The Jose Bautista Thread

[Brownie19]

Why?

 

Back to back ALCS appearances. Packed dome. Lots of headline makers. It's been the best two years of Blue Jays baseball in over 20 years.

 

Yeah I get that - and it's true. I just thought this was an opportunity to transition the identity from a power/hr team to a more versatile, balanced team. What happened to the "we want more speed and balance" talk we heard early in the offseason. I know it's just December, but Morales/Jose are pretty much the opposite of that.

 

 

Full disclaimer - I don't like Jose, so I'm bias.

[The Cats Ass]

Twisted please update the original post with ang's update

 

Right in the title's not good enough?

[HERPDERP]

Right in the title's not good enough?

 

a link to the actual rumor would help, I had to sift through to find out where the rumor came from

[Terminator]

Yeah I get that - and it's true. I just thought this was an opportunity to transition the identity from a power/hr team to a more versatile, balanced team. What happened to the "we want more speed and balance" talk we heard early in the offseason. I know it's just December, but Morales/Jose are pretty much the opposite of that.

 

 

Full disclaimer - I don't like Jose, so I'm bias.

 

Oh ok, you mean on-field identity. Well yeah that makes sense.

 

This team should be pretty good next year but we need two corner OFers and bullpen help. I think one of the two OFers needs to be a good player. There are two good OFers left on the market in Fowler and Bautista. I think we need one of them or someone through trade like Eaton at least. Perhaps Fowler wants too much or he just doesn't really want to come here. Perhaps Eaton costs too much. Bautista is not a bad option.

[AdamGreenwood]

I want to see Jose retire as a Blue Jay.

That alone, would probably be worth $20 million for the franchise, if they actually thought about it.

[BTS]

Full disclaimer - I don't like Jose, so I'm bias.

 

I don't really care about team identity or anything, but I feel the same way. I recognize that 3/50 is fine for the team, but I still want him to go somewhere else. I don't like Bautista the person, and I don't like watching him play the OF. I don't want him here for three more years.

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

How would they get rid of Smoak?

 

Ironic that a Genie would ask this? Lol

[Dr. Dinger]

Why?

 

Back to back ALCS appearances. Packed dome. Lots of headline makers. It's been the best two years of Blue Jays baseball in over 20 years.

 

Yep. B2B ALCS appearances and an elite offense. Why would we want to change that identity?

[Terminator]

Yep. B2B ALCS appearances and an elite offense. Why would we want to change that identity?

 

Yep. Why does everyone here hate Bautista?

[Sammy225]

Only way i would of liked to see Jose back is if he was playing first and i don't see that happening.

[Pendleton]

Assuming the $50M figure is roughly correct...

 

Year 1 ~ $18M - Bautista gets to save face and makes slightly more than the QO he turned down.

 

Year 2 Player Option worth ~ 17M - Bautista can opt to decline and chase a bigger guarantee next winter if he has a bounce back year

 

Year 3 Club Option ~ 15M or buyout for ~ 3M - If Bautista suffers through a couple injury plagued seasons, we can buy him out (total investment 38M/2 years) and save a few million.

[intentional wok]

Yep. Why does everyone here hate Bautista?

 

I think it's his general prickly demeanor and one too many confrontations. Add in the entitlement for a payday (which I don't blame) and his declining skills.

 

There are a lot of reasons.. but I kind of still love him.

[Sammy225]

Assuming the $50M figure is roughly correct...

 

Year 1 ~ $18M - Bautista gets to save face and makes slightly more than the QO he turned down.

 

Year 2 Player Option worth ~ 17M - Bautista can opt to decline and chase a bigger guarantee next winter if he has a bounce back year

 

Year 3 Club Option ~ 15M or buyout for ~ 3M - If Bautista suffers through a couple injury plagued seasons, we can buy him out (total investment 38M/2 years) and save a few million.

 

Shapiro stated he hates the idea of a player option. Said he would likely never do it.

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

Find a team who wants a warm body for 1B and will pay at least some of his salary.

 

Otherwise simply send him down to AAA, which he would probably refuse, and then release him.

 

Worst case of $4m wasted a year for 2 seasons is frustrating but isn't crippling. The waste of a spot on the 25 man squad is more important IMO.

 

Some small market team with a low budget are gonna love my Smoak/Upton package deal, 2 for 1 sign is going up!

[Brownie19]

Oh ok, you mean on-field identity. Well yeah that makes sense.

 

This team should be pretty good next year but we need two corner OFers and bullpen help. I think one of the two OFers needs to be a good player. There are two good OFers left on the market in Fowler and Bautista. I think we need one of them or someone through trade like Eaton at least. Perhaps Fowler wants too much or he just doesn't really want to come here. Perhaps Eaton costs too much. Bautista is not a bad option.

 

Enough with the logic already! F.

 

The thought of adding a LH, leadoff type, quality player who runs the bases and plays defense (Fowler or Eaton) made me very happy. Settling for Jose because Fowler doesn't want to play here, or Eaton costs too much is depressing...especially if it means a 3 year commitment for a 36 year old player.

[glory]

Assuming the $50M figure is roughly correct...

 

Year 1 ~ $18M - Bautista gets to save face and makes slightly more than the QO he turned down.

 

Year 2 Player Option worth ~ 17M - Bautista can opt to decline and chase a bigger guarantee next winter if he has a bounce back year

 

Year 3 Club Option ~ 15M or buyout for ~ 3M - If Bautista suffers through a couple injury plagued seasons, we can buy him out (total investment 38M/2 years) and save a few million.

 

Shapiro said he'd never do a player option so that won't be happening.

 

If this is true then I hope the 3rd year is a team option but I doubt it would.

[Terminator]

I think it's his general prickly demeanor and one too many confrontations. Add in the entitlement for a payday (which I don't blame) and his declining skills.

 

There are a lot of reasons.. but I kind of still love him.

 

Casuals love him. It's weird how the stat-friendly board let's their personal feelings about his personality get in the way of evaluating him.

[jaysguy44]

Ugh I'd rather just go out and get Eaton or Fowler. I really don't want Jose back

[TwistedLogic]

Yeah, I'd much rather go 4/72 for Fowler than 3/50 for Bautista.

[Sammy225]

Yeah, I'd much rather go 4/72 for Fowler than 3/50 for Bautista.

 

We need 2 outfielders maybe rogers will give us 180 lol....

[BTS]

Yep. Why does everyone here hate Bautista?

 

I can only speak for myself, but there have just been too many incidents of him acting like an arrogant POS.

 

- incessant whining about balls and strikes

- the 'someone else's mediocrity' quote

- his inability to take any of the heat off a rookie Ryan Goins for the miscommunication in game 6 of the 2015 ALCS, because he would have had to admit to a mistake he didn't make

- the stupid showboating trying to gun Delmon Young (I think) down at 1B

 

I just hate the way he carries himself, in general.

 

I think over the years I've been less emotionally invested in the Jays than a lot of you guys, so I see him in a similar way as all of the fans of other AL teams who hate him. He's a less likeable Kevin Youkilis. Now at 36, with the injury history piling up, and him turning into a statue in RF, I no longer consider him a good enough player that it makes me overlook everything I dislike about him.

[Brownie19]

Casuals love him. It's weird how the stat-friendly board let's their personal feelings about his personality get in the way of evaluating him.

 

Fair point. I guess there's a chance he's David Ortiz or a Carlos Beltran - and productive right up to the end....but chances are he's not. I'm worried we'll have to watch this team run a declining, aging, broken Jose Bautista out there at age 38 and 39 while he's a ghost of his former self.

 

Dem numbers suggest there's a good chance this happens.

[fatcowxlive]

The fan in me says "yes f***ing do this", he'll retire a Blue Jay. I think he'll have a better season than last year, just hope he DHs, Morales at 1st and Pearce in left or something. I think he'll play up to/better than the $16M next season but the 2 seasons after...

[Terminator]

I can only speak for myself, but there have just been too many incidents of him acting like an arrogant POS.

 

- incessant whining about balls and strikes

- the 'someone else's mediocrity' quote

- his inability to take any of the heat off a rookie Ryan Goins for the miscommunication in game 6 of the 2015 ALCS, because he would have had to admit to a mistake he didn't make

- the stupid showboating trying to gun Delmon Young (I think) down at 1B

 

I just hate the way he carries himself, in general.

 

I think over the years I've been less emotionally invested in the Jays than a lot of you guys, so I see him in a similar way as all of the fans of other AL teams who hate him. He's a less likeable Kevin Youkilis. Now at 36, with the injury history piling up, and him turning into a statue in RF, I no longer consider him a good enough player that it makes me overlook everything I dislike about him.

 

Those are all fine points. But you're also one of the smarter and more stat-savvy posters here so it surprises me that you care so much about how he carries himself. I get his age being a concern though.

[intentional wok]

Casuals love him. It's weird how the stat-friendly board let's their personal feelings about his personality get in the way of evaluating him.

 

I think there legit reasons to be skeptical of his performance moving forward. I thought you just meant about his character.

 

I admit he's probably the sort of personality I'd be glad to see gone if I were his co-worker. But this is judging from what we know about him, which is fairly little (though probably more than most players).

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

So much for getting all those LH hitters, and getting better defensively in the Field !

 

At this Price and years, No way Jose... It's a pass!

 

Thank you Batz!

[Governator]

I'm so neutral about Bautista, it's really odd. Probably because I was set on seeing Fowler penciled in at the top of the line up from everyone playing fantasy GM but Bautista as plan B shouldn't be a bad thing either.

 

He's a prime bounce back candidate available on another team friendly salary, we should be excited. Can someone pull down douchey rankings from fangraphs? I found him to be less douchey at the plate this year based on eye test.

[Terminator]

I think there legit reasons to be skeptical of his performance moving forward. I thought you just meant about his character.

 

I am talking about his character. People here hate it and they are letting it affect their decision on whether they would bring him back. Not much different than Dan Duquette who we all laughed at yesterday.

[BTS]

Those are all fine points. But you're also one of the smarter and more stat-savvy posters here so it surprises me that you care so much about how he carries himself. I get his age being a concern though.

 

It's still a game I watch for fun. I think it's possible to recognize that a contract is fine, and still want to pass because you watch the team 100+ times a year and just don't like watching that player. It was fine when he was early 30s monster 170 wRC+ cannon-armed Jose Bautista. But 36-year old good-but-mortal hitting noodle-armed OF statue Jose Bautista? Meh, go away.

[RealAccountant]

Fun fact. Bautista was a better hitter than Morales last year