John Gibbons Thread (+ Venting)

[BTS]

Six terrible bats in the lineup.

[FrozenRopes]

He's a lot worse at hitting, so he must be. Also gotta make sure you complain about the maximum number of mundane things to justify in your pea sized brain that Gibbons is the real problem on this team.

 

Pea sized? Care to back that up or are you another Internet idiot who mocks every person on the Internet whose opinion doesn't align with their own? Wait for it...

Edited May 21, 2015 by FrozenRopes

[FrozenRopes]

You don't sound very smart.

 

You don't watch Jays games? Your opinion doesn't matter, exit stage left.

[polar bear]

You don't sound very smart.

 

What makes you such an expert on everything?reading some of your comment,you don't

sound too smart yourself.

[Spanky99]

Hnngghhh........

[Boxcar]

What makes you such an expert on everything?reading some of your comment,you don't

sound too smart yourself.

 

UG

 

TEAM BAD

 

PLAYERS BAD

 

ME BLAME GIBBONS

 

basically

[glory]

UG

 

TEAM BAD

 

PLAYERS BAD

 

ME BLAME GIBBONS

 

basically

 

People have repeatedly brought up reasons why Gibbons has been awful.

 

Your responses are nothing but insults or blaming everyone other than Gibbons.

 

Yeah, you're not the bright one here, despite what you seem to think.

[Boxcar]

People have repeatedly brought up reasons why Gibbons has been awful.

 

Your responses are nothing but insults or blaming everyone other than Gibbons.

 

Yeah, you're not the bright one here, despite what you seem to think.

 

Everyone being the people responsible for supplying him with terrible players. My stance is that Gibbons does not meaningfully contribute to wins or losses and if I had to guess, he's probably an above average manager. Ned Yost is one of the worst in the majors but his team is doing well, would you prefer to have him?

 

And my not acting like a reactionary dipshit doesn't seem to match up with your assertion.

[BigCecil]

Everyone being the people responsible for supplying him with terrible players. My stance is that Gibbons does not meaningfully contribute to wins or losses and if I had to guess, he's probably an above average manager. Ned Yost is one of the worst in the majors but his team is doing well, would you prefer to have him?

 

And my not acting like a reactionary dipshit doesn't seem to match up with your assertion.

 

I don't want Gibbys head but how can you argue a Manager doesn't contribute to wins and losses and that its only a function of the roster and filling out a line up card?

 

Why would Showwalter, Madden etc etc make what they do if it has nothing to do with win differential?

[o2cui2i]

I don't want Gibbys head but how can you argue a Manager doesn't contribute to wins and losses and that its only a function of the roster and filling out a line up card?

 

Why would Showwalter, Madden etc etc make what they do if it has nothing to do with win differential?

 

you really need to read that again. He didn't say that NO manager makes a difference in wins. He said Gibbons doesn't make a difference.

 

Gibbons has been sent into the season with a team that was never going to make the post season. Not sure what people expected

[BigCecil]

you really need to read that again. He didn't say that NO manager makes a difference in wins. He said Gibbons doesn't make a difference.

 

Gibbons has been sent into the season with a team that was never going to make the post season. Not sure what people expected

 

meh. ok. I look at his entire body of work for us. Normally I have few issues with him but some of his pen mgm and choices this year have made a difference imo.

 

Some "experts" picked the Jays to be in the post season this year. I didn't really expect it after we lost Stro, with our pen and lack of depth.

[Spanky99]

meh. ok. I look at his entire body of work for us. Normally I have few issues with him but some of his pen mgm and choices this year have made a difference imo.

 

Some "experts" picked the Jays to be in the post season this year. I didn't really expect it after we lost Stro, with our pen and lack of depth.

 

If the Jays pitch relatively close to what they have the last several games, they will win there fair amount. You could exclude, Redmonds start(although they won) and they still didn't pitch so bad prior. Hopefully it's a sign of turning this s*** around, hopefully.

[Boxcar]

I don't want Gibbys head but how can you argue a Manager doesn't contribute to wins and losses and that its only a function of the roster and filling out a line up card?

 

Why would Showwalter, Madden etc etc make what they do if it has nothing to do with win differential?

 

Just as recently as 2011, Showalter lost 93 games as manager of the Orioles. Dude is 59 years old, do you really think he's all of a sudden figured something out? It's not like he's the Orioles long time manager, he's led 4 different teams. Here's the real shocker: when he had a good team, he won more than he lost. When he didn't, he didn't. That snark was not pointed at you btw, but I am tired of people acting like firing Gibbons is some kind of solution. All it serves is to buy AA more time to f*** the team up and leave us with yet another year of failure.

 

Joe Torre, hall of fame manager, never managed a team to 90 wins pre-Yankee dynasty. Watching him in game, he made a lot of terrible strategic decisions. Again, quality of the manager is really not important unless he's consistently benching a good player, which hardly ever happens. But Torre will get loads of undeserved credit for being there at the right place and right time.

[Spanky99]

Just as recently as 2011, Showalter lost 93 games as manager of the Orioles. Dude is 59 years old, do you really think he's all of a sudden figured something out? It's not like he's the Orioles long time manager, he's led 4 different teams. Here's the real shocker: when he had a good team, he won more than he lost. When he didn't, he didn't. That snark was not pointed at you btw, but I am tired of people acting like firing Gibbons is some kind of solution. All it serves is to buy AA more time to f*** the team up and leave us with yet another year of failure.

 

Joe Torre, hall of fame manager, never managed a team to 90 wins pre-Yankee dynasty. Watching him in game, he made a lot of terrible strategic decisions. Again, quality of the manager is really not important unless he's consistently benching a good player, which hardly ever happens. But Torre will get loads of undeserved credit for being there at the right place and right time.

 

Ala: CITO!!!!

[glory]

A bad manager makes a difference. A good manager makes a difference. Gibbons is a bad one, hence, he makes a difference. To suggest anyone can sit there and the team would be exactly the same is crazy. Would all other managers use Navarro at DH? Use Castro in every high leverage spot imaginable for the first month of the season? Pull starters at the wrong times consistently? Gibbons has been awful this year, and that's pretty much a universal opinion as opposed to previous years where people seemed to swing from his nuts like he was some sort of genius (which is f***ing insane).

 

We had the best pitching in baseball in 2008 and it took Cito taking over for the team to finish 4th in the division. Gibbons has had pitching before and completely squandered it. Dude would never get another shot in this role anywhere else and he's gotten two here. Let someone else manage. Farrell managed a team that started Jo Jo Reyes 20 times to a .500 record. If it doesn't take much to get a talented team to play well, then why not just hire anyone else rather than keep watching the same guy underachieve with an expensive roster every time he's given a chance to manage?

[BigCecil]

Just as recently as 2011, Showalter lost 93 games as manager of the Orioles. Dude is 59 years old, do you really think he's all of a sudden figured something out? It's not like he's the Orioles long time manager, he's led 4 different teams. Here's the real shocker: when he had a good team, he won more than he lost. When he didn't, he didn't. That snark was not pointed at you btw, but I am tired of people acting like firing Gibbons is some kind of solution. All it serves is to buy AA more time to f*** the team up and leave us with yet another year of failure.

 

Joe Torre, hall of fame manager, never managed a team to 90 wins pre-Yankee dynasty. Watching him in game, he made a lot of terrible strategic decisions. Again, quality of the manager is really not important unless he's consistently benching a good player, which hardly ever happens. But Torre will get loads of undeserved credit for being there at the right place and right time.

 

LOL...hey, I didn't say Showalter or Madden or Torre or Cito for that matter were great. I just pointed out they are paid extremely well because someone in a front office thought they added positively to win differential. I also believe that there is some correlation to a managers ability and win differential.

 

You seem to subscribe to the notion that they are pretty much chimps who fill out line up cards. Basically they are a wash that are either lucky as a result of a good roster or not lucky if they aren't. "Right place and right time".

[BigCecil]

If the Jays pitch relatively close to what they have the last several games, they will win there fair amount. You could exclude, Redmonds start(although they won) and they still didn't pitch so bad prior. Hopefully it's a sign of turning this s*** around, hopefully.

 

Fair. I didn't expect us to pitch THIS badly and if our SP could pitch to their career averages we probably would have 4-5 more wins by now. I have some hope its coming around. This has been a rough stretch.

[FrozenRopes]

Fair. I didn't expect us to pitch THIS badly and if our SP could pitch to their career averages we probably would have 4-5 more wins by now. I have some hope its coming around. This has been a rough stretch.

 

It is just difficult to get excited about any match up because we have no confidence in any of these guys right now, save for Sanchez.

 

Why did Pete Walker take 3 years to look at RAs 2012 campaign for a 'difference'?

 

There are obvious issues with this coaching staff that even couch coaches can see.

 

Kudos to dickey yesterday, but put 5 in a row together like you are getting paid to do.

[fmradioguy]

You seem to subscribe to the notion that they are pretty much chimps who fill out line up cards. Basically they are a wash that are either lucky as a result of a good roster or not lucky if they aren't. "Right place and right time".

 

I've always remembered a quote from Jimy Williams, former Jays manager. When he was hired, he said "Managers can't win baseball games, but they sure can lose them." The gist of it is that, if the players are all playing to their ability and skills, it doesn't matter who's managing. Because if they're all doing what they're capable of, in the roles and situations to which they're best suited, they'll get results. But it's the manager's job to know what roles and situations his players perform best in. So while he can't control what they do once they're out on the field, he can affect the team by putting them in the best position to succeed, whether it's by position on the field, in the line-up, in pitching matchups, roster management (to a lesser degree), and in handling the social management aspect of the job.

[Boxcar]

LOL...hey, I didn't say Showalter or Madden or Torre or Cito for that matter were great. I just pointed out they are paid extremely well because someone in a front office thought they added positively to win differential. I also believe that there is some correlation to a managers ability and win differential.

 

You seem to subscribe to the notion that they are pretty much chimps who fill out line up cards. Basically they are a wash that are either lucky as a result of a good roster or not lucky if they aren't. "Right place and right time".

 

I mean, I think you have to have a guy who can keep the players together and working hard, but it's not a simple case of "if we had Joe Torre, we'd be leading the East right now!"

 

I think you can have a toxic management situation that can negatively affect the team's performance. Look at Bobby Valentine with Boston, I would buy in to believing he negatively affected his team's play because all the players hated his guts. To what extent? Who knows. I'm not advocating that Gibbons is some great manager who needs to stay no matter what, my argument is that giving AA a scapegoat means another year of doing f*** all. If losing Gibbons meant AA and Beeston are gone too, I'm all for it.

 

To actually mention Cito in a positive light is a joke (referring to glory) as is citing Farrell. I'd really question whether or not you watched the games. I know John Gibbons would not drive a 6 WAR OF who hits 40 bombs per year out of town because he has a natural all fields swing and refuses to try and pull everything, or keep benching a 4-6 WAR 1B in favour of f***ing Joe Carter. I also feel like Gibbons would not peform a late innings bunt with Travis Snider in a close game to set up a situation for Mike McCoy and John McDonald.

 

Yeah, Cito had great teams in the early 90s. If you actually watched the infuriating things he did, you'd see his success is purely based on luck in managing an already great team. If you'll remember, he had a mutiny near the end of his second tenure and who knows how long the players hated him before they felt the need to do something about it.

 

Hmm, writing that makes me really glad we have Gibbons. It could be so much worse.

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

Yes and no, they are all suppose to be men and professionals too! And gibby does not control every aspect of the game!

Plus try and tell your millionaire boss what to do and see how that goes for you! Lol

[BigCecil]

I mean, I think you have to have a guy who can keep the players together and working hard, but it's not a simple case of "if we had Joe Torre, we'd be leading the East right now!"

 

I think you can have a toxic management situation that can negatively affect the team's performance. Look at Bobby Valentine with Boston, I would buy in to believing he negatively affected his team's play because all the players hated his guts. To what extent? Who knows. I'm not advocating that Gibbons is some great manager who needs to stay no matter what, my argument is that giving AA a scapegoat means another year of doing f*** all. If losing Gibbons meant AA and Beeston are gone too, I'm all for it.

 

To actually mention Cito in a positive light is a joke (referring to glory) as is citing Farrell. I'd really question whether or not you watched the games. I know John Gibbons would not drive a 6 WAR OF who hits 40 bombs per year out of town because he has a natural all fields swing and refuses to try and pull everything, or keep benching a 4-6 WAR 1B in favour of f***ing Joe Carter. I also feel like Gibbons would not peform a late innings bunt with Travis Snider in a close game to set up a situation for Mike McCoy and John McDonald.

 

Yeah, Cito had great teams in the early 90s. If you actually watched the infuriating things he did, you'd see his success is purely based on luck in managing an already great team. If you'll remember, he had a mutiny near the end of his second tenure and who knows how long the players hated him before they felt the need to do something about it.

 

Hmm, writing that makes me really glad we have Gibbons. It could be so much worse.

 

LOL. Seriously...anger management would help. Carter one of the most over rated players we have ever had.

 

WTF inferred if we had Jose Torre we would be leading the AL East now? That would be retarded.

 

I have been watching the games since day 1. My point is a simple one: 1. Managers can add to win differential and get paid for it...2. Gibby is ok ....3. This year I think he has made some bad decisions that have contributed to losses...4. we have bigger issues than Gibby.

Edited May 24, 2015 by BigCecil

[bill]

Case in point look what Maddon has done in Chicago this year. Team was terrible before this year now with maddon they are a contender. I have said it from the get go Gibbons was a weak hire regardless of the talent on the field.

[bill]

I think that relying on Dickey and Buerhle to be front of the rotation starters is insanity at their ages.

[Frenchsoup]

I think that relying on Dickey and Buerhle to be front of the rotation starters is insanity at their ages.

 

I think they were relying on Stroman and Hutch. Which is fair.

[CrackerJack]

Reyes back in the lineup ... Bautista back in the outfield ... and (most importantly) the starting pitching staying steady ... and the Jays are capable of reeling off 10 in a row with or without Gibbons.

[S33n]

#FireAA

[Spanky99]

Hnnnggggghhhhhhhh........

[Boxcar]

LOL. Seriously...anger management would help. Carter one of the most over rated players we have ever had.

 

WTF inferred if we had Jose Torre we would be leading the AL East now? That would be retarded.

 

I have been watching the games since day 1. My point is a simple one: 1. Managers can add to win differential and get paid for it...2. Gibby is ok ....3. This year I think he has made some bad decisions that have contributed to losses...4. we have bigger issues than Gibby.

 

wat

[BigBounceyBlueBalls]

Case in point look what Maddon has done in Chicago this year. Team was terrible before this year now with maddon they are a contender. I have said it from the get go Gibbons was a weak hire regardless of the talent on the field.

 

Young studs maturing had nothing to do with it!