Around Baseball 2022

[Grant77]

I'd be curious to dig into this a bit more and find out if fans 'say' they don't like this change - but does that opinion actually show up in their actions. Ever checked the stands in the 14th inning of a Tuesday night game? Based on my experience, a lot of people will hang around for the 10th inning, but it thins out pretty damn quick after that. No idea if they can track this, but I'd love to know how many fans turn the game off after 9th or 10th inning.

 

And I believe polls will also show you that baseball continues to lose fans because the game is too long/slow - hence all the changes to speed the game up.

 

As noted above - I'm surprised you're not more upset over losing the DH in the NL. I suspect polls will tell you that fans hate this decisions and LOVE seeing pitchers hit .105/.126/.210 because bunting is super exciting. Polls would also tell you that fans hated the idea of eliminating the take out slide and running over catchers because violence is fun to watch.

 

I think we can draw a line between preventing violent injuries and making arbitrary changes to fundamental rules for no apparent benefit or reason. Those changes had broad support in my experience with other fans.

 

You have the odd guy trolling here like BTS, but you'd be hard pressed to find a handful of avid and knowledgable fans that support this change and the polls show it.

 

You're only surprised by my attitude because your only argument in support of this is that 'fans think any change is bad'. People are capable of evaluating rule changes based on their own merits, or lack thereof in this case.

[Spanky__99]

lol

[glory]

I'd be curious to dig into this a bit more and find out if fans 'say' they don't like this change - but does that opinion actually show up in their actions. Ever checked the stands in the 14th inning of a Tuesday night game? Based on my experience, a lot of people will hang around for the 10th inning, but it thins out pretty damn quick after that. No idea if they can track this, but I'd love to know how many fans turn the game off after 9th or 10th inning.

 

And I believe polls will also show you that baseball continues to lose fans because the game is too long/slow - hence all the changes to speed the game up.

 

As noted above - I'm surprised you're not more upset over losing the DH in the NL. I suspect polls will tell you that fans hate this decisions and LOVE seeing pitchers hit .105/.126/.210 because bunting is super exciting. Polls would also tell you that fans hated the idea of eliminating the take out slide and running over catchers because violence is fun to watch.

 

The only thing I could find in a quick Google search (from SI, April 2021):

 

"Fans seem to like it. Ratings for extra innings on MLB.TV have doubled with the rule, and fans at the ballpark come alive when they see the home team batting with a runner in scoring position."

 

Given the date, that's only factoring the 2020 season (which was obviously shortened to begin with), so I'm curious if they have any numbers for the 2021 season. I'd be surprised if it makes much of a difference in viewership in the long run, but people turning the TV off or stopping streaming out of anger as soon as they see the ghost runner is likely no where near reality. One thing I do know for sure is people leaving the stadiums in extra innings (during the regular season).

 

I have never heard any NBA fan say "I wish the overtime was 12 minutes instead of 5 because any team can go on a 5 minute run, it's not fair". The NFL overtime rule is probably the least fair of all of the major sports, and it clearly has not stopped fans from watching the games. Stuff like this actually makes me sympathize with Manfred a bit because he (rightfully) knows that baseball needs massive changes on the field, but any change whether big or small is going to be met with the type of rage that really no other sport gets because "100 years ago baseball was played the right way". In 2023 when there's a pitch clock, shifts will be regulated, etc, heads are going to explode.

[max silver]

I think we can draw a line between preventing violent injuries and making arbitrary changes to fundamental rules for no apparent benefit or reason. Those changes had broad support in my experience with other fans.

 

You have the odd guy trolling here like BTS, but you'd be hard pressed to find a handful of avid and knowledgable fans that support this change and the polls show it.

 

You're only surprised by my attitude because your only argument in support of this is that 'fans think any change is bad'. People are capable of evaluating rule changes based on their own merits, or lack thereof in this case.

 

Can you point me to some polls showing that fans hate this so much? I've done a little bit of searching and came away pretty much empty handed.

[BTS]

I think we can draw a line between preventing violent injuries and making arbitrary changes to fundamental rules for no apparent benefit or reason. Those changes had broad support in my experience with other fans.

 

You have the odd guy trolling here like BTS, but you'd be hard pressed to find a handful of avid and knowledgable fans that support this change and the polls show it.

 

You're only surprised by my attitude because your only argument in support of this is that 'fans think any change is bad'. People are capable of evaluating rule changes based on their own merits, or lack thereof in this case.

 

I've never been more serious about anything in my life.

 

I'm a busy man, so I don't have 5+ hours to watch a baseball game unless its the playoffs. And I don't like the idea that the dregs who have time to sit on their couches for 6 hours get to see the outcome decided when I'm out doing very important things.

[Dr. Dinger]

Yankees and Judge going to arbitration

 

17M vs 21M

 

Only a 31 players are actually going to arbitration

 

“We believe Aaron is worth only 17M due to the prorated games he will not be able to play as an unvaccinated person.”

[Dick_Pole]

Grant is right, this rule is dumb.

 

Ties are better.

 

If they are going to do this, they should at least allow teams a designated runner like Herb Washington. Instead of having the previous inning's last out at second which makes no sense at all other than to keep the batting order and screws up player stats.

 

I so badly want to see a 17 inning game even with this rule. Just to show how dumb it is. Putting a guy at second increases scoring chances for both teams an equal amount.

 

Much of these problems with long games and excessive pitching changes go away if teams are limited by how many pitchers they can employ throughout a year.

[max silver]

Agreed. I've said before, I think baseball has taken the longest to evolve of the major sports because of its fear of change. A fanbase that leans to the older side is probably going to hate change a little bit more, but it feels like with baseball, even the tiniest thing is going to cause a rage among the core fans. The game on the field is in bad shape and needs to be massaged a bit to become a more entertaining product. Not just for young people, but everyone. As someone mentioned, no one benefits from extra innings. Not the players, not the owners, not the fans (who leave in droves during extra innings anyway), not the TV networks, etc. A "ghost runner" increases the likelihood of a game ending at a reasonably time and both teams have to play by the same rules. It's not a perfect setup, and if you want to say it's a bit gimmicky, then fine, but it's a reasonable rule in terms of trying to get the games to end sooner and avoiding marathons. If we never see an 18 inning regular season game again, is anyone going to be disappointed?

 

I think the extra innings rules could be better with a little tweaking. You could play something like an inning under regular rules, then an inning with a runner at first base instead of second, then finally switch to the runner on second from the 11th inning onwards. This still makes the game end in a more reasonable time frame, and possible to end under normal rules before switching to increasingly easy to score secenarios to further expedite the end of the game.

[wamco]

Agreed. That is much better. Still bad, but better. I first saw “ghost runner on 2nd in extras” years ago in girls JV softball. Thought it was a joke then.

 

Ghost runner on 2nd resulted in 73 percent of extra inning games ending in the 10th inning.

 

Might as well build all the excitement you can. Make it sudden death!

[max silver]

Agreed. That is much better. Still bad, but better. I first saw “ghost runner on 2nd in extras” years ago in girls JV softball. Thought it was a joke then.

 

Ghost runner on 2nd resulted in 73 percent of extra inning games ending in the 10th inning.

 

Might as well build all the excitement you can. Make it sudden death!

 

I don't think sudden death would work at all since the home team could end up losing without getting their final turn at bat.

[Jimcanuck]

Make extra innings 4 outs instead of 3!

[Boxcar]

I’d say a poll of baseball fans on this subject would result in 80 pct anti ghost runner. I’ve yet to talk to someone who likes it. I detest it

 

Never said I liked it, just that there are a lot of OT rules that are worse.

[Boxcar]

I guess I'm in the minority but I like marathon games. The more baseball the better. They also get more nerve wracking the longer they go as bullpen depth gets tested and winning those games is very satisfying.

I would have much preferred that if they insisted on doing this, that it started in the 13th or 14th inning.

 

Remember some long ass time ago, the Blue Jays were playing the Angels for like a billion extra innings? Went nearly till 3am and then Yunel Escobar got dinged for interference that was arguably ******** and the Jays lost?

 

Yeah I'm gonna say I wish I had that time back to do literally anything else.

[Grant77]

Can you point me to some polls showing that fans hate this so much? I've done a little bit of searching and came away pretty much empty handed.

 

Here's a couple in this article, along with some solid analysis demonstrating why the rule is detrimental to the game and the fan experience.

 

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-runner-on-second-in-extras-rule-has-worn-out-its-welcome/

[glory]

I think the extra innings rules could be better with a little tweaking. You could play something like an inning under regular rules, then an inning with a runner at first base instead of second, then finally switch to the runner on second from the 11th inning onwards. This still makes the game end in a more reasonable time frame, and possible to end under normal rules before switching to increasingly easy to score secenarios to further expedite the end of the game.

 

I think letting them play the 10th inning under normal rules and then starting the ghost runner if it gets to the 11th is a fine compromise, but even in that scenario we'd likely see a lot of extra inning games with the ghost runner involved.

[Stangstag]

Remember some long ass time ago, the Blue Jays were playing the Angels for like a billion extra innings? Went nearly till 3am and then Yunel Escobar got dinged for interference that was arguably ******** and the Jays lost?

 

Yeah I'm gonna say I wish I had that time back to do literally anything else.

 

I sat inside a closed dome on Canada and watched 19 innings of a 1-1 game which then resulted in a loss.

 

I wish I could say it was a fun 6 hours, but it was miserable sitting in there after the 10th. But I personally never leave early because there’s always the chance for a walk-off

[Grant77]

I've never been more serious about anything in my life.

 

I'm a busy man, so I don't have 5+ hours to watch a baseball game unless its the playoffs. And I don't like the idea that the dregs who have time to sit on their couches for 6 hours get to see the outcome decided when I'm out doing very important things.

 

If you would rather do other things than watch baseball than that speaks to your own level of investment with the team more than any type of rule change.

 

I often miss games due to family commitments so that's hardly any kind of criticism, but not wanting to watch the most thrilling part of a game is hardly a good reason to support this change. Go to bed and check the score in the morning if watching good baseball isn't a priority for you.

[Stangstag]

I think letting them play the 10th inning under normal rules and then starting the ghost runner if it gets to the 11th is a fine compromise, but even in that scenario we'd likely see a lot of extra inning games with the ghost runner involved.

 

Why though? If 9 innings isn’t enough to decide a winner lets just start the rule in the 10th. I don’t get the whole argument of “i’d be fine if they waited til the 11th/12th to start the runner on 2nd.

 

f*** that. There’s 162 games a year. 1458 innings played.

 

I won’t complain about free baseball but I also won’t complain about players wanting games to end quickly after 9 innings.

[Stangstag]

If you would rather do other things than watch baseball than that speaks to your own level of investment with the team more than any type of rule change.

 

I often miss games due to family commitments so that's hardly any kind of criticism, but not wanting to watch the most thrilling part of a game is hardly a good reason to support this change. Go to bed and check the score in the morning if watching good baseball isn't a priority for you.

 

Ooooh you’re so edgy dude

[glory]

Why though? If 9 innings isn’t enough to decide a winner lets just start the rule in the 10th. I don’t get the whole argument of “i’d be fine if they waited til the 11th/12th to start the runner on 2nd.

 

f*** that. There’s 162 games a year. 1458 innings played.

 

I won’t complain about free baseball but I also won’t complain about players wanting games to end quickly after 9 innings.

 

I'm fine with the ghost runner in the 10th. I'm just saying if there was enough backlash to warrant modifying it a bit, then it would be a reasonable compromise to give teams an inning before starting it. But I personally have no issues with starting it in the 10th.

[Deadpool]

Wouldn't mind Matt Beaty who just got DFA'd.

 

Wouldn't hate that at all. He's still got an option as well.

[Ray]

Wouldn't mind Matt Beaty who just got DFA'd.

 

Was thinking the exact same thing. He would be a great bench option, and has experience playing everywhere except SS, C, and CF.

 

Not sure he makes it to us in the waiver priority though, so it’ll likely have to be trade.

[Stangstag]

Wouldn't mind Matt Beaty who just got DFA'd.

 

Punchable face, but sure his skillset fits

[Grant77]

New York just lifted their vaccine mandate.

[Stangstag]

New York just lifted their vaccine mandate.

 

Lol wasn’t there an article like 2 days ago where they were saying the rule would be around for a while and they wouldn’t grant exceptions?

 

Idiots

[L54]

 

Manny is looking good

[John_Havok]

[wamco]

Especially OLD DUMN FANS, like himself.

 

Shut the f*** up ****

[jaysblue]

New York just lifted their vaccine mandate.

 

Anthony Rizzo knew what he was talking about. They knew the mandates would be lifted before the season. Everything in New York is pretty much back to normal.

[glory]

Lol wasn’t there an article like 2 days ago where they were saying the rule would be around for a while and they wouldn’t grant exceptions?

 

Idiots

 

Once the Yankees and Mets/Cohen were involved, there was no way the city was going to keep the mandate. The Nets could win a title and barely anyone in NY would care. The Yankees and Mets have way more financial and political clout in NY. Once those teams were impacted, it was only a matter of time. Judge and others likely knew that, which is why he was giving vague answers to the vaccine question.