertaining to watch but what sucks is you know you'll never see the best of the best competing or WBC matches managed like actual MLB games.

[Jonn]

Foreign countries seem to take way more pride in representing their countries for whatever reason. If representation isn’t high it’s hard to justify having the event in the first place.

[Laika]

Should just kill the MLB All Star game and replace it with the official, MLB sanctioned WBC All Star tournament break.

 

Shrink the WBC so it is only these teams:

 

Puerto Rico

DR

Venezuela

Mexico

Cuba

USA

Japan

Korea

Commonwealth Conglomerate (Canada + GBR + Australia + certain other commonwealths)

Asian Conglomerate (China, Chinese Taipei, etc.)

European Conglomerate (Netherlands, Italy, Israel, Germany, Czech, etc.)

American Conglomerate (Panama, Colombia, Nicaragua, etc.)

 

Nobody wants to see f***ing Nicaragua or the Czech Republic competing on their own.

 

Do some type of very compressed tournament that would resolve in like, one week.

 

You could still elect MLB All Stars and do your Home Run Derby. The All Stars get to represent their countries in the WBC tournament during All Star week, if they want (optional). The countries fill in the remaining players at their discretion.

[jaysblue]

Yeah other option is have a condensed WBC tournament in the middle of the season for either one week or two. Kind of like what the NHL did with the Olympics.

 

Players and pitchers would be in game form unlike during spring training which is a plus. I guess some starters would still be limited in terms of innings or pitch counts, which I understand. But at least maybe a starting pitcher can go 5 innings. Create a pitch count/inning pitched threshold for a SP during the tournament.

 

Like you said, limit the amount of teams in the tournament to like 8 or 12 (USA, Japan, Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, Dominican Republic, Mexico, Puerto Rico) and have others qualify like Canada, Italy, Australia, Panama, Colombia etc. based on their rankings or previous finish.

 

The one or two week break I don't think will have a major effect on players/pitchers not playing in the tournament. Might be good for some players as its a time to rest and get healthy in the middle of the season. Players and arms can always go down to their teams ST facilities to work out and stay in shape if they want.

 

An obstacle would be the host cities/countries. Would have to be in North America or Latin American countries IMO if in the middle of the season. Would be tough to have MLB players travel overseas to Japan or Europe to play.

[G-Snarls]

Foreign countries seem to take way more pride in representing their countries for whatever reason. If representation isn’t high it’s hard to justify having the event in the first place.

 

Yeah, the Latin American countries in particular seem to have way more pride poured into this

[Grant77]

The middle season idea is far worse than the end of the season if we're going for participation. Contending teams aren't going to allow their players to risk injury in the middle of the season. They already don't participate in the all-star games.

 

The bottom line is that the tournament has to be important and players have to care. Hockey players care about representing their country and fans think it's important. That's why there is such great turnout.

 

The fact is that baseball players don't care about their country (at least North American ones) and there isn't enough fan interest to make them want to participate.

[John_Havok]

The middle season idea is far worse than the end of the season if we're going for participation. Contending teams aren't going to allow their players to risk injury in the middle of the season. They already don't participate in the all-star games.

 

The bottom line is that the tournament has to be important and players have to care. Hockey players care about representing their country and fans think it's important. That's why there is such great turnout.

 

The fact is that baseball players don't care about their country (at least North American ones) and there isn't enough fan interest to make them want to participate.

 

I love that you feel you can speak for what other people care about.

 

Chances are youre somewhat right though, but only that players care more about the team that is signing their checks and don't want to jeopardize their life's work, not that they dont care at all about the WBC. It obviosuly matters to the shitload of MLB players that are playing in it

[Grant77]

I love that you feel you can speak for what other people care about.

 

Chances are youre somewhat right though, but only that players care more about the team that is signing their checks and don't want to jeopardize their life's work, not that they dont care at all about the WBC. It obviosuly matters to the shitload of MLB players that are playing in it

 

The lack of participation and interest in the WBC makes it pretty clear how the majority of star players feel about the tournament and representing their country. Jordan Romano would be absolutely roasted by fans if he played hockey and snubbed his nation. Players are regularly chastised in hockey and basketball when they opt out of National Team participation.

[jaysblue]

Yeah the WBC isn't the same as Olympic hockey, or the World Cup. It's always going to be tough to get the best players competing in this tournament unfortunately. That's the way it is.

[John_Havok]

Yeah the WBC isn't the same as Olympic hockey, or the World Cup. It's always going to be tough to get the best players competing in this tournament unfortunately. That's the way it is.

 

I think that’s just largely due to timing, not because they don’t actually care.

 

I don’t know how to solve that problem either, the MLB season + spring training + playoffs is just so damn long and pitchers especially would have difficulty altering their routines to make it work.

 

I think it might actually work better at the end of the season rather than the start.

[jaysblue]

Yeah it has to do with timing for sure.

 

Also, baseball isn't like hockey or soccer where you can give players/pitchers a month off to have a WBC tournament. Tough to alter routines for baseball players/pitchers and have them sit out for an extended period of time and then start up again.

[TheHurl]

The WBC will never be a full participation event unless it gets World Cup of Football money attached to it (which of course will not happen). The time of year will not matter. It's an entertainment event with a little National pride attached to it. I for one will watch, cause it's baseball

[Grant77]

I think that’s just largely due to timing, not because they don’t actually care.

 

I don’t know how to solve that problem either, the MLB season + spring training + playoffs is just so damn long and pitchers especially would have difficulty altering their routines to make it work.

 

I think it might actually work better at the end of the season rather than the start.

 

I don't think that's true at all. There's no good reason why Nick Pivetta can pitch for Team Canada, but Zach Pop or Jordan Romano can't. They aren't willing to make the effort, take the risk, they don't care. It's one or more of thise things, take your pick.

 

NBA players take time out of their offseason and alter their schedules to make it work. NHL players lose in absolutely brutal playoff series and fly their broken bodies over to Europe the next day to represent their nation. To many players, National Team participation is more important than their club team and they come out and say it.

 

Why do players in other sports care, while baseball players do not? That what they have to figure out if they want to make the WBC a success. How many fans even know who won the last tournament? It won't get fan engagement until the players show up.

 

Maybe the Olympics are a better path to player participation. Pause the season like the NHL and make it convenient. They will bring baseball back if MLB works with them.

[jaysblue]

Yeah, you need the best MLB players participating to make the WBC a better success for sure.

 

In other sports like basketball, it's easier to pick up and play during the summer Olympics in August after a bit of a layoff, whereas in baseball it's really tough.

 

You do have more athletes overall wanting to participate in Olympic Hockey, Olympic Basketball and tournaments like the World Cup/Euro Cup. With the WBC it's all about timing that makes it difficult. Also, some athletes might not view it as such a prestigious tournament just yet.