General Blue Jays Discussion Thread (2023)

[Rafters]

If Espinal is at third tonight heads should roll

 

I would be half tempted to throw Vlatty at 3rd… what’s the worse that could happen

[AMS528]

If they get hot and the make the playoffs that will be nice, but really the fact that this team is basically scrapping it out for the absolute last playoff seed after the playoffs were expanded is a terrible result.

 

The knock on the AA two year playoffs run, was that he absolutely cleared the prospect pool to make it in twice for a shot. Right now we have some decent prospects that have stepped up in AAA, but we're probably still prospect rankings wise somewhere in the 20ish range.

 

That should mean given the talent we had built up two years ago and the payroll they have been permitted to have we're doing better than this, and it is incredibly disappointing that we're not.

 

It doesn't feel like we should be doing poorly, and generally speaking the front offices moves have worked out. Gausman has been great, Springer was very good the two years before this, Kikuchi bounced back to have excellent value this year. The Merrifeld trade was good, the Berrios trade has fluctuated for good to bad, to probably good again. Belt has worked out great, Kiermier has been solid, they have been two of the better players on the current roster. Varsho depending on how you measure and value his defense has been between decent and quite good. Semien was obviously an incredible value signing, and so was the Ray trade.

 

But it has somehow never come together in the same year. Each year it's been either the bullpen was a disaster that destroyed us (Brad Hand and the rest in 2021), starting pitching (2022 with Berrios, Kikuchi and Mitch White) or now the offense this year (Kirk, Chapman, Vlad etc.).

 

There is always something that has fallen apart, and maybe some of that can be blamed on bad luck but management has responsibilities there. There's definitely fitness issues the team has failed to address, Kirk and Manoah have significantly damaged the season by being completely out of shape. Vlad I think is not the fitness issue, plenty of big guys hit, but a coaching issue. There's been choices the team has made, Varsho for LGJ and Moreno isn't the worst deal but Moreno is probably a catcher who's going to age well, hits decently already and could improve his framing enough to be really valuable for a number of years. Maybe it's possible there was a different deal they could have struck there with the surplus catchers. But that's hard to say. This year they've stuck with Espinal for to long and too many AB's but Dejong disaster aside they haven't thrown away that many ABs. Having a quicker trigger on decent prospects in AAA coming up instead of spending time on Espinal and Biggio is a fair criticism.

 

It's interesting that really when you look at the moves the front office has made, they've generally gotten good value out of both their recent signings and their trades. And yet none of that lines up for a full season. They fix one part of the team (the bullpen this year for example) and another part falls apart. I'm not really sure how much blame they deserve for it but I don't think there's much of an argument that we've had three years so far of our compete window happen with mostly middling results.

[Terminator]

[JaysAllMighty]

[AMS528]

 

Hmm... It feels like it might be a better idea to have Ernie Clement who usually plays SS and has at least regularly gotten games at 3B to play there?

[The Cats Ass]

Should call up Barger and hope for some lightening in a bottle, he has a .930 OPS over the past month. We've already seen it happen for Schneider with his call up. There is no excuse for running Espinal out there as a starter.

[Terminator]

Hmm... It feels like it might be a better idea to have Ernie Clement who usually plays SS and has at least regularly gotten games at 3B to play there?

 

Clement could be starting at SS depending on what's up with Bo's availability today.

[The Cats Ass]

Clement could be starting at SS depending on what's up with Bo's availability today.

 

Clement is at SS tonight. Schneider at 3B. Whit at 2B.

[Terminator]

Clement should have taken over the Espinal role a month ago.

[Laika]

Clement should have taken over the Espinal role a month ago.

 

They absolutely should have sent Espinal down weeks ago

[MikeM3]

Couple injuries and the players are learning new positions. Imagine if we didn't have the healthiest rotation in baseball and had to actually use a 6th or 7th starter.

[Spanky99]

Hmm... It feels like it might be a better idea to have Ernie Clement who usually plays SS and has at least regularly gotten games at 3B to play there?

 

Should be Davis, it's his natural position, IDK.

[Spanky99]

Clement is at SS tonight. Schneider at 3B. Whit at 2B.

 

That makes sense, losing Bo sucks balls.

[Stangstag]

Should call up Barger and hope for some lightening in a bottle, he has a .930 OPS over the past month. We've already seen it happen for Schneider with his call up. There is no excuse for running Espinal out there as a starter.

 

The front office never does this, for reasons unknown. They don’t seem to believe in “ride the hot hand”

[JaysAllMighty]

[deanmike]

Considering the Jays are basically admitting Espinal is completely useless now (starting Clement at SS against a RHP when Clement himself doesn't even hit righties well), they might as well have just optioned Espinal as well and selected Lantigua's contract from the minors, unless they're saving the open 40-man spot for Chad Green and they don't have any other phantom 60-day IL candidates besides Otto Lopez.

 

There's little point in a Barger callup right now because 6 of the next 9 starters the Jays are projected to face are LHP, even though he's already on the 40-man.

[Stangstag]

That is one fugly lineup tonight

[AMS528]

Clement could be starting at SS depending on what's up with Bo's availability today.

 

Yeah makes more sense now that it's confirmed Schneider is at 3rd. It's the right choice with the players available.

[AMS528]

They absolutely should have sent Espinal down weeks ago

 

He's been the one guy along with Biggio (short Dejong stint aside) they've wasted empty AB's on this year. At least Biggio's bat has been ok since the terrible start.

 

Espinal has gotten 205 PAs of being unplayable. Way too many on a team that isn't hitting well enough.

 

The front office was better last year at not throwing away too many AB's on complete wastes.

[G-Snarls]

 

Belt 1B/DH

Clement/Bo SS

Vladdy 3B

Schneider 2B

 

That IF defense goes from elite to Holy s*** IDK

[Terminator]

They absolutely should have sent Espinal down weeks ago

 

I get why they didn't as it's hard to demote a 2 WAR player after a bad 150 ABs. And really, the ABs from #30 to 150 or so were fine, he got off to a 2 for 33 start or something like that. But the defense has been putrid and then he's starting to slump again so now it's 200 ABs of s***** play. It's definitely time now if it wasn't before.

 

He's also made some huge mental errors. He had that fielding play against the Dodgers where he just gave up on a play and then he is swinging at Ball 4 yesterday. He also sucked the 2nd half of last year. Time for a demotion pal.

 

But in general, I think the FO has been too forgiving with both the bench and the latter half of the lineup. Veterans are getting tons of rope, meanwhile:

 

-Waiting forever to call up Schneider. And then inexplicably sitting him for an entire week.

-Biggio, Espinal, Varsho, etc. all getting TONS of rope.

-Chapman and Vlad need to play a lot but i think a couple more off days wouldn't have hurt.

-In addition to Schneider, we have Clement, Horowitz, Barger, Lantigua, etc. all hitting the s*** out of the ball in AAA but not only is the FO hellbent on the Biggio's and Espinal's of the team, but they'll even give a guy like Jordan Luplow a chance before they try a young guy.

[Terminator]

Belt 1B/DH

Clement/Bo SS

Vladdy 3B

Schneider 2B

 

That IF defense goes from elite to Holy s*** IDK

 

Lol @ Vlad's fat ass back at 3B. The guy can't even play 1B.

[wilko]

Lol @ Vlad's fat ass back at 3B. The guy can't even play 1B.

 

How dare you! He's a gold glover!!!

[jaysthebest]

I think Vlad would've had higher Fwar if he was a full-time DH this year.

[deanmike]

Seems like Biggio has fallen out of favour with the team once again. He isn't even starting today at home against a non-high velo RHP when he easily could have slotted in at 2B instead of KK playing, moving Whit to LF and Varsho to CF.

[glory]

I like how Schneider couldn’t play 3B a couple of weeks ago so they felt they needed the Espinal/DeJong left side of the infield but now that they are clinging for any hope they can find, suddenly Schneider is capable at third.

 

This team.

[THANOS]

Seems like Biggio has fallen out of favour with the team once again. He isn't even starting today at home against a non-high velo RHP when he easily could have slotted in at 2B instead of KK playing, moving Whit to LF and Varsho to CF.

 

That might be a case of needing better defense in the OF to make up for worse in the IF. They are probably expecting more GBs to go through so want better OF to handle what makes it through.

[keggy]

The front office was better last year at not throwing away too many AB's on complete wastes.

 

Tapia bro

[keggy]

I think Vlad would've had higher Fwar if he was a full-time DH this year.

 

The time has come to DH Vlad and put Belt at 1B against righties. Tell the media it's to protect Vlad's wrist if it hurts his little feelings.

[G-Snarls]

Need good Gausman back today striking out 10-12.

 

This IF looks iffy