Fire Charlie Montoyo - The thread worked guys!

[Grant77]

Do they allow ten year extensions to managers? They should in this case.

 

Mike Scioscia got one

[WILLIEUPSHAW]

Using your best hitters to rotate through the 8 spot in order to “extend the lineup” is the new market inefficiency

 

there you go - that's why we brought in a Rays guy to help us identify and exploit that next big 'market inefficiency'

[Olerud363]

Using your best hitters to rotate through the 8 spot in order to “extend the lineup” is the new market inefficiency

 

It was a lefty on the mound and the difference between Jansen and Biggio may not be as much as it appears right now.

 

I suspect they have some analytics that Charlie is using, and analytics that uses minor league stats and batted ball data and also considers pitching type might have Jansen/Biggio vs Yarbrough closer then one would think.

 

They were planning to hit Rowdy against a righty in a high leverage situation anyway, so the third spot was really Jansen + Rowdy.

 

I agree 100% that they are probably being too clever if they are using over-fit analytics, or not clever enough if they are just throwing Jansen in the third spot based on a hunch, but it has marginal effect.

[polar bear]

Baseball is all about execution, not giving up free outs, and brain freeze decisions. Montoyo is terrible as was Gaston.

 

Correct.

[polar bear]

The only logical explanation is Biggio plowed Montoyo’s wife. I honestly can’t think of anything else that makes sense. That’s where we are at.

Have you seen his wife?

Pics please.

[BlueRocky]

 

The high performance department has dictated lineups, rest days, and BP management.

Montoyo’s been overruled and have his hands tied, why is he even there?

[Spanky99]

The high performance department has dictated lineups, rest days, and BP management.

Montoyo’s been overruled and have his hands tied, why is he even there?

 

That's a lot of conjecture there, mate. I wouldn't jump the gun on those quotes, lol.

[Olerud363]

Dude, he's worse than Gaston, think about that.

 

I don't really care if they fire Charilie or not, but I'd have to see more from him to say he's worse than Gaston. Keep in mind how Gaston treated Olerud/Green and Snider. Imagine Charlie did that with Biggio ??

 

When Biggio was struggling last year he would been in Gaston's dog house and at the very least platooned, or perhaps replaced with a modern day Ruben Sierra or Jacob Brumfield.

 

I just want to see the young hitters progress and the young pitchers keep healthy and find their roles. That's what I'm evaluating Charlie on, because I think it's the managers job to set the tone for the coaching staff.

 

If the young players progress I'd be fine with keeping Charlie until he shows he can't handle a close pennant race or playoff series. These little minor non-optimal moves mid season aren't that important, at least in my opinion.

[Stangstag]

 

The high performance department has dictated lineups, rest days, and BP management.

Montoyo’s been overruled and have his hands tied, why is he even there?

 

There’s absolutely 0 f***ing chance anyone in the front office told Montoyo to bat Biggio 8th, so im inclined to believe it was also Montoyo’s decision to bat Jansen 3rd

[Olerud363]

There’s absolutely 0 f***ing chance anyone in the front office told Montoyo to bat Biggio 8th, so im inclined to believe it was also Montoyo’s decision to bat Jansen 3rd

 

Dan and Buck hitting it on the nail...

 

Tampa has a bullpen day last night and a major league debut today... Jays score 1 run last night, 2 so far today.

 

Are they mentally prepared at the plate??

 

Vladdy takes two meatball hanging sliders right down the middle of the plate. Just randomly looking for something else?? Bad luck or wasn't prepared?

 

Trent Thorton starts on 2 days rest after a terrible performance is seen grabbing his elbow before the game ... should he of even been out there?? Would Zeuch or someone been a better choice?

 

These are the things that Charlie is in the end responsible for. Sure upper management and the analytics team has some responsibility too, but if Buck and random fans are asking these questions Charlie should be too.

 

Every plate appearnaces Charlie should be asking -- is my hitter prepared to crush meatballs and take bad pitches?? Is he prepared enough to get the most out of his ability?

 

Every pitching appearance Charlie should be asking -- is my pitcher healthy, mentally prepared and ready to rumble??

 

Sure the other coaches have important roles in this, but Charlie needs to be helping hire the right staff and ask the right questions.

[Olerud363]

Also Buck just now --

 

"Home runs are like rally killers"

 

Cito - "Don't need those base cloggers"

 

-- Despite everything I haven't yet put Charlie below Buck and Cito... needs a couple of years of sub .300 obp teams and encouraging it for me to rank him that bad.

[TheDragon]

“I’m really happy with the way we played in [st. Petersburg]. Now we are ready for Boston tomorrow. One game at a time.” - Montoyo

 

Also Montoyo:

 

[43211234]

I think the play is to make Charlie a player-manager.

 

You'll be punting a roster spot but with 28 players maybe it's doable.

 

Montoyo can be the designated bunter. In a bunting situation he can sub himself into the game and show these free-swinging kids some fundamentals!

[dineke]

Best manager in blue jays history

[BTS]

Did he forget that he had Vogelbach on the bench? There were two clear opportunities to use him in the 9th:

 

1.Panik's AB

Panik lead of the inning, and can't hit. Vogelbach could have been brought in to get on base, then been lifted for Espinal if he was successful.

 

2.McGuire's AB

Let Vogelbach hit for Reese instead of dropping a stupid sac bunt. If the game goes to the 12th, bring Jansen in to catch.

[Abomination]

Did he forget that he had Vogelbach on the bench? There were two clear opportunities to use him in the 9th:

 

1.Panik's AB

Panik lead of the inning, and can't hit. Vogelbach could have been brought in to get on base, then been lifted for Espinal if he was successful.

 

2.McGuire's AB

Let Vogelbach hit for Reese instead of dropping a stupid sac bunt. If the game goes to the 12th, bring Jansen in to catch.

 

And for Shaw.

[baubau]

Did he forget that he had Vogelbach on the bench? There were two clear opportunities to use him in the 9th:

 

1.Panik's AB

Panik lead of the inning, and can't hit. Vogelbach could have been brought in to get on base, then been lifted for Espinal if he was successful.

 

2.McGuire's AB

Let Vogelbach hit for Reese instead of dropping a stupid sac bunt. If the game goes to the 12th, bring Jansen in to catch.

 

Montoyo is the new Ned Yost. Making the dumbest f***ing decisions yet coming out with an improbable W, frustrating all our logic.

[Krylian]

Montoyo is the new Ned Yost. Making the dumbest f***ing decisions yet coming out with an improbable W, frustrating all our logic.

 

All will be forgiven if we can be the 2015 Royals.

[Spanky99]

All will be forgiven if we can be the 2015 Royals.

 

Or 92/93 Jays!

[bronson44]

[DigitalRock]

 

damn Montoyo is bad.

[max silver]

damn Montoyo is bad.

 

That's pretty f***ing terrible to not pinch hit for a bench player in the highest leverage situation of the game. It seems like he rolls coins to help make decisions or something.

[bronson44]

He consults Miss Cleo to see who will hit a home run before each game.

[glory]

I was upset at Charlie for not pinch hitting, but now that I know "he had a feeling", it changes everything.

[Deadpool]

 

Literally every player on the teem has a chance of hitting a home run. Hell, one of the 2 hits McGuire has this year was a homer.

 

Who has the better odds of hitting a homer (or getting a hit of any kind) the guy with the career 106 wRC+ or the one with a career 74 wRC+

 

"I had a feeling" is not a way to manage a baseball team.

 

Edit: s***, I thought I was exaggerating with the "2 hits" thing, but he actually only has 3 hits ALL f***ING YEAR.

[Jays24]

Damn... did that feeling also make him bat Biggio 8th and Jansen 3rd? Or how about bring in Font in countless high leverage situations?

 

Good to know he is doing some things based on his "managerial instincts" so when he keeps stinking it up, we can place the blame where it belongs.

[Slade]

[BTS]

 

Montoya

 

Jesus Christ he gets paid to to this.

[Jays24]

These type of awards just go by the win loss record without actually watching the games. Player improvement is usually attributed to the manager without even knowing whether its true.

[Dick_Pole]

Jays won a game they should have lost. Montoyo managed perfectly today.