2021 Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion Thread

[Deadpool]

[Krylian]

Yeah but it's a significant boost for any AL East team's wild card chances. Those formerly competitive teams from the other divisions will just get buried now. Like the 2021 Mariners will be 10 games back instead of tied for the WC spot in September. Oakland and Cleveland need to be a lot better to compete. etc.

 

Fair.

[Brownie19]

Can I get the Cole's Notes on why trading draft picks still isn't a thing in MLB?

[Laika]

Can I get the Cole's Notes on why trading draft picks still isn't a thing in MLB?

 

league dumb

[Brownie19]

league dumb

 

Am I the only one who finds it odd that it's not even a point of discussion at the CBA negotiations? I mean heaven forbid we try to make the transaction component of baseball more interesting.

[John_Havok]

Am I the only one who finds it odd that it's not even a point of discussion at the CBA negotiations? I mean heaven forbid we try to make the transaction component of baseball more interesting.

 

I think trading picks in MLB would be even more interesting given the nature of the slotting system, since adding picks would mean more money in your draft pool allocation. Teams could make use of that money any number of ways to make their drafts better.

[connorp]

league dumb

 

I assume the fear would be the bigger teams selling off their picks and future picks to the small market teams who wanted to keep abusing the system of living off cheap labor. Just spitballing. I know they e relaxed some things with it in recent years

[connorp]

It would also encourage tanking, letting teams compile picks

[connorp]

See Gibbers LOD team

[Jimcanuck]

It would also encourage tanking, letting teams compile picks

 

So trade the player not the pick what’s the diff really

[Brownie19]

It would also encourage tanking, letting teams compile picks

 

That would also allow teams to turn their franchises around faster....although fair point about them keeping their payrolls down.

[Laika]

I assume the fear would be the bigger teams selling off their picks and future picks to the small market teams who wanted to keep abusing the system of living off cheap labor. Just spitballing. I know they e relaxed some things with it in recent years

 

whatever the initial justifications were, the ongoing refusal to allow full draft pick trading is just weirdly paternal and incongruent with other policy decisions

[connorp]

That would also allow teams to turn their franchises around faster....although fair point about them keeping their payrolls down.

 

Yeah there’s always two sides to the coin. Not saying either way is right. But if you have a mid-market team, which happens often, that’s kind of stuck between rebuild or not, you’d encourage them to start selling off parts thinking they could do a faster rebuild. And then there’s the low payroll teams previously mentioned.

[connorp]

whatever the initial justifications were, the ongoing refusal to allow full draft pick trading is just weirdly paternal and incongruent with other policy decisions

 

Idk. Not sure there’s anything wrong with dipping the toes in the water. That’s what they’ve been doing. Next step would probably be allow it but limit the amount of picks a team can have in a certain round and such idk

[connorp]

Then you have the”Phillies LOD” scenario where a team sells off their future going for the gold. If they end up face planting, that’s not good for anyone.

 

So that’s just all a bunch of arguments for the other side. Not really saying which way is better

[Dick_Pole]

I don't think being the LA Clippers of baseball is going to do any good for the sport. Just my thought personally. Not every major North American sports league has to do everything the same as every other league. The reason trading drafts picks didn't come up is probably very simple. Neither the players nor the owners are all that interested in it.

[Deadpool]

After J.P. Ricciardi I'm super gun shy about trading draft picks. That dude would have traded like 10 years of first round picks for some second tier DH.

 

I'm all for trading FOR draft picks, I'm very much against trading away draft picks.

[Laika]

Then you have the”Phillies LOD” scenario where a team sells off their future going for the gold. If they end up face planting, that’s not good for anyone.

 

So that’s just all a bunch of arguments for the other side. Not really saying which way is better

 

They can just trade the prospects after picking them. It's not like preventing draft picks being traded forces teams to curate a pipeline of talent.

 

And the teams that want to trade all their picks probably suck at MAKING the picks anyway so maybe they would improve their MLB teams over time without being forced to make s***** draft picks.

[Dick_Pole]

Now if you trade away/for draft picks, would the slot money even come with it? Or is that negotiated separately? There are some very baseball specific circumstances where teams trading AWAY draft picks are doing to in order to hoard the best possible young talent, not give it away.

[Krylian]

Now if you trade away/for draft picks, would the slot money even come with it? Or is that negotiated separately? There are some very baseball specific circumstances where teams trading AWAY draft picks are doing to in order to hoard the best possible young talent, not give it away.

 

You'd think the slot money would have to go with it. It's pretty useless if you have a pick but no additional money to sign the player with.

[John_Havok]

Now if you trade away/for draft picks, would the slot money even come with it? Or is that negotiated separately? There are some very baseball specific circumstances where teams trading AWAY draft picks are doing to in order to hoard the best possible young talent, not give it away.

 

Remember, youd be trading the draft slot, so whatever slot bonus is allocated there would have to go with it, or there would be no point.

[BTS]

I like it.

 

Grant is going to be pist

 

https://theathletic.com/3183373/2022/03/14/mlb-players-union-discussing-restoring-extra-inning-ghost-runner-rule/

[Grant77]

I like it.

 

Grant is going to be pist

 

https://theathletic.com/3183373/2022/03/14/mlb-players-union-discussing-restoring-extra-inning-ghost-runner-rule/

 

You've got that right. This is one of the most idiotic things they have ever done. They are trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist.

[John_Havok]

You've got that right. This is one of the most idiotic things they have ever done. They are trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist.

 

THe people who make the decisions seem to disagree, especially the players playing the game. They appear to be the side driving this.

 

"The extra innings ghost runner might be sticking around in Major League Baseball, report Jayson Stark and Matt Gelb of The Athletic. Players, who “heavily support” this new feature from the last two seasons, tell the reporters they expect it to be enacted this week with the announcement of health and safety protocols.

 

Though the automatic runner on second base in extra innings was originally put in place as a COVID response, ultimately the players like it because it has mostly killed the marathon extra innings game.

 

Stark and Gelb note that the apparition may not necessarily appear in the 10th inning, but instead could surface in the 11th or 12th. With the National League adopting the designated hitter this year, baseball traditionalists are doing plenty of grumbling this week."

[Grant77]

THe people who make the decisions seem to disagree, especially the players playing the game. They appear to be the side driving this.

 

"The extra innings ghost runner might be sticking around in Major League Baseball, report Jayson Stark and Matt Gelb of The Athletic. Players, who “heavily support” this new feature from the last two seasons, tell the reporters they expect it to be enacted this week with the announcement of health and safety protocols.

 

Though the automatic runner on second base in extra innings was originally put in place as a COVID response, ultimately the players like it because it has mostly killed the marathon extra innings game.

 

Stark and Gelb note that the apparition may not necessarily appear in the 10th inning, but instead could surface in the 11th or 12th. With the National League adopting the designated hitter this year, baseball traditionalists are doing plenty of grumbling this week."

 

The players are showing an absolutely shameful level of disrespect for the game that they play and the guys that came before them. There's really no other way to spin it.

 

I'm not going at this from a purist point of view either. I support things like the universal DH and automated umpires. This, however, is akin to changing how many balls or strikes it takes to get a batter out. It fundamentally alters how the game is played.

[Brownie19]

Grant - would you have said the same thing about eliminating the takeout slide too? I think that was one of the best improvements made in my lifetime.

 

I'd be interested to know why the players just hate long extra inning games. I can't imagine they find them boring. Higher risk of injury? Throws off their schedules (planes, buses, rest time, etc.)? Is it because they don't get paid more to play more (which sounds like something a union would complain about)?

[John_Havok]

Grant - would you have said the same thing about eliminating the takeout slide too? I think that was one of the best improvements made in my lifetime.

 

I'd be interested to know why the players just hate long extra inning games. I can't imagine they find them boring. Higher risk of injury? Throws off their schedules (planes, buses, rest time, etc.)? Is it because they don't get paid more to play more (which sounds like something a union would complain about)?

 

My guess would be travel. Playing even a few extra innings when needing to fly out that night to play again the next day in another time zone would severely f*** up your internal clock.

[BTS]

Grant - would you have said the same thing about eliminating the takeout slide too? I think that was one of the best improvements made in my lifetime.

 

I'd be interested to know why the players just hate long extra inning games. I can't imagine they find them boring. Higher risk of injury? Throws off their schedules (planes, buses, rest time, etc.)? Is it because they don't get paid more to play more (which sounds like something a union would complain about)?

 

It's probably just exhausting being there. As a fan I feel drained after watching a 5+ hour marathon game. Add in all the other issues you cite and I'm not surprised the players don't like them.

[Brownie19]

It's probably just exhausting being there. As a fan I feel drained after watching a 5+ hour marathon game. Add in all the other issues you cite and I'm not surprised the players don't like them.

 

Yeah that's all fair. I don't really enjoy them as a fan myself unless it ends in the 10th, maybe the 11th - but I typically have young kids with me.

[glory]

A regular 9 inning game can take 3.5 to 4 hours to finish. Neither the players nor most fans want to see 18 inning marathons that end at 2 am with only 6 people still left in the stands. If you want to argue that they could try something different than the runner on 2nd, then fine, but the point of the ghost runner is to end the games as quickly as possible, and as long as it's only there for the regular season, then it's the right call. It's also less gimmicky than a home run derby to decide a winner, or something like that.